Widows & Widowers Support Group

This community is dedicated to those who have lost a husband, wife, or partner. Anything is open for discussion here, with the hope that we can focus on grief, bereavement, life after loss, and continuing on after a great loss.

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CGRMOM 10/02/2008

My name is Debbie and I have been widowed for 14 years. I didn't date the first 10 years after my husband died, although I was only 35 I felt I needed to give 100% to raising my three children who were very young. I met and fell in love with a widower 10 years later who's wife had been gone for only 9 months. We kept our relationship strictly a friendship for a year because we both agreed it was to soon for his two children who were 16,17 at the time. I felt it was to soon for him to give his heart to me and that he needed to heal more before our relationship could be a healthy one. It's been almost 4 years now and in Februaury he proposed to me and gave me a beautiful engagement ring. His wife is gone 5 years now and his children are both away at college..they are now 20, 21. Since our engagement it has been a nightmare..his daughter went crazy when she heard and said we had no right to do this until she was ready. He told her before that he was going to buy me a ring and she asked him not to. He said that he needed to do what was best for him and not for her. He is a wonderful Father, loving, caring and provides his children with a lifestyle that any other kids would envy. She does nothing now but curse him out and tell im that she hates him. She told him and I that good parents don't intentionaly hurt there children and that if he realy loved her he would have listened to her and waited. We can't set a wedding date and we have been engaged for 9 months now..we are so afraid that she will disown her father and I feel guilty for causeing this drama in there family. All I did was love her dad and we have a great relationship..she hates that too because she says that he is better to me than he was to her Mom. I tried to explain to her that when we are given a second chance to love again we make sure we don't make the same mistakes again. We hug more, hold hands always and pay attention to each others wants and needs.she hates it and now I can't imagine what living in that house will be like. She throws tantrums and even threw her dad into a wall last week because he invited me on a vacation with them..I came up to the cabin the last two days they were there. They had bben there for a week before and when I would speak to my fiance he would tell me that his daughter has not spent anytime with him alone at all..she is always with her friends..he said he was lonely so I went and boy has this caused drama. His son is great and treats me wonderful...We just don't know what to do..he starts conseling with her 300 miles a way every Saturday next week. He is making the trip to where she is in college. I don't think a conseler is going to help this situation but I pray I am wrong. Any advise would be great. What do we do??? what do I do???

deleted_user 10/02/2008

Hi, I was that bratty youngest child. I am now recently widowed and now can understand what my Dad went through when we lost my Mom.

In 1995 my Mom died unexpectantly, my Dad went into a deep depression and I was the one still at home and took up the role as a companion for him, church, dinners with friends etc. In 1999 my Dad started dating a woman at our church (funny my sister andI had picked her out months before my Dad did) anyway they started dating and next thing I know I am throwing tantrums, being very rude to Irma, I took it out on her not my Dad. Then 1 month after they started dating they were engaged and married six months later.

Before the wedding, I was having a fit becasue my Dad was not coming home at night and getting in in the morning and decisions about my "Moms" house was being made by Irma, not me. I was a true bitch to her, I got drunk at their wedding and was in counseling for 2 years because of this.

My sister and I would get upset becasue my Dad didn't treat my Mom the loving way he treated Irma. They traveled, held hands, went to movies all things never done with Mom. In 2001 Irma was diagnosed with lung cancer and died in 2003. Now my Dad is aone again and I know now what it is like.

In your situation, his daughter, is in my experience because she is protecting her moms role as wife. It really has nothing to do with her execpt that she may think her relationship with her Dad will change and it will but that is what life is all about, change and survival. I wish My Dad would had sat me down and explained that Irma was not replacing Mom as a mom or as the first woman he loved but that Irma made him feel different that Mom, he loved her in a different way, they both weer widows and wanted to enjoy life together. I get that now, but VERY VERY HARD to understand as a child at any age ( I was 27) I guess my advice would be for him to sit down and explain that if her Mom was still alive you would not be in the picture. As uncaring as that sounds it is the truth and the daughter needs to realize that. If Mom was alive Irma would never had been in our lives.

She may take a long time to come around but your happiness and your fiance's happiness is what is important too. She is in college starting her life out.

