Mine talked about loving his children all the time. He might have even believed he loved them. But it soon became clear that he "loved" that he had them, while not actually loving them. I think it fit in with the image he wanted to present of himself -- Good Father. His Match.com dating profile name even starts with the words COOLDAD_____. When I saw that, I wanted to throw up.

On one hand...
The first thing he did when I rented an apartment in his city, was put a picture of his kids up on my wall, then acted all sheepish - "Do you mind? I hope you don't mind. I just love them so much." I told him of course I didn't mind then he'd choke up and hug me out of gratefulness.

On the other hand...
He would beg me to let him move with me back to my city, all the way across the country. I would ask "what about your kids?" He'd grumble - "Forget them. They don't need me. They're rich." (They aren't rich).

On one hand...
Nothing in the world mattered to him as much as his children. He'd cry every Sunday after their weekly meal together.

On the other hand...
He was proud of himself for having locked in such a low child support payments at the time of the divorce. His salary was 4 times higher now. I said, well then you can give them more. "F*ck that. I work hard for my money. Why should they get it?"

The list could go on and on of the attitudes that didn't line up. But I was also struck by something he once said about his first wife. I asked if he was head over heels in love with her when they first married. He looked a little guilty, then said: "People told me she'd make a good mother and they were right." So that was her purpose - to mother his children, his property.

Triumphantone,

wow...that's very interesting. So he claimed to be a dad when he saw convenient and felt like it.
My S couldn't keep his mouth shut about his unborn child once he found out that it was a boy, and was seemingly very happy. But to me it appeared he just loved the idea of being a dad or more likely having his own "thing".
I think he has no idea what raising a child involves, to be honest. He couldn't stand when his dog was whining for a few minutes, I could totally see him leaving his gf and the baby alone in the house and go to a bar all night.
I was just writing on another person's post, but my S once said, "women are only good for making babies. What else are they good for?" I was speechless....
Just like you mentioned above, in his eyes women are tools, objects....to mother his property....

My P lived approx 30 miles from his 4 children, ages 5-16, and he rarely ever went to see them; never went to their b'day parties, nothing. He went to see them maybe 5 times a year. He claimed to LOVE them so much. But he claimed a lot of things & we all know ACTIONS speak much LOUDER then words.

tara,

wow..that's so sad.
I guess once a P, always a P. They truly can't love no one else but themselves....not even their flesh and blood...
It's so sad that everything has to be on their terms.

Like Triumphantone my ex had a child that he claimed to love etc etc but it just didn't tally up. He refused to pay maintenence, manipulated the child, palmed the child off on others when something better came along, moved away when it suited him etc. I believe that he only continued to see his child in order to continue to manipulate his ex. He may want to bring him up as a twisted form of himself (like Heathcliffe in 'Wuthering Heights')- it would be the ultimate narcissistic act.

His actions didn't match the words and therefore I would argue that he did not love his child (not our concept of the word anyhow).

Beth,

It's just horrifying to know that Ss destroy the lives of people around him even their own childrens'.
As painful as it was to me, I'm, in a weird way, glad that I had miscarriage.
His gf asked him to get her pregnant after she found out I had gotten pregnant, and less than a month later she did get pregnant. Last I heard he was still making her believe that I was still pregnant, and had told her she'd better keep his child or he would kick her out of the house. It's so awful that he would go that far to manipulate and control people. And it makes me shiver to even imagine he would most likely to use his child to keep controlling people in the future....
I'm really glad I there won't be anything I will have to share with him in the future. Am I awful to think this way?

No, they can't truly love anyone. People are objects, possessions, that's it. So the "love" they may seem to have for anyone is basically like the love some normal people have for their cars or something like that. Not the love we have for another human being. Not the emotional connection. They can never experience that.. That's why you see so many of them killing their children to get back at the women who have left them. They are nothing more than objects that can be used to inflict the most pain on their victim (their ex). I know of 2 sociopaths who fought like hell to get custody of their kids in their divorces just so they could get that final stab at their exes and have that final control and inflict the most pain imaginable. They won. And of course they had no desire to be dads and no capability of fatherhood. They stashed their kids in their bedrooms and didn't interact with them at all. The kids grew up with serious mental issues from the emotional neglect and abuse.

