oh yeah and...

the idea of having to hide your meds in YOUR OWN HOME... is ridiculous!!

This is your home- you pay the bills this is your sanctuary... no one has the right to come in and take anything- at all period... not medication... NOT money... not anything... so I guess that means we should have to BOLT down everything in our own home because someone might be too tempted by the new computer that is sitting there... oh my of course! "Its all my fault that poor person... just couldnt help themselves"

The person that took those medications CHOSE on their own ... to take what DIDNT belong to them... they are a THEIF... which means that this theif is not responsible for their actions, and its the OTHER persons fault... placeing blame on the victim of theft...wow thats really scary.

I quite enjoyed reading that you found a good way in dealing with this in a fun way! You crack me up! How perfect!

you are my kind of gal!!! What you did is precious! I am a disabled RN and what he did, you could have him arrested for! Your kinder than I am ;)
Willow54

I got off on the wrong track when i started talking about addiction and addicts....I realize this is not the forum for this discussion. Nemcgrath did post her discussion publicly though and it was my opionion that she handled her problem rather cruelly. Yes i am an addict and no i am not ashamed of this....i have suffered severely for my problem and am now drug free. I just found out that i have severe degenerative arthiritis in my spine and knees, spinal stenosos, bulging discs, and some type of cysts on my spine i also have degenerative changes in my bones so yes....i am in a great deal of pain on a daily basis. I have not had the resourses to see a pain doctor and will not until the first of the month and then i'll have to wait again for an appt. I have talked to my grown son and he is going to keep my meds for me and give them to me so I won't take too many.I am asking anyone whom i offended earlier to please forgive my rude comments. I don't usually act this way and there is really no excuse. Jen.

Thank you for your apology, Jen.

I wish you the best of luck with your pain, and hope that your resources come through with doctors who are helpful to you.

If you think you might have a problem staying within your prescribed dosages of narcotics then I applaud you for facing that possibility before it ever has a chance of becoming a problem.

I would still like to point out, however, that just because you are choosing to deal with your chronic pain issues in this way does not mean that everyone will or even might have your same tendencies or fears towards their meds. Everyone is different, we simply can't speak for others, or lump every chronic pain sufferer into a group;
it's not right, and it's not accurate.

That being said, I'm sorry to hear of your
diagnosis, and I hope that you'll be feeling better very soon.

*Misa*

Yes....misa i already have had problems with taking the pills for pain the wrong way. I have a very very addictive personality and that's why i'm concerned about the meds i might have to take. I'm really not supposed to take any narcotocs but my pain has gotten so bad in the last year that they are the only ones that work....so that's why i will let my son keep them for me and give them to me as directed. I have two loving and understanding children who never try to make me feel bad about having had a drug problem....they even learned about it in school....how it's a disease and all....it makes me feel good that their generation is much more open-minded and accepting of people with addiction problems....they were not so when i was growing up...in fact i was taught that adicts were "Bad" people so it has taken me forever to work throgh my guilt issues....I still struggle with it at times....but on the other hand i am less judgemental and much more forgiving of others now and i don't think i would be if i had not had the problems in my life that i have. There is something about feeling another persons pain that really helps you see them more clearly. Jen.

Jen-

First of all, I think it's *wonderful* that you
were able to overcome the issues you had with narcotics before - that's an amazing accomplishment. I don't disagree with you that
people *can* become addicted to prescription medicine, I'd have to be a fool to think that;
my point was simply that it's not always the case, which you already know.

I happened to catch OPRAH today, and she had a family on from Ohio that Lisa Ling reported on-
parents and three boys, two in their teens and
a baby, and both the parents AND the teens were completely addicted to heroin. It was heartbreaking. And guess where it started? Prescription painkillers from a work-related injury that the father had. He was a man who made $100,000.oo a year, owned a home, nice cars, and had a happy, healthy family - until he was put on percocet, which became oxycontin, which became this, which became that, which became heroin. They've sold everything in their home (as well as the home itself), all of their cars, ewelry - anything
and everything they had, and all for drugs.
Now they live in a homeless shelter, and take
the baby on drug runs with them. Thankfully
Oprah's show found them each a detox/recovery
center to go to, and I think they were all planning to go, but still, you're absolutely right: pain meds can do damage. The doctor on
the show talked about how the father's brain
was pretty much hard-wired for drug use once
he started, because he had an addictive personality. Luckily now he's getting help, but not before it took his entire family out.

I think it's great that your sons are understanding, it clearly shows that you've raised two open-minded, non-judgemental sons, and you should be proud of that!

When I turned 21 and started my lame few days
of drinking and partying, my parents told me
to be careful numerous times because alcoholism
'runs' in my mom's side of the family. If those genes ARE hereditary, then I don't see how it isn't the same with drug addiction - what are your thoughts on this? Did either run in your family? Something to think about.

