Greetings Emo. Welcome to DS. Sorry for what brings you here but glad you are here.

Yup, I've been in a similar situation. I came very close to divorcing over it in the early 90's. Fixing the problems has often felt like touring Dante's 7 circles of hell, but we've come far enough that I'm glad I kept him. Leaning freely on the friends in my peer support network might have been the most important ingredient in that miracle.

Hope you find some of that kind of support here, Emo. Welcome aboard. For what it's worth, I find on-line support valuable, but live support groups can be valuable, as well. Sometimes a body needs a flesh and blood shoulder to lean on.

Hi Alfie!
Thank you for your reply! Was your husband open to change? How did you do it?? My husband is so closed off from me. I soon as I want to have a serious conversation he gets annoyed. He tells me “sure, I’ll try being nicer.” He’s been saying that for 12 years and the longest he’s going being “nice” was 3 months. He also flat out refuses to get help or counseling of any kind. I just don’t know if I can make our marriage work by myself!!

Sorry, I meant to say arfie but my autocorrect keeps trying to change it!

I didn't even notice the typo until after you pointed it out. No problem in my book. I don't take my given names very seriously, much less my on-line handles.

Yes, my husband was open to change, some days more than others, but defining the ^it^ in need of changing was/is a HUGE challenge for us. The perception/exposure gap between a family bread-winner and a domestic manager are enough to remind me that speaking the same language is no guarantee of communication. For sure we often attempt harmonies from entirely different books of music. We often are not even in the same library. How many ways can you define, ^it^ before you *just* let ^it^ go*? Perhaps our greatest breakthrough was learning how to define ^it^ before we set about changing and/or fighting over ^it^.

We still haven't done couples counseling. We each work on our strictly personal pieces of the puzzle and coordinate our respective positions over morning coffee. When coordination is proving too difficult to be worth the effort, we treat one another like roommates. I spend allot of time in peer support group meetings during those periods. So far as I know, Hubs just works harder on his strictly personal career development.

But I think the most important part is patience and trust. It's okay if it takes a lifetime to work out a life-long relationship. Even on the days I can only trust him to hurt me, I still work to trust that our eyes are on the same prize.

In a relationship where this pattern of behavior is normal, it becomes necessary to find your inner well being spot. This calm zone is where you retreat to keep your strength strong, and your well-being first.

Just because he says and does these things does NOT make it your problem. I know, that was a hard one to hear and work through, but once I did that, it became easier to find alternate ways to bring positive change into the relationship. I am responsible for what I say and do. So I change my response to help me, and when his usual response no longer fits, it changes, not always for the better, but it gives way to a different direction.
In long term relationships, there are often conflicts of which began with a tiny shred of a particular issue that often boomerang into other areas.
Once you isolate that tiny shred and work through your feelings to a place of balance, you often find in your way something that helps heal the shred.
Best wishes to both of you, and your families.

Thank you both for responding. I have always been more than willing to work on our relationship, including myself! As we all know, especially in long term relationships, it’s never just one person that needs work. I have listened to his concerns and made adjustments when needed, even when it was hard! My issue now is that he has made very little effort in 12 years. He makes promises, plays nice for a little while, and then slips back into old habits. Then he apologizes and says he was just tired, had a hard day at work, etc. He honestly has no remorse and even makes me apologize which I do to keep the peace for the kids. I feel like I’ve reached my breaking point.
I get so anxious when he becomes upset and there’s no talking to him. I know I learned in therapy that I can only control my actions and his are separate from mine. Through therapy I discovered the reason for my panic attacks during my husbands rages is due to the trauma from my childhood. It puts me back in that place where I would run away from home to get away from my father. Leaving school because I was worried he would kill my mother. I feel that same fear with my husband and sometimes I can’t believe how similar they are. How did I fall into the same pattern as my mother? She had an abusive father, then an abusive husband and now I’m going through the same cycle. Is my daughter next?
I would love for my husband to try to make this work. He’s said and done just enough to make me stay. But I hurt. So. Much. He has no trouble sleeping while I cry myself to sleep after more hurtful words/actions.
He has also wandered outside the marriage. I have received messages from two women who said he wanted to “hook” up with them. I also found a message he sent to his cousin where he says he went to the bar and met a “cute blonde” and there were “hands in places they shouldn’t be.”
How much more can one person endure?

Welcome aboard Nemo. Glad you recognize the abuse cycle. Yes, the abuser starts as the white knight, then erodes all your self esteem. If there is a place for abused women in your area, they usually have free classes and groups to help you learn more about all the damage and let you rebuild that self again. You have been walking on eggshells for years. He did accomplish his goal of isolating you. Calming and comforting hugs.

Thanks for reaching out Simpson! Yes, my self esteem hit an all time low. I watch everything I say and sometimes that’s not even enough. If I say the wrong thing or have the wrong tone or it’s the wrong time then I’m in hell.
I hadn’t even considered looking into groups in my area. I have two small kids and I can’t exactly ask my husband to watch them while I go there. I guess I could lie but I feel nervous about him finding out.
I’ve been reading some great books and I’ve also started saving some money. I got a text today from an ex coworker. She’s been promoted to preschool director and wants me to come back when the school year starts. I’m hoping I can pull myself together so I can go there and get some more money saved. My anxiety and depression have been so bad that some days it’s hard to get out of bed.
I really appreciate everyone reaching out. It means so much that you cared enough to spare your precious time to comment! Thank you!

