Just want to clarify... irresponsible, disrespectful, abusive, freeloading, narcissistic, belittling, immature, insecure, controlling, obnoxious men are not the kind of "bad boy" smart, mature women like us are attracted to. Right girls?

(see Mad Max reference)

ABSOLUTELY RIGHT! (See Mad Mardigan picture on my page, hee,hee)

People find the bad boy/girl thing familiar. If you treat them well it doesnt feel right so they mess it up. They have esteem issues and unfortunately always search for this type of person because they feel that is what they deserve.

Uh, LaBelle, please clarify!

Try a woman your own age or older. It seems like it takes a few years for some of us to grow up and appreciate a "nice guy". Wisdom comes with age.

Wantaforever, reread BayBrat's response. We don't have a thing against nice guys. You're missing the point here.

I'm not so sure that those claiming to like the "bad boys" are truly attracted to the type of "bad boys" that Kevin is referring to. I believe that Kevin is referring to the cocky, manipulative, player types that get women by the arm load, treat them nicely until they bang 'em, then treat them like crap and discard them once they get what they want.

I see the type that BayBrat is referring to as a man that is strong and confident. Nice guys can be strong and confident ... bay boys represent themselves this way to get what they want but are typically insecure and show this by being controlling, disrepsectful, abusive, etc.

I identify myself as a nice guy and I would never treat a woman with disrespect. It can be difficult for a classic "nice guy" to be as aggressive as the "bad boys" because we tend to associate that behavior with being a jerk.

I guess a woman may be able to relate to this by not behaving in a slutty fashion so as not be be associated as being a slut yourself.

I think one problem is, many of us guys are still sometimes attracted to the not smart, immature, insecure, controlling, narcissistic, obnoxious women because they have a nice smile and cute butt.

I can't agree with your last sentence, WANTAFOREVERHUG. It's amazing how many people are as short-sighted and stupid in their waning years as they were in high school. I'm amazed at the number of men and women who continue to follow the same destructive patterns in their relationships time after time, and how little they in fact learn. Prima facie evidence, among other things, being the failure rate of second and third marriages.

I hate to say it guys, but this has been my experience as well. I'm also a really nice guy that usually thinks of others and their feelings as well. Anytime I've tried to get close to someone and they see I'm a "nice" guy they only want to be friends as well. If all of you are saying that isn't what your expecting in a guy, then why are som many women out there like that? My "friend" that I really like did the same thing to me. She wanted to pursure things with me, but as soon as I try to be myself and stay nice to her she runs away. Now, she's ran back to the dude that treated her like total crap. What's up with that? My stbx is the same way. I'd treat her nice and respectful and that got me nowhere. The only time I really got her attention or respect was when I'd get upset about something and take on the "bad boy" roll. Then, I'd get a little something from her.

I'm sick of trying to be myself to only be shot down by the women I'm attracted to. I think the old saying, "Nice guys finish last" really is a true statement.

Well, I am just talking about myself and my friends over 40, who are finally seeing the light, see our mistakes, know who we are now, and are just looking for a nice guy. I am sure there are some people who never learn just like there are younger women who are mature for their age.

There are obviously two types of men that we seem to be confusing here... the hot "bad boy" that Cerridwen and I are talking about... and the abusive jerk. Maybe there are women that mistakenly believe they're getting the first one and end up with the second one. Or maybe they have a certain self-destructive streak that causes them to seek out an abusive jerk. No self respecting woman would choose to be with an abusive man. And, the truth is, some of the most abusive pretend to be the nicest guys on the planet. Everyone thinks my STBX is one of the nicest, kindest, most polite, considerate men they've ever met. But behind closed doors, he's controlling, manipulative, and belittling. Now... who's the real "bad boy"?

My STBX has everyone fooled too. Everyone describes him as such a "great guy". They all say ,how lucky I am to have him.
He's good at superficial relationships. At home he's cold, unavailable,secretive,disrespectful,selfish,mean,&uncaring. I guess he is in the jerk catagory.

Thanks Bay for clearing that up. I know, because of the way men are fashioned, they like the chase. Well, women are basically the same way. We like some, oh, what's the word? Mystery! That's it! I love when a man opens my door, pulls my chair out for me, allows me to order first in a restaurant, and lights my cigarette. I don't like an obnoxious ass that thinks he's all that, and those other negatives Bay was talking about.

A man can be too nice, always catering, with no mystery (that's not the word I'm looking for here), which is just BORING! I like a man that gives me a challenge, and I believe most women do too. It's a tightrope act, or so it seems. Men, when you start dating someone, just ask us and we will fill you in. An example would be great here! Don't be afraid of us that like the 'bad boy' image. We really have tender, giving and loving hearts.

I've been wanting to comment on this for awhile but didn't quite know what to say...My problem has always been that i want the nice guys soooooo much that i fall for the guys that "play" the nice guy part....then show their true colors....it' really hard to figure out who's wearing the mask and who is the real deal! Hope that makes some sort of sense...

NICE GUYS ARE THE ONLY TRUE MEN OUT THERE...THE OTHERS ARE JUST 12 BOYS WHO REFUSE TO GROW UP!!....