Rebuilding Marriage After Infidelity Community Group
A community for those who have been through the heartbreak of infidelity and decided to stay with their partner and try to re-build the relationship.
One of my favorite Pet Shop Boys songs is "Jealousy". (woo... yeah, dating myself, but onward I plow...)
Something that comes up heavily during recovery from infidelity is frequently having to wrestle with Jealousy. I wanted to share some of my own coping techniques and maybe hope some of the other old timers could throw in their two cents since I know a lot of folks who are "new" could stand to use a little quick and dirty survival handbook.
Interestingly, during the affair, the unfaithful spouse is often the one with angry and typically unreasonable jealousy - and no wonder. A guilty conscious and a little transference and it's a recipe for jealous disaster. I remember my husband swinging from complete apathy "Mmmhmm... yeah... uh huh, no I'm listening... wait what did you say?" to "WHO ARE YOU TALKING TO? WHAT DID THAT TEXT SAY? WHERE ARE YOU GOING?" and of course, those were huge clues as to what was going on, but I was firmly pulling my blinders on and ignoring those signs.
Post discovery, I was hugely jealous of the other woman, as one might imagine. I was also, surprising to me, jealous of my husband. HE got to go out and explore his passions and desires (or so I imagined in my head). He got to be wild and free and irresponsible. He got to drop responsibilities to go hook up with someone rather than tending work, family, marriage, etc. I wanted steamy sex! I wanted to ditch the kids and go have long talks with someone interesting! I wanted to have someone fawning over me!
It helps, I think, to analyze where these feelings come from. Something I've discussed (ad nauseam, and many thank yous to those who've suffered through them all) in my journal here is how I often would get jealous of what the other woman has, NOT because I want it (been there, done that, quite happy to have moved out of that phase) but because I felt like I should want it. That was my first clue that, oh, it isn't because she IS/HAS/LOOKS/ACTS/WEARS/GOES/DOES/ and I don't, but... because something inside me is broken and sad and wanting and it feels like in the heat of the moment if I had what she had, then I would finally be happy.
(Can you hear my derisive snort from there?)
Here's a great little quote I found online:
"The problem with jealousy is that it masks other feelings and attitudes that are even more hurtful to us and those closest to us. Its intensity is often shielding deep-seated feelings of possessiveness, insecurity or shame. I believe that what lies at the heart of jealousy very often isn't the threat itself, but a drive we have within us to torment ourselves and berate ourselves with self-critical thoughts."
The jealousy I had for the other woman, and indeed, my husband, wasn't because I necessarily wanted those things. I didn't want "some guy" I wanted my HUSBAND to have interesting discussions and steamy sex with and she didn't take that from me. She may (or may not, doesn't matter...) have gotten that from him, but if I wasn't getting that, it had nothing to do with her at any point. That was between he and I. And the more I stewed in my own hatred and jealousy worrying about what she had and did and where she was going and how lovely and wonderful her life was turning out, the less I lived my own life and enjoyed my own husband.
You know, the whole poisoning your own fate, kinda thing...? Yeah. That.
Some folks look deep into the dark crevasses of their heart with fair ease and are able to face what's there and tackle it head on. Not me. Denydenydeny. I wanted to believe it was HER fault I was miserable. I wanted to believe it was HIS fault I was sad. At some point, their choices certainly did sadden and hurt me, but at some point, it was ALL on ME.
I've often written before that when a betrayed spouse can't seem to get images of their spouse and affair partner out of their head during sex to STOP inviting the affair partner into bed. This is no different. The more I ruminated on just how much better SHE had it, the more I was taking the good things I had in my life and just shoving them to the back of some emotional closet.
The fact is, I was (am!) insecure. I was (am!) concerned about my own worth. No one else can fix that for me. No amount of validation or adoration or affection is going to change what goes on in my head because it absolutely 100% has to come from within. My husband's infidelity may have caused me to doubt my worth, but I'm the one who decided to just buy into it 100%. At that point, he didn't fail me - I did.
So. What to does one actually DO to overcome jealousy?
Well, first... I did what I learned to do during my three plus years (yes, I AM a slow learner, thank you) of individual counseling, and that was to take two steps to the right or left (figuratively) and change my point of view. Looking at things differently often helps. Often, I get stuck in what I THINK I see, and not what I actually see. Like I said before, a prime example was: she has ___ so I must need/want that, too! Complete untruth. Some people have monster trucks and are quite happy. I don't have a monster truck, but I can assure you, having one would not in any way alter my happiness level. Some people have 8 kids. Again, I'm quite content not having 8 kids.
The second thing that helped was defining what it was that I actually DID want or need and assessing whether or not I had it. If I had what I wanted/needed, was I acknowledging that? Was I appreciating it? Ahh... and was I expressing that appreciation?? (This is key for our rebuilding since it also built my husband back up and let him know that what he was doing was actually making things better!)