I don't know if this helped or not but please know that it is normal for the kids to freak out. My brother was okay with the whole thing. Must be a guy thing. Good luck - Sherri

CGRMOM 10/02/2008

Sherri, Thank you for sharing your story and yes it helps. It is good to know that I am not the only one going through this. I think he is afraid to speak to his daughter about the things that you mention but I agree it is important. I told her that I was not trying to replace her mom but that I was honored to play a role on her life as a good friend. I was the one who shopped with her for prom dresses and took her to doctors when she was sick. I spent hours listening to her re: boyfriend problems and we really had a great relationship...until I got the ring. Hopefully conseling will help. Thanks again.

deleted_user 10/02/2008

My daughter has acted out the most and does not speak to the man I am dating. Right after her father died, she was very angry; at me, at her dad, at the world. She is much better now (1 year later), but she still does not speak to my boyfriend. She is a completely different person when he is not around; happy, loving, etc.

At first, I suggested counseling, which just made her angrier. She suggested that I needed counseling and challenged that I did not know how to be alone. Quite frankly, I was/am lonely and don't want to be alone. But, I also know that I'm a different person and I will not jump into anything without wisdom.

Like all those I've heard from, I now do things that I should have done with their father. I should have loved him more and treated him more lovingly when he was alive. Now that I appear more loving to my boyfriend, they misunderstand. I do not care for my BF more, I am simply trying to be a more loving person because I've learned this tough lesson.

My BF has no children, so he is not very tolerant of my daughter's behavior. I know that whatever I choose to do, I will have to be prepared to live with forever. I love my daughter with my whole heart. Because her father's death is so "new", I will not choose my BF over her. She is likely to be married herself within the next 5 years. I think when she is in a loving relationship, she will understand more. Until then, I'm not jumping into anything. I suggest letting the behavior of your fiance be your guide. He is their father and should be strong enough to set the family tone.

Good luck to you and hugs!

CGRMOM 10/03/2008

Dear Chosen One, In time your daughter may come around. Everyone heals differently after the loss of a loved one...some people need years to accept the loss and others move on quicker. There is no right time or wrong time, it's up to the the person who is grieving..no one knows better than them. My fiance's wife is gone 5 years now and the way his daughter is acting you would have thought she passed away recently. I realize she is having a tough time dealing with her Moms death because she feels abandoned and alone..she says no one will ever love her like her Mom and I tell her she is right..a Mothers love is a Mothers love and it is the strongest love of all but you can't hate everyone else who tries to love you just because it's not the same love ahe gave to you. My son is 22 and last night me and my finace had a long talk with him re: his daughter. He said that in the begining of our relationship he did have a problem with..he wasn't ready to share me but as time went on and he seen my happiness he realized that what he was feeling was selfishness and that he needed to let be happy. Your daughter will come around once she heals. try to make your boyfriend understand her and be patient. It will help much better than if he goes against her. I wish you the best..lots of hugs.

deleted_user 10/03/2008

You know something? This girl has got some nerve to be behaving this way! How selfish can a person be! She's trying to manipulate her fathers' life and yours. Don't let her do it! She needs to grow up and realize that her whole life is ahead of her but her Dad has lived a lot of his and has gone through the heartbreak of losing his wife. He now has the chance to have happiness in his older years with you. Counseling might help but if it doesn't then she can just make other arrangements and find another place to live, that's all. She's not 14 years old, after all. Its' not selfish at all to think this way. It's been a long enough time that she should realize that her Dad deserves to be with someone and not be alone. Hopefully, with the counseling, this crisis can be resolved and she'll begin to realize that she has no right to try and run her fathers' life and that he isn't betraying the memory of her mother. If she can't do that, you still have to go on with your lives together. I know what I'm talking about because I lost my husband 2 years ago and I'm still not ready to even look for another man to be in my life. If that ever happens, though, I know my 2 daughters would understand and be happy for me. Maybe, after a few sessions of counseling, you both could try to sit down and talk with her and see if you can reach her, get inside her head and reassure her that the memory of her mother will always be respected and that her dad will always have a spot in his heart for her memory. If not, please tell him not to let his grown daughter ruin the happiness for you both. She has much more time left on this earth than you do. If the two of you love each other no one has the right to deny you that love. It's a lonely world out there, and it's wonderful to find love again after heartbreak. Don't let anyone take it away and feel loneliness and emptiness again.

deleted_user 10/03/2008

I understand what the others are saying, but the feelings that the kids have at the time of a new relationship is real. Their feeling need to be considered, explanations and talks. I guess I relate because I was that person. In my bereavemnet group this discussion comes up a lot. This is a very normal response. She may be taking it too the extreme but the initial feeling is real.

