@ Jakey...I knew you'd get it.


Friday....good point but, I think that this 'friend' of Rman....the family dynamic might be too dysfunctional and the existence might be withdrawn and toxic for the little sponges....

but, it IS about a complete life, not just the parental part. children need to see adults who are showing by example how to have happy well-rounded adult lives.

for a few decades now, american family society has revolved around children instead of adults. it is not supposed to be this way. this style goes against thousands of years of time-honored tradition.

Friday- while I get your point of sacrifice for your children......I also think that there is a huge level of responsibility to be a good role model for them as well.
Personally, I don't want my kids seeing me "settle" for less than I deserve......an empty marriage. Sponges that they are, that lesson would certainly be passed onto them. I would much rather them see that you can do anything with your life and that life is much to precious to be miserable....... Just my 2 cents.......
Now.....if I could just find my big girl panties and get my ass moving in the direction that I speak of.......

Ummm....

IF MY PARENTS were to SACRIFICE, they should have worked on the marriage. I heard too often remarks like: "if it wasn't for the kids, I'd be gone", "I sacrificed my life and stayed with your father for your own good".....UMMMM THANKS?

IF MY PARENTS had actually WORKED on the marriage, they MIGHT have payed attention to the PEDOPHILES taking me but....they were too consumed in their misery and didn't see the suffering of their 3 year old little girl with red slippers....UMMM IT DID NOT HAPPEN....

My children never had to suffer nor have been invisible to their woes by me. Loving vigilance were enforce.

YET, I still believe in the sanctity of the matrimony.....regardless. I hope my daughter will marry SOMEDAY in the far away future *smirk* and make it work with love, effort, resilience....I have no doubt that she will do her best but, it takes two.

My marriage got to the point my oldest son told me I should divorce his father. He said he was never home and when he was, he treated me like shit. Should it ever get to that point? NO. I know why I thought I was staying (my daughter's health), and I'm starting to see some patterns with him that may have also contributed to my staying, but I DO regret staying as long as I did..

What exactly are you 'doing for the kids'? You may be keeping a traditional-looking family on the outside, but inside those walls you are teaching them dysfunction. I did that, too, and I own it when I talk to my kids about it. They watched me accept disgusting behavior. That's a crappy lesson. A lesson I'm now working at un-doing, even though I'm not sure it's possible..

Z - Yeah...I believe Rman's friend's dynamic is different. If they're both not there I see not staying for the kids as that could be toxic.

Lkess - Very good point in the "settling"...maybe that's why I am where I am today. Maybe I settled...bc I saw my parents settle. Maybe this divorce will break the "settling" trend in my girls. It's a good point. Just hard bc of the memories that I have with my parents and as I said there were A LOT of good memories. And for my case....there were A LOT of good memories and I'm pretty sure we would have had more to come...but it's not the hand that was dealt..so I need to make the best of it for me and my girls.

Okay...now my rant is over...*promise*

HC - I see that point. All marriages and divorces are different. In your case for sure especially if your son has said something like that to you. I see there is no reason to "sacrifice" for the kids. I was just speaking of where the marriage is "ok"...and it's not a pattern of behavior. Where it's it's natural course of ups and downs. I just feel in my case it's a down and my stbx is cutting and running...it seems like that's what she does when it's down as oppose to working on things. For the mere fact that when we went to marriage counseling at one point the couneslor had said our issues were very easily fixable....yes it was fixed, but we're back to where we started and didn't learn our lesson I guess. I don't know.

Jaken - Again, I couldn't agree more. I know I'm "old school" in thought. But I'm so with you in terms of putting my children first...I think that I am...and I think that's the right thing. My parents sacrificed so much for me. They moved to where they move so I can have a better life and be in better schools. They worked they're butts off so I/We can travel and I can experience different cultures...they worked their butt off so I could go to College loan free and not have to get a job in College so I could concentrate on school. In return, they have a forever greatful son. When my buddies were all going on Spring Break...I never asked my parents...hey my friends are going to Cancun and I want to go. So their reward is a good son that was in my eyes I believed raised properly. I'm a good person with good morals and values with a successful career. And up until a few months ago "had" a beautiful and happy family. And I was taking the task of ok...my parent's did their part in raising me and working their butts off for me...now it's my turn for my girls. My life philosophy is "this generation" moves forward. My parents provided to me opportunities that they never had and now it was my turn to do the same for my girls....and I had a lot of opportunities and now my girls were going to reap the benefit of my parents providing for me...like I was and still will (but will be a lot harder) for them.

I think you have to hit that barrier standing in your way...either smash it to pieces or climb over it...That's your battle - Once you get past it, it should be easy sailing...
Good luck to your friend RMAN

What happens when you are paralyzed by fear? Last night, for the first time, I overheard his conversation with his "so called friend". They exchanged I love you's. My first reaction was rage. I got in my car and left. I felt like I couldn't breath. I needed to get out. Now I realize that I have to get out of this situation. My kids want me to and the lawyer gave me my orders. But I sit here totally in fear of taking the next step. How do I get up and get started?

Thank you.