If I wasn't getting what I wanted/needed and that was the root of the jealousy, was it because I wasn't asking for what I needed? Is it because I was asking the wrong person or in the wrong way? (For example, telling my best friend I wished my husband would bring me flowers isn't going to help the situation.) Was I clear and concise in my requests? Generally, I didn't even get this far, because the truth is, I usually was getting - I just wasn't opening myself up to accepting what was being given.
The next thing that was super vital for intense and immediate jealousy (like... the waitress telling my husband he has pretty eyes, for example) and that was to understand my own control over the situation. Growing up a child of alcoholics, control is not something I relinquish easily, and the fact is, about the only thing I control is my own actions and reactions. So, ok, some chick just flirted with my husband. What are my choices? What are the options? What part of this scenario do I control? Can I control whether or not someone compliments (or outright flirts with) my husband? Nope. Can I control what his reaction will be? Nope.
I HATE THAT FEELING.
Holla, yo? You all feel me, you know you do. Helplessness is a sucky thing. And that helplessness feeds into the insecurity which spawns jealousy. Follow what I'm saying?
So, if I take back that control, that helps me immensely.
My husband and I had long talks about how I would feel most comfortable with him responding to situations that would typically leave me jealous. There is comfort in that. It also gives me a sense of control in that I feel like I get a "vote" at least. Granted, it's only a vote, he still is the only one who can control himself.
So then where else do I have control? Well, if this happens in front of me, I have LOTS of control over the situation. I can scream and hiss and jump on the table like a wildcat. Sure, why not? Mmnyeah, hopefully we all know why not. Heh. I can kick the offending person in the shin and pretend it was an accident. (heheh...) I can glare daggers into my husband or angrily accuse him of wrong doing. Or...
I can say, "My husband does have beautiful eyes. I'm lucky to have spent a good part of the last twenty-two years looking into them."
Sure, it's a line a girl would fall for, but I think even guys like my husband get a little melty at sweet words like that. And you know, it says, "Back off, lady," without being rude or mean or whatever. It has also inspired my husband to respond with, "I think my wife's eyes are the most beautiful I've ever seen," at which point said waitress got the clue fast and scooted away to other customers to leave us in sappy lovey dovey bliss.
I got what I wanted - his blue eyes staring into my green ones and the rest of the world faded into a blur around us - and I didn't feel jealous. I took control of the situation peacefully, and kindly, and lovingly.
It also helps that time has dulled the sharp jealousy blades. My mind doesn't go to dark places and invent wild tales every time the phone rings or every time an email comes in or every time a female cashier checks us out. I've learned to take a hard look at what's LIKELY and what's UNLIKELY. Sure, anything is possible, but sometimes the raging jealousy that bubbled up before was completely unfounded based on his affair and not on whatever the current situation is/was. If I stopped and took a hard look at REALITY, I could see that the cashier at the fast food place told EVERY person (male, female, old, young) "see you next time!" and not JUST my husband. If I look objectively, I can see that, um, yeah, she's as disinterested as any 19 year-old working drive through and just trying to get his order and get him moving along as every.other.car.there.
My husband is special - to me - and he is wonderful and sexy and fabulous. But not every freaking woman in the world is dying to be his love slave. That's just silly. And once I realized that, I realized, yeah, I gotta let some of this go and focus on REAL and not IMAGINED.
Anyway, those are some of my thoughts. I'm interested in how you curb your evil green monsters?
Something that comes up heavily during recovery from infidelity is frequently having to wrestle with Jealousy. I wanted to share some of my own coping techniques and maybe hope some of the other old timers could throw in their two cents since I know a lot of folks who are "new" could stand to use a little quick and dirty survival handbook.
Interestingly, during the affair, the unfaithful spouse is often the one with angry and typically unreasonable jealousy - and no wonder. A guilty conscious and a little transference and it's a recipe for jealous disaster. I remember my husband swinging from complete apathy "Mmmhmm... yeah... uh huh, no I'm listening... wait what did you say?" to "WHO ARE YOU TALKING TO? WHAT DID THAT TEXT SAY? WHERE ARE YOU GOING?" and of course, those were huge clues as to what was going on, but I was firmly pulling my blinders on and ignoring those signs.
Post discovery, I was hugely jealous of the other woman, as one might imagine. I was also, surprising to me, jealous of my husband. HE got to go out and explore his passions and desires (or so I imagined in my head). He got to be wild and free and irresponsible. He got to drop responsibilities to go hook up with someone rather than tending work, family, marriage, etc. I wanted steamy sex! I wanted to ditch the kids and go have long talks with someone interesting! I wanted to have someone fawning over me!