CGRMOM 10/04/2008

Mikeshoney, I understand that his daughters feelings are real and I feel for her for the pain that she is feeling but there is no talking to her, we have tried numerous times...mostly her dad because I try to stay out of it and let them talk without anything being held back because I am there. She does not let him speak...she goes crazy and starts cursing....We have waited years for her to come around and we did all this waiting for her but as time passes by the situation is getting worse. I feel that we have handed control of him and I over to her and I am not sure if this is the right thing to do because it seems to be back firing in our face. I believe if we wait for her okay to get married then we will be waiting till her wedding day which is no where in siight. You should also know that she treated her last two boyfriends the same way she does her dad. Neither of them did enough for her, loved her enough or catered to her the way she expected them to. She use to curse them out too and both guys ended with her after 2 years. I don't want her to hate me because even with all this drama I do love her and when you say kids...there are no kids in this relaionship only grown children and that has to count for something here. I could understand a 12 year old kid doing what she is doing but a young women of 21 is puzzling me. I know the pain is still there at every age but underestanding how Dad would be alone if I wasn't in his life and how her life is all hers now with nothing standing in her way from living it the way she wants makes her actions immature and hard to really understand.

deleted_user 10/27/2008

Being in a relationship also with a widower for 3 years now I believe that the ones that throw temper tantrums (however way they do it)is for themselves - trying to get their own way. Yes I do believe also that we also have different feelings whatever they may be, however; if we are there trying to put a bandaide on all outbreaks they will continue. Who are they controlling - yes the parent and that is exactly what this adult child is doing - CONTROLLING! Counselling - yes it may help but how about just taking the role that is yours and not handing it over to someone that demands it? Be the adult and set ground rules!

cliffskat 10/27/2008

It sounds to me as if both you and your fiance have gone above and beyond to help his daughter and make her understand, and it does sound like he has been trying to be loving and supportive while setting boundaries. Cudos to you both for that! His daughter needs serious counseling, and not just with dad in the room - in fact it may be better if he bows out of that altogether. She has blown two romantic relationships in the same fashion/same behavior. The problem is not with you or your fiance. I think that you should set the wedding date, be clear that you are both there for her but that it is going to happen regardless. You have both put up with enough, and she needs to understand there are limitations, and you are ALL adults now. Temper tantrums are for 2-year olds, not 21-year olds. Enough time has passed that she should understand she is not going to be catered to forever. If it were early on since her mom passed I might think differently, but not after 4 years.

CGRMOM 10/28/2008

Thank you everyone for your comments. I really do love his daughter and we had a great relationship until recently so it really hurts now that she went from loving me to hating me over night. We spent the last two weekends trying to find a place for our wedding and we are going to get married this spring. She is worse thatn ever now and conseling is getting her more angry because the conselor is not agreeing with everything she says. My fiance is trying to explain to her in therapy that this is not abnormal but very normal..most 46 year old men who become widowed will more than likely marry again...she feels it shhould only be when the kids say its okay. She is also telling the conselor that I minipulated her dad into doing this (pretty insulting) and that I took advantage of him back then because he was vulnerable. She really believes all this stuff and it gets me upset because I don't go to the sessions with them so I can't defend myself...he defends me which gets her even more angry and then she insist that he loves me more than her. He comes home from the trip feeling bad for her and I don't feel bad for anything accept the fact that she is missing her mom so much..everything else is just insane.

cliffskat 10/28/2008

She is mentally ill. I could throw a couple of guesses as to which 'disorder' she's got, but basically the professionals should do that. Do not be surprised if they recommend medications for her. Hang in there.... Glad you're still moving forward. Hugs.

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