ImDealing, I tried to stay out of it. I even apologized for participating in a way that encouraged continuation. I guess I can't hold back forever any better than the next person. How exactly does one stand by and observe a debate about their own character without getting involved?

Anyway, I also thought about making a new room specifically for the purpose to duking it out. I'm not sure I have the energy for any more anyhow but if I do I will post a link and get this shit out of everyones way.

I really didn't come here to cause trouble and I don't want to spoil things for others.

I hear ya Im. No more of that for me.

wow...kinda glad I haven't been around much lately. Sucks to hear that is happening on this forum. I used to enjoy coming here for help and to see if I could help anyone else going through this difficult ordeal. Kinda sounds like some people aren't ready to deal with a different point of view. I can understand that, given the situation that some have been put through, but I always found it helpful to hear from a cheating spouse or OP because it kind of gives you some insight into just what happened. Maybe even signs or red flags to look for in future situations/relationships. Either way, I wish people would consider the feelings of others before they go off on someone. We're all here because infidelity has become a part of our lives...let's try to think about the feelings of others before we respond to a post.

Just a quick point regarding "fights over the definitions of word (i.e. "naive")". I think again this is a matter of perception. For me, in a fight, I feel angry and defensive. I can't speak for Lisa, but I wasn't angry about our differences in how we defined or used naive. We misunderstood each other somewhat intially and by discussing our intention and our definitions of the word we each came to better understand what the other was getting at. Some people will look at that as quibbling over a definition. I see it as reaching an understanding. Even if we did not agree, in the end at least we understood each other. If it's uncomfortable for others to observe that exchange I find it unfortunate. Watching others work things through to a peacful resolution can be a great learning experience.

not sure what happened there...

I said just put my picture next to a dead horse!

(disclaimer) please know this is a joke and nothing more!!

I love you,
You love me,
We're a happy fa-mi-ly.....

*picturing a big, dancing purple dinosaur*

Resolution is my favorite stuff. I remember when I was a kid having huge family blowouts. My Dad, a Libra, all about balance and justice, would keep us talking until whatever the issue was resolved. We'd be up, all six of us, into the night, crying, exhausted, but talking it out until we were all ready to hug and make up. I never learned to let it go. I learned to hang on to all the pieces and keep gluing bits back together until what had been broken was fixed.

It serves me better in some settings than in others, I suppose.

Glad you posted this, Imdealing. I have been watching this all degrade itself and have not been happy to see it either.

Because it's all bullshit.

(Don't be all shocked - you know me. Yup, I said it.)

I have said this on another thread and I'll say it again. I have been here since 2008 and have never seen this shit here before. It's like the entire culture has been offset. I would just like it all to go back to normal.

Because watching this all happen really pisses me off.

The personal attacks. The 'this is how you should conduct yourself.' The 'this is how you should feel'...it's all crap.

Because, for this journey in infidelity, we are all in our own places and have come there on our own. Those individual journeys need to be respected. They WERE being respected. And NOW? They are not.

I am so close to throwing in the hat.

You raise the point of the CA and BU and D rooms. I did try there and it just was not for me.

Because we have a sense of family here. I'll be damned if we lose that.

It's like this...grab some coffee and hear me out here...this is one I have for you...

My sister (passed away) used to do day care. So she could be home with her own kids. She did babysitting for me for my three kids. She ran a pretty tight ship with all those kids and she used to say, 'I love this but I know that all it takes is one bad apple and then it's all hell.' Well, she started having some problems with those kids. With the day to day balance of it all. Finally, she said to me, 'You know that one bad apple policy I have? Well, its' your son (he's 21 now, but at the time, he was 4 or 5) and he likes to hit.' I was floored, because I had never seen him do this. 'My son is HITTING?' She said, 'yes.'

Well, I walked outside to where all the kids were playing together. It had all been good and now it wasnt'. I looked at my nephew, who was a big kid, an older kid, and I said, 'So my son is hitting you?' He put down his head and said 'yeah.' I said, 'from now on, hit him back. HIt him hard. For every time he hits you, hit him back.'

My son was shocked! He starts whining, 'MOM!!!! NO!!!'

I said, 'You know better. I won't settle for less from you. If you want to hit, be ready to get hit back and hard...or you can go back to being better than this...and see that when you are here, and anywhere, you cannot be like that. Go ahead and hit someone now.'

He didn't hit anymore.

The point of sending people to a room to duke it out? (coming full circle here) We never needed that. Since when did we need that? Never in my time here.

I don't vote for that. I say we go back to respecting eachother and supporting eachother and conducting ourselves as we have.

I, Lstecker, do promise to be nice, in my post, but I am really getting sick of this.

Thanks for addressing this, Imdealing. I value it that you are noticing this too, taking note of it.

L~

L, you are still my hero. :-) Duking it out until you are exhausted is indeed very effective. You eventually come to a point where you say, what is to be gained by continuing? I also agree that EVERYONE should agree to start a separate thread saying something like: DUKING IT OUT: and then name the thread. Thise who feel they have soething to contribute should go there and let the other one die.
I dont agree with fighting, but if it becomes necessary to some, have enough respect for the others to take it outside! AYE

hopefully all can see I have left off on those threads(including the one i started) that are so controversial.

I know much of the drama has nothing to do with me, but for my part i recognize the damage i did and dont intend to go there again.

I hope that most of u can forgive my transgressions as i attempt to not make the same ones again

always sending love and support

Cantbe, you are my hero too!

Notsure, shit happens. We learn from it and then move on. We will get back to normal here because we will not settle for less than what we have established here amongst all of us - and US includes YOU!

Take care of you, K?

L~

I would just LOVE to see us get back to what we all came here for, support.

If anything I said ON THE BOARD was harmful, for that I apologize. The only thing I wish to see is us use this to be what it has always been, for support.

When a person comes on this board which is SO PUBLIC and takes away from it a feeling of being violated in such a public way, then that is NOT what should EVER happen.

Not from me, or anyone else. Feel what you want, have whatever opinion that you want, and say what you want, but when you are saying something that is harmful to another and hurtful to them, then it has crossed a line. If you need to vent, do it on your personal journals. That is what they are for! Not the board. I am not claiming that I am innocent or this at all. I am only stating what is fair to ALL of the people on here since I have no doubt that many dont need to be privy to the background private issues that are happening. It takes away the validity of what this board is.

Maybe I am just full of shit!! I dont even know anymore. I just know if I was an outsider and came to this board for some understanding and support. I might think it is full of some crazy people (myself included)

It comes down to judging. None of us would want someone to do to us, yet for some reason, that same person has no problem doing it to another.We are all here for the same reason and have our own pain and stress. I for one have had a horrible week and yet I got berated and told I wasnt a good enough friend because I didnt jump into the melee and defend them. I do not have the strength to fight someone elses battle for them . Is that what we came here for? I sure didnt.

I didnt come her to be judged for my ability to argue. I came here to talk to others about my pain and offer a shoulder when someone else needed one. Thats what I will continue to do and I hope I have made a difference to SOMEBODY. Many of you have been wonderful and your advice and perspectives have been enlightening. Lets run like hell when we see conflict and only particiapte in conversations where there is something to be gained. Enough of the stupid arguements.

conflict is natural. it's only negative when it goes unresolved.