Again, though, good for you for overcoming the
situation that you found yourself in (through
no fault of your own, I'm sure!), and for trying to steer clear of it again - admitting that you're vulnerable to it, for *any* reason,
can't be an easy thing to do, but it's a corageous thing to do, and I'm willing to bet that that's something EVERYONE in this room would agree with!

*Misa*

both chronic and jenna STILL insist (in the midst of jenna's apology about addiction and chronic's even taking umbrage with jenna's take on it)..in still blaming nem entirely for the theft of her meds. THIS is complete and utter BS! You are the ONLY two here who think so. No one who is victim of a thief/robbery/rape/murder is responsible for what that perp has done to them! So please get real. Jenna claims nem is being 'vindictive' and 'cruel'. Chronic says she 'should have reported it' (presumably to the police?) Clearly, neither of you is reading what the rest of us are attempting to convey to you. The ACT of reporting stolen meds IMMEDIATELY places the person reporting the incident into an extremely difficult position - that of being suspected of SELLING their meds! These reports stay on the books. Don't you get it yet? This is real life. That is how it works. And to boot, the victim is now without the pain relief he/she so desperately needs...a double whammy! So quit being so caring and considerate for the thief's delicate feelings, and spare some empathy for the person who was victimized and who is now suffering REAL PAIN. Sheesh! If you actually read her posts, she hasn't yet done anything! She wrote that too. The roommate's son isn't in the house at the moment...she has only contemplated what she'll do IF he ever 'visits' again..yet you two 'blame the victim' advocates already have her hung, drawn and quartered. Perhaps it's a comprehension problem. Chronic and Jenna: you've pretty much lost any previous empathy/sympathy I might have felt for you by your rush to judgment against a fellow sufferer (have you bothered reading her story?)who didn't deserve now to be so ill-treated. There's nothing remotely 'vindictive' about her plan. She still does not have absolute PROOF that it was her roommate's son who stole her meds -her idea would be a perfect way to find out for sure. It sure worked for me. What if it was the roommate herself using her son as an excuse..or even someone else? One cannot 'accuse' without proof. By substituting a harmless look-alike non-narcotic for the narcotic, she wouldn't CAUSE the thief any real harm...and if it did by chance turn out that he/she was 'allergic' (I notice neither of you expressed concern about the possibility of the thief being allergic to the stolen narcotics!) ..then I guess that'd be the thief's problem to deal with and explain to his doctors/hospital how he happened to ingest the substance, isn't it? You makes your choices, you pays your price.

and to lladyfair? --kudos! couldn't add a single thing to what you've said..perfect!

misababy, you're a whole lot kinder than me :)

I have to state Again, here that I did not now nor EVER blame Nemcgrath for anything other than not taking responsible action for her medications. I do not have the least bit of sympathy for the thief.I said again and again to report his theft to the police.
The document I signed with my pain management doctor which is called a "pain contract" stating explicitly that if I had med's stolen that I would report it.I would not be able to replace the stolen med's without a police report. This is exactly why I said she should have reported it. SO she could replace her med's. This doesn't look like drug seeking behaviour to the PM doc unless it becomes a habit with the patient.
This means that the patient is not taking responsible cautions with the medications they were prescribed.
Over and over again I said that this would never have happened if Nemc had invested in a simple LOCK. Not to feel like she is in prison or she is living in a jail. So many people have expressed they have the right to feel free in their own home4s. I agree 100% with them. This doesn't mean I don't have to take actions that are going to keep everyone safe. I lock my door each night. Does this mean I am not living free. No, of course it doesn't. I am a responsible adult taking PRECAUTIONS against any criminal type behaviour.
But would I set up traps for the possible burglar? No, then I would be playing games or being paranoid.
I have a drug addict brother who came to visit me. Normally I have kept my months supply in a metal locked box which is actually only about 16 X 24, so its easily hidden or accessible. Then I have a weeks worth of medicine in my personal bathroom cabinet.
Knowing my brother was coming and his "interest" in what I was being prescribed, I put all my med's inside of the box and hid that.
I was being precautious and responsible. If my brother stole my med's and overdosed and died, who would you place the blame on. Totally him? Totally me?
No...BOTH of us.
Bottom line is I totally believe that the person who stole her medication was wrong and reprehensible. He should be punished to the full extent possible. But when I do not report it and then take the law into my own hands and try and poison the thief, well I believe that ALSO wrong. The whole problem could have easily been avoided with a simple LOCK.
That's all. Everyone is entitled to their own values, and morals and thoughts.
But I read the PAIN Contract I signed and I ABIDE by it, TOTALLY.
And yes, if my brother stole my med's you bet your a** I would have reported him to the police and have had him arrested.

FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, chronic:
if you use the words 'lock' or 'box'
even ONE more time I think I might implode.
It's like a bad re-run of Al Gore running
for office ... 'lock box, lock box ...'
AAUUGGHH!!!

