thank you needhelp62, you just posted what I feel every day and when my H/CS get into our heartcrying conversations....mostly he still has the place of "I kept the two of you separate...the two lives I was living were separate so they did not affect either in anyway..."it takes quite a bit of conversation, and emotion before he comes out of his pride to get it a little....I just don't know how this will heal until he actually FEELS what I feel every day, and FEELS it the way I DO, because that is who has been HURT, DESTROYED, DEVASTATED, DISGUSTED by what he did, and how he did it, and when he did it and how long he did it, and how easily he did it, and who he did it with....and the cost to so many of it all, he spent lives that were not his to spend...how will I ever get past the thoughts in my head of where his mouth was just before he kissed me and said "I love you"...to her and to me...how, how....this kills me every day...and for those who think I should just end the marriage, kick him out, and move on....that will not end my misery, because not only will it go on in my head, I will suffer the loss of my marriage, my best friend, my future....and have to watch him with someone else to fk again as he moves on to them all....I am not prepared for added heart ache and pain...and to never trust another man, to be alone for the rest of my life, unloved and un cherished, cast aside like the trash he treated me like, how is that fair, that I lose my life, I lose everything for HIS indescretion...

I don't have time to read all the responses, but revenge cheating only ends up hurting your and the other person in the long run. It may take a bit to kick in but the regret and guilty will, eventually.

Jimmy, all I can say is I've been there. I still keep the 200 plus email printouts from my exH somewhere in my closet. I may burn them, but for now, they are still there. I tried to put things back together, as well, but I found out once trust is broken...that is it, it's gone. I have smaller kids too. It was the hardest decision of my life bc I was a SAHM, and had been out of the workforce for about 5 years. Quite frankly, I still don't think I am over it, but I look at it more that he could have her...I want no part of him, his appendages, or that anymore. My hugs to you.

I'm also dealing with it all over again, reading the pornographic type, I wish I never found. However, I did and at least I know. All I can say is try to take one day at a time and try to think about it less or you will become bitter and angry forever.

Yeah, llmt, speaks words of wisdom!!!

It is very hard to hang on to for so long, and then get so bitter, that the bitterness is etched into your mind, heart, and soul......and is very hard to eliminate after that.

JimmytGreeK:
Ouch, that was such a long time, but, sadly that seems to happen to many of the betrayed, that so much time has been inflicted on them,unbeknownst to them, double ouch! And then for you to move, and her repeat her bs, that was a triple ouch, really, no dang feelings of remorse??? Or worse yet, pretending to be sorry, pretending to rebuild, and still being a major hypocrite. I mean, man, I do feel for ya, I really do! Just plain ol bs, and unjustifiable! Not even something a worst enemy should do!!!

and

Needhelp:
Yeah, I think we all thought the same thing at one time of ourselves: "How could I have been so stupid to blindly trust and love, and all for what?" The only consolation is: I believe that's what we are supposed to do, when we really love someone, to open our hearts, be vulnerable, until they prove otherwise. Sadly your H did that, and of course that sucks, bigtime big fat bullets.

Yet, I never want to apologize for living, and loving, cuz really, there's nothing to apologize for! In an ideal world, with an ideal genuine, honest, partner.....that's what we should do! That's when the love is so fulfilling.....but sadly....some people just aren't genuine and honest, and truly, that's not your fault, that's his!!!

Needshelp, you asked, "How do you love someone deeply and freely AFTER they have betrayed you? Don't you ALL feel like you are holding back ( if not even a little bit0? :You can NEVER be your real self with this person you have chosen to stay with because of what they have done to you. They have changed YOU."

I'm not sure what you mean by holding back, but I am fully who I am with my wife. I love her completely. And nothing will change that. But that is based upon primarily agape love, which supports the other types of love which can ebb and flow over time.

Am I in Love?
http://www.dailystrength.org/groups/healing-infidelity-through-faith/news/view/5333418

I can say I'm more sensitive to anything that resembles a red flag, even if it is not. I'm less likely to be okay with her being in certain situations than I was before. But the bulk of the trust she lost has been rebuilt. I have no fears inside of me that she is or is likely to cheat on me. Not saying it couldn't happen. Not saying I have the same blind trust I had before the A. But I do trust her. And my gut trusts her.

If I'm holding anything back, I'm not sure what it would be. I've accepted my loss, and have positive hope for the future.

I think, based on comments you've made in the past, the main reason you are where you are now is issues were swept under the rug for too long, and they've never been fully dealt with, never healed, but is still a big wound. Based on his history, he would have had to gone into super-intense counseling and therapy dealing with his history of cheating. Those types can heal from that, but it is hard and requires complete commitment and determination. Without that, I'm sure you have no sense that it wont' happen again, and because of that, you are unable to heal from what he did to you.

I could be way off base, but that's my sense of things. Which if it is all true, leaves you in a very bad place, I agree. It would be hard to *feel* love for him in that situation, much less any trust or hope for the relationship.

limt " It may take a bit to kick in but the regret and guilty will, eventually. " Don't be so sure about that. What would there to be guilty about?? Broken promises? Oops...broken already. Betrayal? Opps, been done already.

Shegavehim...I feel your pain everyday. For your H to believe that he kept you two separate, look how that has worked out. His two lives have collided, just as mine did when my H left his GF and she decided to let me know about about them and how wonderful they were for each other. She made sure I found out about his lies. She was MORE than happy to let me know how wonderful he was to her. She even bragged he was living two lives and loving it.

