Kevin,
In my personal opinion the "friend zone" is where a nice guy would stand a chance with me. I'm so NOT going for the "bad boy" *gagggggssss* The guy friend that stuck by me thru good times and bad and was patient until I was ready for more would be my 1st choice to take things further. The bad boy wouldn't stand a flippin chance cuz I would expect him to Run at the 1st sign of a mood swing LOL. Hang in there, it's the nice guys that are missing from the dating scene because they are the pick of the crop.

can't wait to see how this one plays out...

I agree with the bad boy thing. I think there's another level to this and it applies to both sexes. I think we have a desire to pursue. Once we've got something, we take it for granted. Once we lose it, or risk losing it, we're more apt to kick into high gear and start the chase again. I've seen myself do it in 3 different marriages, I've seen women chase me and chase me up until I give in, then be done with me. Not everyone is like that but there are a lot that are.

Just my opinion.

I do think there is such a think as being 'too nice'. To a point where a woman can feel like she doesn't even know who you really are because you are so darn nice that it is nearly impossible to have a normal conversation for fear of upsetting your spouse. Ok..so I may be venting on my own situation...but I guess with a bad boy you know what is going on. He's bad..end of story. With the too nice guy who really ever knows.

I do think there is such a think as being 'too nice'. To a point where a woman can feel like she doesn't even know who you really are because you are so darn nice that it is nearly impossible to have a normal conversation for fear of upsetting your spouse. Ok..so I may be venting on my own situation...but I guess with a bad boy you know what is going on. He's bad..end of story. With the too nice guy who really ever knows.

I'm gonna enjoy this thread. I'll state for the record many women, in my experience, like the livin on the edge experience of the bad boys. It's a thrill, and a challenge. Feels like they're alive and living life. When it inevitable falls apart it is confusing and painful.

I've enjoyed the thrill of the hunt many years ago and the ladies that put up the difficult conquest held my attention. And when it "panned out" it was a thrill a minute.

Upon retrospect it was foolish and immature, and always ended badly. I've broken hearts and had my heart broken. So I thought. Nothing compares to a mutually commited relationship. Where its better to love and lost than never to have loved at all. Risk, reward. They go hand in hand. But I still believe love can conquer all!

Okay so like here it is straight up. there are only three types of men

a) your relatives
b) your potential mates
c) your friends

If you fall into the friend category ,sorry but I am just not attracted to you that way and never could be.

If you fall into the potential mate category, we both feel abit of attraction and sexual tension but either do nothing about it or flirt alittle.

So forget this bad boy stuff, that is tv land. In the real world that is how it works. it may be subtle or direct. YOu need to figure out what we as women are saying......

So if you dig a chick and you are not getting anything back.. ask her outright if she is attracted to you or what type of men she is attracted to..

from experience, most women will tell you up front.

My best friend bonnie and I go bar hopping. she only dates black men and I will not date a black man. I am just not interested in black men or frankly blond men either. I prefer the dark italian, porteguese, latino looking men.... simply fact.. I can't change it.....

so there you have it straight up.. Right girls?

I have never understood someone having the 'bad boy' fixation. I can not for the life of me understand why someone like Heather Locklear would have chosen 2 bad boy rock star type guys (YUCK!). I would love to find a good guy. I thought I HAD found one and was very sad to discover he was just acting to 'get' me. Maybe you're just looking for the wrong kind of girl!

Here's the thing about "bad boys" at least for me. When I was much younger and dating, that's what I dated. I wasn't looking for a relationship, I was looking for a good time, and the bad boys are better suited for that. When I first met my husband I wasn't interested in him...I was still going out for a good time, but eventually he wore me down and we got married.

We are currently reconciled, but I have to say if I were dating again, there is no way I would want a bad boy. I have children and I am far more mature...I would want to date a man I could have a relationship with. Never had one of those with the bad boys!

Since I have been with my husband since high school I don't have a ton of dating experience. I have never been atrracted to the bad boy type. I want a good, down to earth, loving man who respects me his family and the law. I think you will find most woman want this and your bad boy theory is just a myth.

By the way, if anyone treats me like shit, disrespects me in any way or plays games there is no chance I will be interested in him.

There are nice guys and there are guys that are milk toast. I want a nice guy, not some guy who agrees to everything or who can't make a decision. I want a nice guy, but I also want a strong guy. If you keep finding women who like the bad boy then maybe that is the type of woman you are seeking. They have issues that you do not need to deal with, move on...

I for one have never been attracted to the "bad boy" I've always wanted the nice guy. The one that has good manners, has self esteem but isn't cocky...but I don't want a push over either. But I do understand where you are coming from in a sense... I myself have always ended up as the friend because I'm such a tomboy. Guys love to hang out with me because I'll watch sports with them(and actually know what's going on), they can take me fishing, riding 4-wheelers...ya know guy stuff but I never get the chance to show them I can be a girlfriend as well...it sucks but it's life. The right girl is out there, you just have to make sure you are looking in all the right places for the all the right types of girls.

OK...these have been interesting, but I'm looking forward to more responses today! I haven't dated in more than 12 years and I know I am a different person, I'm NOT a pushover or too nice. I do make decisions, and obviously have grown tremendously in the past 12-13 years! I guess partially I'm looking for confirmation that there is hope for a nice guy out there...so keep the responses coming!!

Many times I say the the old saying "Nice Guys finish last" I too clasify myself as a nice guy. Treat a woman with respect, do not play games, take care of the ones I love.
But many women I have had contact with just want my money or to be taken care of. We nice guys want to be taken care of too sometimes. You think you have found the right woman, I did, and then when a major problems comes up and she turns on you instead of trying to work it out. "Nice Guys Finish Last"

I think a lot of times the so-called 'bad boys' come out with the woman because they are more aggressive in their approach. I am fairly shy and I find that most of the men who are aggressive enough to approach me and follow through are the bad boy type. It is not that I am not interested in the nice guys but they often give up because I am shy and they interpret that to mean that I am not interested. I am very aggressive and business-like at work all day and in my personal time I want to be the girl and have a partner who is masculine. BUT, just because I want a man who acts like a man does not mean I want someone who is cruel or mean. I would love to find that perfect mix of masculinity and kindness. I am sure he is out there somewhere.

I am not going for a bad boy, I made that mistake the first time. So, there is hope out for you that some woman (me included) want the nice guy!