Sorry that your life is one where you
have to take such drastic measures, but
many of us are not in similar situations,
and do not care to be lectured about it
over and over again.

And guess what? You DON'T KNOW exactly
what you would do if you your brother
stole your meds, or if you were in grath's
situation, because you're NOT in it!

We've all signed pain contracts - and
mine said NOTHING about a damn box, I can
tell you that. So please, PLEASE, enough
of the judgements already!

*Misa*

Scotty: Still think I'm kind? =)

Storing my meds in a metal locked box is going to the extreme for you, MisaBaby??
If that's extreme, well too dam bad I am protecting what is mine .
Do you LOCK your front door at night. Is that EXTREME to you??
How can you have the unbelievable GALL to say I don't know what I would do if my brother stole my med's??
Why I didn't choose to share it at the time is none of your business.
My brother DID steal from me. That's how I knew to hide my med's. We, my Mom and I, had to take him to court and have him LOCKED up in a mental institution because of his drug use.
I haven't spoken to him since we buried my mother , one year ago Sept 9Th, because he asked if anyone I knew had any "partyables" which made me want to throw up.He lives in the SW and wanted to "score" when he came up for the funeral. Sicko that he is, it shows the depth of his drug behaviour.

Never, MisaBaby ASSUME you KNOW anybody else's life or tell them what they would or would do.
I know for a fact, if someone stole my med's, they might kill the person who stole them as I have an extremely high tolerance.
This is why I keep them in a LOCKED BOX.

If you don't want to read what I say or if it annoys you, DON"T COMMENT, or don't get involved...
Gee, scotty am I nice now too?

Spoken like a little girl, oh yes your are misaBABY.

I am just curious... lets just *say* that you put a LOCK (sorry Misa* only one more lock lol) on your box... and your brother broke it to get into it - would it still be partly your fault or would it be okay because you had the right "intention" to lockem' up but it didnt work? I mean when does it become the theifs responsibility to keep their hands OFF other peoples property? Its not their stuff ... why cant one understand that they should keep their HANDS to themselves...
I really can usually see both sides of an issue but this one I just cant...
Its putting blame on someone who doesnt deserve it...

Now Scottys point is one of the best so far-- **no one was concerned about being allergic to the narcotics**... thats so true!

You and ScottyG are both wrong. That is in the first post I made. I said if he overdoses on the stolen meds, would she feel responsible. I know people would have trouble with my med's.
If my brother broke into my locked box after I had hid it from him, yes it would still be BOTH of our faults. I don't agree with stealing but most of you are picking and choosing my words or taking them out of context. Read from the beginning before you judge me.

Chonic-

Never once did I state that you locking up your
meds was too 'extreme' for me. I simply suggested that it was not something stated on every single pain contract out there, and also not a complete necessity for every chronic pain
patient to have to take.

I'm very sorry to hear of your past situation with your brother - I can't think of many other betrayals of trust that would hurt more. I AM a little confused, however, since you state in your first post that you have been on pain medicine for 14 years now and have
NEVER been robbed. Your posts are conflicting,
and when I wrote my response I was simply going
off of what YOU yourself had stated, therefor
making the assumption that you *hadn't* been in
grath's situation, and, at that, could NOT definitively say exactly what you would or would not do if you were. The only reason I ASSUMED that was true about you was that you WROTE it out for all of us to read.

I'm very sorry to hear of the loss of your mother - I can't imagine what that must be like, and believe me, I am not anxious to find out anytime soon. I don't mean these things lightly, I really can't imagine what you've been through, as I have not been in your shoes; but you certainly have my empathy.

Without knowing that you had already been in that situation with your brother, my point was simply that those of us who HAVEN'T been in someone else's position can't really definitively say exactly how we would act if were we the ones in it. In your case, you made
it sound as though the incident with your brother *could* take place someday, but so far handn't - I had no way of knowing from your posts that it already had.

Meanwhile, you yourself *were* stating just what YOU would do if you were in grath's situation - looking at the limited knowledge we
had, and the fact that you were acting judgemental towards her, I hope that you are able to see where I was coming from.

In essence: you don't want anyone to act as though they know your situation until they've walked a mile in your shoes - totally reasonable. I think that grath deserves the same courtesy from you. Instead it seemed as though you were lecturing her in almost an attacking manor, which is why I said something.
I'm not trying to pretend to know what your life is like; perhaps we could all act that way
towards eachother before we get the facts?

*Misa*

ps) I apologize to everyone else for my incessant rambling - I hope you understand!

No, Im really not trying to pick and choose your words...Im trying to understand where you are coming from...
Only if you wish to... please try and explain How it would also be your fault if your brother stole your meds...even after you HID it? Again my point being that NO ONE should get into someone elses things even if plain view but you really think its your fault if he finds it after you have hid it??

Anyway- basically the point is we just disagree - no biggie...its what makes the world go around...