LiannaMe, I really appreciate how you explained your thoughts. Yes I really want to believe that marriage can be a union where two people can come togther to honor, respect and enjoy each other, however it doesn't always turn out that way and that's what concerns me. In this last relationship she said she loved me a day prior to her ending the relationship, which like you I said wow thank goodness we were not married, that would have been a tough one. In addition I was married 30 yrs. to the person I loved and shared 3 awesome kids with and then one day she said " I'm leaving and I want to live my own life, and she walked out on both the kids and I. Like you there is a part of me that wants to be with
someone that I can love and be loved, someone who I want to grow old with, however at this time I feel that this only happens in fairy tales.

Wm98

No wonder you're a little gun shy! Who wouldn't be?

But call me old fashinoned-I want "The Notebook" kind of fairy tale. Will I ever have it? Who knows? But you never know!
Life can throw some harsh realities-it's how you choose to respond.
I can only control myself and my thoughts-and be the best person I can be.

Two rules I like to try and live by:

1) Never say Never 2) Never assume

Sending support to all!

Even after 25 years of marriage and then a divorce, I still believe in marriage. I think the love and commitment of marriage is a beautiful thing, and it has nothing to do with the monetary gain one might receive in a divorce. Will I ever marry again - I don't know, but I probably wouldn't get seriously involved with a man who has taken that option right off the table. If you want a relationship with a woman who feels the way you do about not wanting marriage, I would be very honest at the onset of the relationship. I don't believe that all people need to marry, but the two people involved should agree about it right from the start.

But when people say they want marriage so that person is theirs and only theirs...isn't always the case. People stray in marriage all the time, so being "married" doesn't safeguard from things any more than not being married does.

I gave my all and the best I could to my marriage. I know that being committed, in my opinion, doesn't have to end in marriage because marriage doesn't repel bad things. Vows are broken all the time. And, not being married doesn't automatically make me assume that the other person will walk away quicker because they are done...would it be cheaper? Probably, but at the same time, marriage or not, if someone wants out, marriage isn't a bulletproof vest.

And, as far as what people would think of me...I, personally, don't care if someone turned their nose up to me living with someone who wasn't my husband. I've yet to see a perfect marriage, ever.

Ditto what Trying said--I completely agree with #34. I couldn't have said it better.

I agree with trying as well. It's a nice illusion, that somehow becomes a safeguard. Basically marriage is holding someone to their word. As I usually take life day by day, when thinking in terms of marriage, you kinda have to project forward, and think if you could deal with your partner for an extended period of time, intensify those small moments of disagreement with the comfort with that person that will come with time. Not many people put that much thought into it. I think that's where the problem lies.

I see marriage as a partnership too. It works beautifully if you have common goals. You are building a life together. My EX could not of gotten all the things he has without my help. I thought he was going to see to my dreams becoming successful as well. In the end I was duped. I'm glad I got a second chance at pursuing them now that we are divorced. Not many people get a second chance.

I agree with reply#32 in never say never. I've been trying to live by that the last 3 years. I don't want to get married again, but I'm not saying never either.

Wm98,

If, for you, "marriage is just a piece of paper", why are you afraid of a little bit of papyrus?,

Marriage also does give some added legal rights- like when your loved one is in the hospital- if you aren't legally married you can find yourself left out of things, no able to make decisions or even SEE the person. 10 years of living with my bf and I wasn't even allowed to talk to the Dr. when he was in the hospital- I had very important information and the reality was that I was the only person that even knew him, he was from anther country and didn't have any relatives living here. I could have told the Dr's what they needed to know- like the fact that he was on steroids lol.
For those interested in same sex marriages- I'm not sure why anyone is against two people making a commitment to each other, it does make a difference in many areas when it comes to health benefits, parental rights etc.

I don't think it's all about money or even gender. look at Liz Taylor- married 8 frickin' times and the last one she supported. She was not poor by a long shot. Just a love junkie who kept making the same mistake over and over.

I think men can repeat mistakes too, but I think that society does pressure single women to get married much more- that you are a spinster and unloveable if you are single and 'of a certain age'. Society is pretty judgmental about women and their sexuality and relationships, even in this day and age.

I also think women are more conditioned to think love will conquer all and make their lives complete. Men are more socialized to believe it's ok to be single and involved more in your career.

I also wonder if the whole cultural push towards glorifying weddings to a ridiculous degree - the "Bridezilla' crap and the "Wedding Industrial Complex" (I did not make that term up) but all the shows about weddings and all that...I wonder if there is any correlation to the dotcom implosion and the economic uncertainty- like people couldn't count on a fabulous career right out of college anymore so they focussed on another fairytale ending for their lives and identities.

I think all of this goes hand in hand with the trend of the last 15 years or so of having really extravagant weddings- it's all about "Look at how successful and normal I am!" Sure, everyone is looking for love, but something got really weird there for awhile. It seemed for a time that every movie and reality show was about weddings. Then of course, what do you do when you're married!LOL.

But I'm skeptical because my parents loveless marriage put me off the concept for life, pretty much. Suburban marriage will always spook me a little, I think. But I'm screwed up in general, so... LOL.

#38 ScarletAngel:
I love your comment "If, for you, "marriage is just a piece of paper", why are you afraid of a little bit of papyrus?"

Great question and my response is that this piece of paper is a bilateral contract that requires both parties to sign, however it can become unilateral whereby one party has the ability to disolve it, and yes I realize that a divorce requires both parties to sign however there are no gurantees that by signing this contract either party will abide by the terms. Do you recall the vows, basically what they stated were the responsibilties one assumes when married. So the question is why sign this piece of paper (CONTRACT) when in all reality it has no validity.

PS. I welcome all responses!!!

I think your frustration stems not so much with the contract of marriage, but rather the intent and integrity of the individuals entering into said contract.

Any "iron-clad" contract can be broken; maybe you should not be as concerned with the contract as with whom you chose to contract with. Due diligence would be better serve in evaluating your partner in the endeavor instead of evaluating the endeavor itself.

I agree, one should consider the intent and integrity of the individual prior to entering into said contract (Marriage), however we're human and we change with time. The person who I was when I entered into the marriage is not the same person I was prior to our divorce 30 yrs. later and vice versa with her. I wish we could evaluate our partners and have the assurance the relationship will make it, however I realize that this wish is not realistic. I feel that the paper may be nice upfront but I also know there are no guarantees.

@Wm, I'm only speaking for myself here, but I think that women who desire marriage want it for different reasons, just as men want it for different reasons. My reason would be because I believe that marriage is a spiritual and emotional bond and not just a legal contract. I understand that there are no guarantees that the marriage will last. Most certainly people will change throughout the relationship. That being said, if a man is not open to the possibility of marriage, then in my mind he is saying that he is more interested in protecting his own interests than he is interested in making a life-time committment with risks and sacrifices for me. Like you, I understand first-hand long-term marriage and divorce. I believe marriage is something to be entered into VERY carefully, Also, I'm not saying that your opinion is wrong. If you don't want to re-marry that's your choice. I'm just saying that if a woman wants marriage, you probably won't change her mind about it, and you should let her know your feelings about it early in the relationship.