Do you think we humans are in control of our anger or we have that ability?

Without a doubt, in my mind, anger and repressed anger are all a part of PTSD.

When trauma occurred, you were rendered powerless...and anger had to be repressed to avoid further abuse. With multiple abuses came multiple occasions of repressing anger.

Where did it go? It went into your flesh...

Paws you are confusing me.

Are you saying that repressed anger is a different anger?

And you did not address my question if we are in control of our anger?

I agree it is part of PTSD. I relive many old episodes again and again like bad re-runs of a bad soap opera - but it's much more painful than that. After 11 years sober in AA and heaps of therapy and sexual abuse counselling, and other searching I am a lot better than was in the past.but yes, I still hold a lot of anger and the panic attacks are all there.

My real gripe is that the terrible childhood I has, has has REAL implications for the trajectory of my life. I have Bipolar Disorder, Panic and Anxiety Disorders, PTSD. I have losy everything in my life as a result of all this - it's like the horrific upbringing planted "emotional time bombs" in me so that no matter how hard I worked to get tertiary study, a fantastic career, a home of my own (all this very rare in my family and well above expectations) all that is lost and much more. So yes, I am very angry.

And of course the panic attacks come as natural part of PTSD and are triggered just by mormal life events and daily struggles, but even when I hear a loud male voice in the street when I am out shopping. And then two weeks ago I had a terrible episode with a blind drunk cousin at my property - and well, that's an obvious trigger for PTSD.

So how would explain someone else similar to you who has no anger and it at peace and enjoys life?

I wouldn't go so far as to say that repressed anger is a different form of anger...but, it's nature is covert and not overt.

Anger in the light of day is identifiable symptomatically, however; the symptoms of repressed anger arrive in oftentimes somatic form. It's the migraines, the panic attacks, the irritability, the stomach trouble, fibromyalgia, chronic fatigue syndrome, and...I think...mood disorders.

Picture holding a can of green beans in your hand...out to your side. Nothing to it, eh? Continue...and in a few minutes...or less...your arm gets tired of carrying the can of beans.

Let's say that someone has threatened you with physical harm if you let your arm (or your guard) down. You are tasked with this otherwise easy task in the beginning...but, now, the arm is beginning to hurt to the point of pain.

Let's say another can of beans is placed in your elevated hand. The burden gets to be more painful because it's not the design of your muscles to carry that kind of tension...albeit small...for that long a period of time. Clearly, this is abuse of your arm...

The sense of relief you will feel, when you can put down your arm, will be magnificent...and pain will still persist afterward.

Anger is like drinking poison and hoping the other person dies.

Anger is something that needs to be gotten rid of...post haste. If it's carried, via repression, other problems are going to arise.

The depth of our repressed anger is only as deep as the memories we can and the memories we cannot recall...because the repressed anger (and pain) is below the waterline of the iceberg.

The body forgets nothing...I contend.

The only force that gives us a perception of control is the body's way of being able to repress pain, grief, fear, and anger. When life events occur, such as menopause...or a death in the family...or an injury or severe illness...the scales can tip and we can find ourselves on a slippery slope.

Persons with addictions came to the conclusion that their repressive mechanisms were insufficient to work effectively to quell their pain...and they enlisted the "help" of these substances or behaviors.

Many have been through worse trauma than others...and not everyone is gifted with the high tolerance to pain.

But, society will judge individuals...being devoid of any facts, let alone compassion, for those who hurt....who do not continuously bear their pain...in silence and "dignity".

Definitely the body also stores trauma but most is stored in the amygdala in conjunction with the hippo campus.

Peter Levine did research on this kind of trauma in prey animals.

So if anger is not that much different whether stored in the body or memories then it can be integrated either way?

I guess I agree with what your saying on content.

I still go back to my premise number one you can control your anger for the most part.

I will say that for me the more I healed my PTSD the less anger that reared its ugly head. If I have anger now it is usually not displayed but dealt with in the space I have created meditating. I decide if I will express my anger.

Yes, Tigerpaws, I totally agree about the anger turning inward on our bodies. I have terrible sleep problems. chronic IBS and chronic neck and back pain. As a woman, I don't usually express my anger outward (although I may have when I was drinking, but that's long past and it wouldn't have been a productive or civilised anger anyway), so it really does turn inward. And this is even with me being in intensive therapy where I vent, vent and vent in a safe environment, as well as 11 years of AA venting and expressing my anger in a productive environment too. I guess that's a marker of how much negative has gone IN during my life that I couldn't control and the hard battle over time as an adult to keep putting the positive inputs in (see Plastic Brain Theory). Neuronal pathways laid down in childhood can be "re-engineered" as adults, but it's a lot harder for the less plastic brain of an adult to change, no matter how hard the work we put in.

