HEY JANET JUST SAY THIS TO YOUR SON, "I AM A LOT OF THINGS SON, BUT I AM NOT AN ADDICT."

JMJ516, that's unnecessary and it is also cruel. To speak unkindly because one speaks unkindly to you is a weak way out. Be adult enough to close it and continue to love.

Janet I did have very low self esteem. Was married to a man for 17 yrs who called me a beached whale among other things, kept me up all hours of the night etc. Plus grew up with a father who was verbually abusive, and had a rough childhood so you see I do what it like to feel like you are no good, worthless etc.
Then I married a crack addict he is fun, good cook, loving, gave the best hugs except he has struggled for years with his drug addiction. Sure when he wanted to use he could say stuff and he has done and said hurtful things. but you know he built up my self esteem, always told me how pretty I was and how much he loved me, I am heavy just said that just me and he loved me.
I decided to not enable him but not condemn him either. We all have to walk in out own shoes and make our own choices. Weither or not we agree it is each our own life to live.
Its a process you don't learn overnight. learning to detach with love wasn't easy, took practice and I'm still learning.
You son's actions may seem selfish to you but its his choice. It is also easier not having contact and I understand that which is your choice,
I read this book on addiction and it siad yes you won't feel like saying things in a positive manner but its the war your wanting to win not the battle.

If interested here is the tips for positve talking.
Phrase your communication in first person "(I)"
Make it clear you understand your love one's position
Share your willingness to share responsibility for the situation about which you are talking.

Dear Katrinka,

I'm sorry you went through an rough childhood and had an abusive marriage. Thank you for letting me know you understand about low self-esteem. (And I think that in my case, and maybe your case, too, we're not always in a "rut" of self-esteem, but instead, it changes from time to time, so that we can have periods of low self-esteem, and then feel better about ourselves. The trick, as you know, is to not let the opinion of others be the criteria for whether we are "worthy" people or not...)

I hope I haven't given the impression here that I condemn my son for his behavior. My husband and I go out of our way to encourage him and point out to him what he is doing to move himself towards recovery - or even remind him of the many talents and gifts he has, such as writing and drawing. I can be supportive of him in this way as long as he is not shouting abuses at me. When the abuse starts, I have to cut off the "conversations".

I just remembered that the last time I saw him, I did say, "It must be hard to move from one shelter to another, living in a different place each week". He responded, "Well, that's the life I have to live"...and I sensed that he was blaming me for not letting him live with us. I also remember telling him during the same visit that he looked well, and he responded, "Well, you have to keep up appearances" - in other words, another barb aimed at Mom to let her know he may look well, but he is not. So I don't always find the positive statements I make helpful in the long run. I will tell him I am proud of him - I often tell him this, because paradoxically, he seems to be showing a lot of strength, which I never knew he had, in living such a grueling life, especially in the winter. I also tell him I am proud of him when he seems to be making a move towards recovery. So I wanted you to know that I do make positive statements about my son - I just wish he could take them in. He seems determined to take in what he perceives as negative feelings directed towards him - even though we never express them. He is probably picking-up judgment from me, even though I am not consciously trying to express this, because I do disapprove of his irresponsibility, and I do believe that alcoholics have an element of choice in their recovery, even if it is very small - and I often feel he is not putting enough effort into working towards sobriety. Even his friends in AA feel that this is true - that he is not working the program as best he can. I know it is all so complicated - but I can't help my feelings, either - that I feel he needs to focus more towards sobriety and getting job training of some kind, which he seems to resist (he also resists therapy.)

Sorry my posts are so long - when I started this thread, I never thought I would be writing these "book-length" posts! Thank you all for your patience in reading them, and for your help -

Thank you, Katrinka -

Janet

Dear Roy,

I agree with you that responses such as JMJ516 suggested would not be helpful, but I understand the rage behind the statement, and have certainly felt that rage myself, although I haven't expressed it to my son. So I can understand both his (or her) post and your response to it.

Janet

Roy! Janet does not need to be all PC! She needs her life back! Listen to what her son is saying to her. Please give me a break! Sorry but I don't think pointing out to a drug addict who treats the only people who care for him badly that he has the problem not them!