Mine pretends really well to love his child. And I think he fancies her because at this point in her life, she adores him. I think once she begins to see behind his mask and realizes how incredibly selfish he is, and she doesn't worship him like now, it will be a totally different story.

Do I think he loves her? NO. He told his child that I did not love her, so he divorced me. He refused to let me tell her goodbye. He pushed him discarding me and devastating our family off on ME (to her). Who tells a 7 year old that their step mom doesn't love her? I'd been in her life for 4 years at that point. On top of that, he was selfish enough to bring his mistress around her immediately after telling her that I did not love her, and said that the OT did love her...???????? That right there proved to me that he is incapable of love, period.
It's sick.

(Might I add that he told her we were divorced before he even told me he wanted a divorce.... we are still not divorced)

Dear Agentsmith,

It is beyond my comprehension that anyone (even including sociopaths and psychopaths) can be so cruel to their flesh and blood, but it's the stone cold truth....When he started talking about his unborn child, for a moment, I thought he was capable of loving someone or something.
He was all happy about the fact that he had found a godfather for him, chose his names, wanting to raise him in a certain neighborhood....blah, blah, blah.... But I guess their intentions always come with ulterior motive. I guess that's why S and P are how they are.
I'm so glad that I came out of that relationship with no attachment to be honest with you.
I really wouldn't want to let the S control me for the rest of my life.

Dear Kitty,

Thank you so much for your input. It's just horrible for your S to turn things around and twisting the truths to manipulate the situations so that he can control the situation no matter what.
And to even use his own child to achieve it is just despicable...
I can see my S love his child (as much as an S can love someone) as long as he feels that he is loved by this child unconditionally....because that's how he is with everyone else right now. He used to say, "I love my dog and can't live without him", no wonder, because his dog is probably the only one who loves him unconditionally no matter how horrible he treats him at times.
My S was like a 5-year-old who was trapped in a 30-year-old's body. I truly can't imagine him being a normal loving parent who would throw himself under the bus for his child. It's just so so sad, and very unnerving to know that these people are having children....

Shelby, yes it is really hard for us to accept the level of indifference they have to their children (and us for that matter). I suppose that's how they get away with it for so long -friends, partners and relatives just can't fathom it. We find it impossible to imagine and who would want to believe that was true? It is cruel and horrifying. I don't think that you are 'awful' for feeling relieved at not having a baby with him. It sounds like an entirely normal response. What sort of life would the child have had? And you? It may have been impossible to have ever been free of him. It's something that i too am relieved never happened for me.

Beth,

Thank you so much.
I was willing to have the baby whether he was going to be around or not because I have always wanted to be a mother, but when I really think about it now, I almost see it as blessing in disguise.
You are absolutely right because if I had not miscarried the baby, I would have been stuck with my S for a loooong time and furthermore my child could have most likely fallen victim forever.
Maybe it was meant to be....

Shelby, I am friends with the mother of my ex/S's child. She tells me constantly how lucky I am that I did not bring his child into this world. He makes her life a living hell.
I, too, miscarried a child with my ex/S - and then we tried for nearly 5 year to become pregnant. I was about to start fertility treatments when he began devalue stage.
As much as it hurts to miscarry (I, too, so badly want to be a mother; so I understand), I do believe we are better of in the long run, to not have to share a child with these monsters.
I fear for my step daughter and what kind of emotional problems she will have, as a result of having a sociopath for a father; she is already showing troubling signs. It makes me so sad.
Hang in there!!

My daughter's dad, my ex-husband, the "S", has been pulling the strings for years. My daughter was seriously disturbed at one point. Now I'm beginning to see that the only way out of this whole mess is to move far, far away. The court continues to put my daughter through hell. She is 14, and old enough to make her own decision about who she wants to live with, yet the case manager involved is rock-solid on the grounds of restoring a "relationship" between the two of them. Hey - wouldn't it have happened by now? I know her father is just sitting back and laughing at all the hoops my daughter and I have to jump through for him. Now she has to go to some more therapy - this time it's supposed to include her dad. He will only lie, manipulate . . . I can't even trust the therapist to properly facilitate or document the situation because I don't trust. If I try to move, I'm afraid of having my daughter removed from my care. I have no reason to believe this. At least the case manager is encouraging controlled visits with her dad in counseling sessions and acknowledges that she and I have a good relationship. Thank God my daughter and I have each other and she has good examples in front of her.