I agree with Tigerpaws that "The body forgets nothing."

FIC, I have a lot of anger, too, and I know that when I express it, I feel better. I usually do it as I am exercising. For example, when I was swimming yesterday, I kept saying, in rhythm with my strokes, "You ruined my childhood! You ruined my childhood!" At first, I was saying "Your ruined my life," but that isn't true, because I am working on healing.

Anyway, I found that getting out the anger was painful, and I was even crying a lot later in the day. But, this does end up healing me. Afterward, I feel so much lighter and I feel more gentle with myself.

so from these posts I believe that the consensus is that the body does not forget the trauma and memories.

And the consensus is that saying things like you have ruined my life is helpful.

How does that handle anger. By saying it you give it energy electricity and valuable time in your conscious mind. I think the more you say it the more it grows and has an effect on you.

I can not disagree more with this statement though.

My real gripe is that the terrible childhood I has, has has REAL implications for the trajectory of my life

I have lived your life without the bi polar.

My trauma has made me who I am and has no negative effect on me now.

It has been the biggest challenge and opportunity in my life. It has made me strong and appreciate living and enjoying life with my trauma.

How can I have a terrible childhood, violent, abusing and extremely critical to survive without anger at all for my childhood or life.

I am responsible for my life my childhood and my happiness.

This could be why you are so miserable.

I have lousy everything in my life as a result of all this - it's like the horrific upbringing

That is over with and has been over with. Mine has no effect on me but positive. It depends if you want to blame others or be responsible and tack stock and do the best you can do.

Resentment fuels anger and hopelessness.

Resentment is kindling anger and hopelessness is the key to change.

Here again, the transferrance of responsibility toward the source of trauma is a necessity in my mind.

Self blame (via self shame and self punishment by depression) is the hallmark of not properly allaying blame on the correct parties.

In fact, one form of therapy is one whereby memories are brought forth...in as much detail as possible (including emotion...which is not one bit diminished by the years, by the way) and a "new ending" is written into the mind of the patient.

You see, for many, there is no one who can be brought to accountability for their crimes and their sins against someone.

Many perpetrators have died or they run away...completely denying anything ever happened. This, in particular, happens in family structures...because families, for many abusers, are their fortress. They absolve themselves of personal, individual responsibility and hide within the families "dirty little secrets".

But, with guided imagery, a new chapter can be written...when sufficient processing of painful emotion has occurred...so as to not undermine the therapeutic process that's been, perhaps, only partially accomplished.

This, in my mind, is another step in personal integration of pain and misery...in such a way that can become satisfied and quieted.

Tigerpaws, have you tried the "different ending" technique? I think I might try it.

Yes, I have...and it's effective.

In fact, I've found that by doing it in journaling...and sometimes vocally in the car on the way to and from work (great time to process trauma...know what I mean?)...that I envision or write the story from a third person perspective...at first...then "meld" my reality into the written reality.

As an example: I will envision one of my belt beatings...and write a storyline whereby my father came and apologized and hugged me...this is difficult...because I know it never happened...but my emotions can make allowance for restoration to my father...because seeing it happen...in my minds eye...conjures up pain...and yet...I can nearly feel the elation of seeing my father and his son united.

This is very emotionally evoking...

Can I convey a story (fantasy) here? Maybe not the most appropriate place...

OK, Tigerpaws. Thanks for the example.

I have actually done something similar, on my own. I think I will go back to trying that, especially now that you say it has helped you.

For me, I realize that feeling the feelings helps, but then also, knowing that someone is there to comfort me is what really helps. So, maybe if I change the story and make it so that it is NOT a hurtful thing, that will help.

Good idea!

Something I had never thought of before, yet I find a wonderful and fascinating idea, is to journal with your non-dominant hand.

A good, good friend of mine here on DS has a therapist who's suggested she do this...and she say's it's dynamic. I'm yet to try it...but I'm looking forward to the emotion it may evoke.

Perhaps I can write a new ending to a number of memories in my mind.

These techniques are used to "append" history...I see them as another opportunity to evoke the emotions that were repressed.

You know, anger is a primary tool that is used...like a sledge hammer...to drive away and drive down pain.

But, pain is like a pack of wolves and you'll eventually get tired of wielding a sledge hammer and the wolves eventually get to you.

Anger is not the proper tool for handling trauma. Anger is the underpinning of shame, in my opinion.