Your goal: save money. Purpose of saving money is a goal. Go back to work, get your motivation in the moment. That first step in the morning is the hardest, so plan ahead the night before how you will get up in the morning.
You can do this, and the thing to remember, you keep your calm balance, no matter what when dealing with him. What he does belongs to him.
One of the most difficult things to do to break a cycle of pattern partners is to do what you're doing now, writing it out, making options available using what you have in the moment.
Knowing that he's going to find wrong in whatever it is, belongs to him. That knowledge that you're working the problem to satisfy him...enough to get him to stop his behavior...means that there is not relief when it stops, for your well-being.
There are times when silence is golden. Learn how to make silence work for you.
There are some groups that offer child care, depends on the area you are in.
Best wishes!

My dad's a narcissist and certainly I have the stories of what my mom went through. You're right to be concerned about the cycle. I'm lucky to have never really been with a partner who's manipulated me like my dad has. I think the important thing is my mom left my dad when I was young (shared custody) and remarried a man who truly raised me to respect myself and care for myself. I'm still in therapy, but I'm estranged from my dad and it has made my life a lot easier.

I'm new-ish here, so maybe this isn't the sort of commentary we're supposed to give, but I'll say it anyway. My mom got a post office box and credit cards to afford things when my dad was controlling her money, which kept her from leaving. The credit card statements went to the post office, so he didn't know about them. Other people have given advice about making it work. I imagine a women's shelter would allow you to bring kids along or help in some way. I know the local women's shelter by me accepts children because they even do toy drives for them come Christmas.

My dad wasn't willing to go to therapy either. I vote you break the cycle and figure out how to get out of that relationship. I know it's hard with your anxiety. I had a rough few months at the beginning of the year. I'm a substitute teacher and I spent a few preps and recess crying once the kids were out of view. Sometimes you just need to hold it together the tiniest bit to get through the day. That and accept the hugs. Kids are always willing to give hugs and sometimes that can make all the difference.

Good luck.

You wrote, "Through therapy I discovered the reason for my panic attacks during my husbands rages is due to the trauma from my childhood..."

No. The reason for your panic attacks is that your husband is raging....which is not ok. Unless there is a true life-threatening fight-or-flight crisis going on the rages are nowhere near normal, appropriate, or acceptable. If he feels entitled to do that, to achieve power and control through fear, then shame on him. If it feels like abuse - it is.

It triggers you, but any other woman, with no childhood history of abuse, would be in a really bad emotional space too. The panic attacks are not your fault.

My dad was a raging drunk when I was a kid. I am 52 years old and I can't stand heated conflict or loud yelling still.

there are many great suggestions here. I hope you find some solace and can head towards a more peaceful emotional space.

may the force be with you

Thank you all so much for your honesty. I’m working on keeping my calm it’s just difficult when my anxiety is triggered as soon as I noticed that he’s annoyed.

We just spent the weekend at the beach with my parents (mom and step-dad) for my 29th birthday and he spent most of it avoiding eye contact and ignoring me because I asked him to spend more time with us. He was hiding out in the room.

I’m trying. I just can’t make a marriage work by myself. I’m so exhausted. I’ve opened up to my mom because she noticed something was wrong. She understands and has been super supportive. Obviously she wants me to stay with her but I’m still so scared to leave. I’m not sure what’s holding me back. I keep feeling sad for him and imagine how he would feel being all alone.

I realize he does not have the same feelings as me. He has hurt me and left me to cry countless times without any remorse so why do I care so much? I’m just waiting for him to reach out and change but the other part of me is just so emotionally tired. I just want to heal and model good relationships for my kids!

I really appreciate all the input! You guys are so supportive and it makes me feel better just reading your comments.

So very sorry to hear... Emotional abuse is devastating... My first marriage was full of it. 4 years of almost daily verbal insults, emotional attacks, that I wasn't good enough, that I was disgusting to him, etc.

I found my backbone and I stood up to him, and I divorced him! I let him pay child support, which helps provide for the kids, so keep that in mind. And there are support organizations out there if you feel like there is a physical concern like he would be violent. There are safe houses that can help you and your children get on your feet. There are other places. You might consider getting a roommate, someone you could trust, that might help with bills and cleaning some and is good with kids. Family is another option sometimes, depending on those relationships.

It took me a lot of strength to walk away from him, and I was scared he would retaliate, but my children's safety and my emotional well-being was most important. He had threatened me in my father's house, at my place of work, and slashed my tires on my vehicle.

There are people who can help you, but you have to step up and say enough is enough, and not go back. You have to understand that you ARE worth something and so are your children! And you are fully capable of providing for your kids!

Praying for you!

Hello CoderMom!
I’m so sorry you had to go through all of that! I can’t believe he slashed your tires! I think the worst thing my husband has done was flipping over my dining room table- I say worst because my first childhood memory is of my father flipping our coffee table and it triggered that same awful fear!

I’ve let him know that I’m not sure how I feel anymore. That I deserve the two basic things all relationships are made of- love and respect.

Tomorrow we fly back home from my parents house and I feel awful. I just want to stay but even if I leave I have things to take care of there first.

He said if I’m so unhappy we should get a divorce but also said he doesn’t want to. He wants to prove to me that it can be better but I’ve been waiting 12 years.

At this point I know what I SHOULD do, it’s just a matter of gathering my courage and DOING it. I just feel so scared to leave the only life I’ve known as an adult!

The only life you've known as an adult has been unhappy, you shouldn't be scared to leave that behind. I've been in a similar situation where I told him in no uncertain terms if you don't change I am leaving. He thought I'd never do it, and now he's alone. Threats never work, action works.