It helps, I think, to analyze where these feelings come from. Something I've discussed (ad nauseam, and many thank yous to those who've suffered through them all) in my journal here is how I often would get jealous of what the other woman has, NOT because I want it (been there, done that, quite happy to have moved out of that phase) but because I felt like I should want it. That was my first clue that, oh, it isn't because she IS/HAS/LOOKS/ACTS/WEARS/GOES/DOES/ and I don't, but... because something inside me is broken and sad and wanting and it feels like in the heat of the moment if I had what she had, then I would finally be happy.
(Can you hear my derisive snort from there?)
Here's a great little quote I found online:
"The problem with jealousy is that it masks other feelings and attitudes that are even more hurtful to us and those closest to us. Its intensity is often shielding deep-seated feelings of possessiveness, insecurity or shame. I believe that what lies at the heart of jealousy very often isn't the threat itself, but a drive we have within us to torment ourselves and berate ourselves with self-critical thoughts."
The jealousy I had for the other woman, and indeed, my husband, wasn't because I necessarily wanted those things. I didn't want "some guy" I wanted my HUSBAND to have interesting discussions and steamy sex with and she didn't take that from me. She may (or may not, doesn't matter...) have gotten that from him, but if I wasn't getting that, it had nothing to do with her at any point. That was between he and I. And the more I stewed in my own hatred and jealousy worrying about what she had and did and where she was going and how lovely and wonderful her life was turning out, the less I lived my own life and enjoyed my own husband.
You know, the whole poisoning your own fate, kinda thing...? Yeah. That.
Some folks look deep into the dark crevasses of their heart with fair ease and are able to face what's there and tackle it head on. Not me. Denydenydeny. I wanted to believe it was HER fault I was miserable. I wanted to believe it was HIS fault I was sad. At some point, their choices certainly did sadden and hurt me, but at some point, it was ALL on ME.
I've often written before that when a betrayed spouse can't seem to get images of their spouse and affair partner out of their head during sex to STOP inviting the affair partner into bed. This is no different. The more I ruminated on just how much better SHE had it, the more I was taking the good things I had in my life and just shoving them to the back of some emotional closet.
The fact is, I was (am!) insecure. I was (am!) concerned about my own worth. No one else can fix that for me. No amount of validation or adoration or affection is going to change what goes on in my head because it absolutely 100% has to come from within. My husband's infidelity may have caused me to doubt my worth, but I'm the one who decided to just buy into it 100%. At that point, he didn't fail me - I did.
So. What to does one actually DO to overcome jealousy?
Well, first... I did what I learned to do during my three plus years (yes, I AM a slow learner, thank you) of individual counseling, and that was to take two steps to the right or left (figuratively) and change my point of view. Looking at things differently often helps. Often, I get stuck in what I THINK I see, and not what I actually see. Like I said before, a prime example was: she has ___ so I must need/want that, too! Complete untruth. Some people have monster trucks and are quite happy. I don't have a monster truck, but I can assure you, having one would not in any way alter my happiness level. Some people have 8 kids. Again, I'm quite content not having 8 kids.
The second thing that helped was defining what it was that I actually DID want or need and assessing whether or not I had it. If I had what I wanted/needed, was I acknowledging that? Was I appreciating it? Ahh... and was I expressing that appreciation?? (This is key for our rebuilding since it also built my husband back up and let him know that what he was doing was actually making things better!)
If I wasn't getting what I wanted/needed and that was the root of the jealousy, was it because I wasn't asking for what I needed? Is it because I was asking the wrong person or in the wrong way? (For example, telling my best friend I wished my husband would bring me flowers isn't going to help the situation.) Was I clear and concise in my requests? Generally, I didn't even get this far, because the truth is, I usually was getting - I just wasn't opening myself up to accepting what was being given.
The next thing that was super vital for intense and immediate jealousy (like... the waitress telling my husband he has pretty eyes, for example) and that was to understand my own control over the situation. Growing up a child of alcoholics, control is not something I relinquish easily, and the fact is, about the only thing I control is my own actions and reactions. So, ok, some chick just flirted with my husband. What are my choices? What are the options? What part of this scenario do I control? Can I control whether or not someone compliments (or outright flirts with) my husband? Nope. Can I control what his reaction will be? Nope.
I HATE THAT FEELING.
Holla, yo? You all feel me, you know you do. Helplessness is a sucky thing. And that helplessness feeds into the insecurity which spawns jealousy. Follow what I'm saying?
So, if I take back that control, that helps me immensely.
My husband and I had long talks about how I would feel most comfortable with him responding to situations that would typically leave me jealous. There is comfort in that. It also gives me a sense of control in that I feel like I get a "vote" at least. Granted, it's only a vote, he still is the only one who can control himself.
So then where else do I have control? Well, if this happens in front of me, I have LOTS of control over the situation. I can scream and hiss and jump on the table like a wildcat. Sure, why not? Mmnyeah, hopefully we all know why not. Heh. I can kick the offending person in the shin and pretend it was an accident. (heheh...) I can glare daggers into my husband or angrily accuse him of wrong doing. Or...