Shegavehim, your H needs to feel a little pain too. He is still oblivious of what he has done. and the fact that he can live his two lives...You never signed up for two husbands and I'm she would NOT appreciate sharing YOU, but of course its NOT about YOU...its all about HIM and what he wanted.
You can't change him. You can't make him see. HE has to see it. That is why I would hope you turn your thinking to about what YOU need and who YOU are. To hell with him. When you stop worrying about him, he with either come around or not. What do you have to lose I felt that way. What did I have to lose? He gave away everything that I cherished. He pissed on my values.

I told my H that he was FREE to go to his OW. But, if he DID, he would never come back. He would be dead to me and I would be dead to him. That means that if he went, he could lose my phone number. I would not EVER try to contact him for anything ever again.. and vice versa. .no checking up to see how I am. Nothing. I looked him right in his eye, and told him those were his options. He could choose. I was deadly serious and he knew it. If he chose to spend more time with her, I was outta there. He could spend 100% of his time with her. He could have her full time.

He dumped her. And she didn't go quietly into the night. She stalked and harassed him for MONTHS...almost a year.

Now this is our life..never a total relationship. not a love match again. not real lovers. not " in love'. Its what is left of his mess..his " I was just fuc___g around." I hope she was worth it, since she started screwing his friend after a few months.

Needhelp62-

I am wondering why you stay with your H. I have read your posts on rebuilding and felt your pain after 4 years. Don't you deserve happiness after all this? Maybe you would find true love with someone else.

I agree that for a lot of us if you can't trust again it is utterly impossible to make that connection and feel truly in love with that person again. You need to expose that tender underbelly to have true intimacy and it begs the question how can you after what they did?

I hope you find your way out of this eventually.

Hugs

Cole50, so your wife's A HAS changed you. You are more aware ( which translates to you have a light shield up waiting for the other shoe to drop.) You don't have that trust again. Don't you miss it? Wouldn't it be nice to have that again? that " i can sleep totally in peace tonight..trigger free, rather than ' its late where is she/he?' feeling that we have at times? That quick flutter in your stomach when you have that 'she cheated' feeling. I don't even remember how it felt to trust like I did before the A. its like childbirth. YOu know it hurt like hell, but you can't recall the actual feeling. I remember that I used to laugh out loud. i didn't have a real care because I trusted my friend and he was the most important person in my world...only to find out that HE was the most important person in HIS world, too.

I believe he has MANY problems that come from his family and how he and his siblings were treated when they were children. I could use therapy and would go ..but he hasn't admitted that he needs to. I believe he has LOTS of skeletons in there that he would rather leave hidden. Unfortunately his behavior showed how screwed up he is.
yes. it is a big wound and we don't talk about it anymore. he knows there is a problem, but he never talks about it. We never get anywhere. I don't hug him. I'm not affectionate. I just don't feel that way about him anymore.i feel alone and lonely. One day i hope that I will find what I am looking for..and the funny thing is, he will act like he is surprised.

This is a very intense thread. I'm going to chime in.
I've had fantasies of revenge A. I thought the only way he could ever really understand the pain is to have it happen to him. If he ever started up again after all we have done with rebuilding I can bet the idea of revenge would probably seem like a viable option.

So jimmythegreek, I don't judge you for desiring it and even seeking it out nor would I judge you if you went through with it. I don't think anybody is judging at all. I think everybody sees you running into traffic and the car is flying down the road headed right for you. They are telling you to stop, don't go any further. In time you will likely regret it.

Just like the A our cs have may have the feel good moments the pain, guilt and rips them apart at the same time.

My advice is to swallow your pride and stay with your parents if that is the only possible option for not living with her. Step back and think clearly for your kids sake.

No matter what she did, she is the mother of your children and you are planning on taking action to cause her great pain (I'm not saying she doesn't deserve a kick in the ass). Be the bigger person in this situation and take the high road for the better of the bigger picture. I can bet that you deciding to leave and move on will create enough pain and sorrow.

My friend left her cs and didn't start dating until he was gone for nearly 2 years. Her having a bf and moving on has devastated him. Not because of just the sexual part but that she found a man who adores and treats her better than her cs ever did.

Living life and moving on is it's own revenge.

Your situation is a tough one and I'm sorry you Re going through this. I hope whatever you decide it brings you a sense of peace through all of Thai.

Oh, I know the A and the aftermath has changed me, needhelp. It has changed both of us. Yes, I do wish I didn't have to worry about it happening again. But I only felt that way because I thought it would be a cold day in Hell before she'd ever fall. And that appeared to be true for 28.5 years of marriage. While I knew in theory it could happen, I felt practically speaking it was about as likely as sticking my hand in the proverbial hay stack and getting stuck with the needle in it.

Problem was, the cold day in Hell arrived. It showed that my level of trust was a fantasy. And in truth, so is anyone who has that level of trust. And because both of us thought it would never happen to us, we both took risks, crossed innocent seeming boundaries. But she got burned doing so.

So, yeah, I miss that. But it wasn't real. That said, I do wish I didn't have the automatic reflex you talked about. That doesn't happen very often for me. Maybe once every three months or so. But I still trust her now. Realistically.

But I don't feel like I'm holding anything back from her in terms of love. We show our love to each other more than we ever did before the A. And that part is a good change.

For all the BS...dont lamb baste me, just hear me out...being the CS doesnt always work out..so maybe you can seek a little happiness from this perspective...I am the CS, I left for what i thought would be better, only to find out this man has a predilection for married women, only to find out he cheated on me, once that I know of for sure, more Im suspicious of, so in a way karma has come around and bit me...I live with my mistake everyday, I see how I was selfish, but a little too late. If I could do it all over again, I wouldnt make the same mistake.
Think twice before revenge sex, it will only make you feel worse. just mho.