JMJ516, respectfully speaking, I understand the frustration but I just don't accept name calling as a retort justifiably worthwhile. What purpose would it serve? I wished I would have a child, no matter how age, call me names! He'd get a real good eye-view of the floor, once he regained consciousness. And certainly he/she would not be residing under my roof.

I posted on my journal today my own frustration. This particular post has the most replies I've seen in a long time, long time. It's time for the "talking about" to end and the "doing something" to begin.

Janet7 -- PUT THE SON OUT! In this, JMJ516 we agree. She deserves to get her life back. Her son knows he's an addict, so show him the door and once it's closed a whisper to herself, "at least I'm not an addict" is suffice for closure. BUT FIRST, she needs to be strong enough, and use common sense and put HIM OUT! Period. Why deal with him another day in his current state? She doesn't owe him anything except love and this can be done from a distance.

Tenderly speaking...haha, BrotherRoy

Dear Roy,

Just wanted to make it clear that my son IS out - and has been for some time. He lives in a homeless shelter, and we don't give him any cash, because we learned from experience that he uses it to buy booze.

He has been out of our apartment since he was 18 years old, but he had his own apartment, which we paid the rent for - so it is only now that we are crawling out from under a lot of debt. (Since I am unemployed, and my husband was supporting two households on one income.) My mother wanted him to live with her after my father died (when Nick was 18), and we found that they got along famously, especially since he was not drinking heavily at that time. After her death, he bottomed-out, as he was very close to her, and it was at this point, I believe, that he became an alcoholic. He told me once (before my mother died), "If anything ever happened to Grandma, I would have to go into rehab, because I would drink a lot more to get rid of the pain". I talked to him about this statement, but he clammed-up after he said this. We did take him to a counselor after my mother died, but he refused to continue after the first session.

One night he got so drunk that he tore around his neighborhood, cursing at his long-suffering landlord - and at this point, he told us to close up the apartment, because he was too humiliated to go back there. So we were spared the agony of having to stop paying his rent - he chose to go to rehab, but refused to stay more than a couple of weeks. When he got out, he started with the shelter system.

I'll have to take a look at your journal -

Janet

Paying for a grown man's apartment, who is addicted doesn't make much sense to me. Letting someone go means letting them go--completely. It's time for him to make his own way. This is what becoming a man and learning how to reach out for one's own abilities and resources. Bottoming comes when it's just me and God and believe me, He will step in and do some miracles. He did it for me and just waiting to do it for him. So, no, I would NOT be paying any child's rent, grown or otherwise, and especially if they're involved with drugs and alcohol.

I forgot to mention. It sort of reminds me when I was locked up for a traffic violation and wouldn't pay the fine. The judge asked me why I would not pay the fine and I told him, I'm an addict and that money would pay for a good party. He thought I'd change my mind, I didn't. I was getting fed, big color tv and clean clothes and it was winter time in Cleveland. I was living in luxury.

After a week, my grandmother died me after he called because my family called him, and he wanted to release me. I said, "nope". That would only give me an excuse. (I don't do funerals anyway.) So, he kept me locked up. The day before Thanksgiving, he released me after saying would I go and work in their recycle factory for 1/2 day. I refused, so he told me to go over there anyway and just leave from there. I did and sat around for four hours. See, the foolishness of addiction!

I agree with you, Roy, and that's why we're NOT paying his rent, and haven't, for a couple of years now. We have learned that this was a mistake. I keep writing that he is in the shelter system - that means HOMELESS. That is why this is so hard for me. I am still his mother, after all.

So why are you still writing that I have to stop enabling him, and "be strong", when I feel I AM?

Janet

Not just you, Janet7, which inspired the journal entry today, but it ALL the ones I've been reading of late and participating and it seems it is going nowhere. Just as I had to learn how to "let go" of my drugs and some family members in the process, family members have to learn how to "let go" of the addict in every way, except in prayer, and watch how they come back once given their freedom to do so. Hope this helps to explain my position.

OK - thanks for explaining - I thought you were writing about my situation and that you were under the impression I was still enabling my son.

I'm going to take a look at your journal entry now -

Janet

hey roy not to beat a dead dog but calling an addict, "an addict" is not calling him a mean, hateful name; it is the plain truth.