I can say, "My husband does have beautiful eyes. I'm lucky to have spent a good part of the last twenty-two years looking into them."
Sure, it's a line a girl would fall for, but I think even guys like my husband get a little melty at sweet words like that. And you know, it says, "Back off, lady," without being rude or mean or whatever. It has also inspired my husband to respond with, "I think my wife's eyes are the most beautiful I've ever seen," at which point said waitress got the clue fast and scooted away to other customers to leave us in sappy lovey dovey bliss.
I got what I wanted - his blue eyes staring into my green ones and the rest of the world faded into a blur around us - and I didn't feel jealous. I took control of the situation peacefully, and kindly, and lovingly.
It also helps that time has dulled the sharp jealousy blades. My mind doesn't go to dark places and invent wild tales every time the phone rings or every time an email comes in or every time a female cashier checks us out. I've learned to take a hard look at what's LIKELY and what's UNLIKELY. Sure, anything is possible, but sometimes the raging jealousy that bubbled up before was completely unfounded based on his affair and not on whatever the current situation is/was. If I stopped and took a hard look at REALITY, I could see that the cashier at the fast food place told EVERY person (male, female, old, young) "see you next time!" and not JUST my husband. If I look objectively, I can see that, um, yeah, she's as disinterested as any 19 year-old working drive through and just trying to get his order and get him moving along as every.other.car.there.
My husband is special - to me - and he is wonderful and sexy and fabulous. But not every freaking woman in the world is dying to be his love slave. That's just silly. And once I realized that, I realized, yeah, I gotta let some of this go and focus on REAL and not IMAGINED.
Anyway, those are some of my thoughts. I'm interested in how you curb your evil green monsters?
To expand on your concept of control, I think one of the things I've learned to quell the green-eyed monster is to spend more energy on improving me. I go out with makeup and decent outfits because it gives me confidence. When women notice my h they won't think why he's with me, lol. When men notice me, I am reminded that I am attractive because I am self-assured and take care of myself. That is definitely within my control.
I recently went back to my martial arts classes and teaching kids which gives me an outlet away from home and useless self-destructive thoughts. The beauty of the martial arts classes is that not only do I work on building up my empowering self-defense skills, there are a lot of old and new friends... many of them are guys. H has made it a point to actually stop in to the studio when before he really showed no interest in my other activities. It keeps him on his toes. Not in a bad insecure way. It just reminds him that he needs to maintain a connection with me or risk losing me. And sadly, it wouldn't take too much after what I've been through. This independence I've carved out for myself is my haven and he can't take that away.
Things us are much better than during his A but still not ideal. There are more moments of intimacy, though. Heck, we gotta keep working towards improving and it's slow going. And yet I draw a lot of comfort from knowing that even if things fall apart, I will get back up and receive points for style.
so, not that my husband has had any kind of interactions or affairs with the women at my daughters elementary school, but he is the PTA president. He has consistently been an active volunteer at the school since our oldest daughter started kindergarten. I do as well, but my schedule is not quite as flexible as his to be there often during the day.it makes me crazy the way these women are so flirty with my husband.I was at a Girl Scout meeting, and talking to one of the new moms from this year who was introduced to me. When I said I was married to the PTA president, she said I didn't think he was married. Bs! He has his wedding ring on at all times and mentions me every time he stands up in front of the school. All I can say is, bitch! It is very hard for me, because since we were near divorce and at the point where the school knew that we were separated and going to be finalizing a divorce everybody assumed that he had an affair even though I never said anything. So there are people who talk about us still, which I could care less about. It is understandable that people will talk as long as they are not ugly about it. It is a curious situation and I understand the curiosity that brings on a conversation about it. But, it makes me crazywhen I am watching how women interact with him from afar. He still does not know how to betray appropriate boundaries. He is too friendly.he is too eager to please everybody to keep everybody happy instead of knowing how to shut inappropriateness down.I have men hit on me all the time. It is second nature to me 2 distract or ignore or blatantly mention my husband. He doesn't have that.anytime I observe him around women, he always nervously asks me if he did okay.I finally told him that he's a grown man and he should know whether or not how he acts as appropriate or not. We would expect our children to know how to behave so he should too.I would not B his guide any longer as to whether or not he was doing the right thing. That had to come from him.
Thanks for the responses. :)
And Heather, mmmm... girl... Two thumbs up for this comment, "It is understandable that people will talk as long as they are not ugly about it. It is a curious situation and I understand the curiosity that brings on a conversation about it."
It was easy for me to forget that I used to be curious and go, "Um... wait, what just happened here??" about OTHER people when the tables were turned and I was the one living the drama and trauma. Eventually, I got it, but I wish someone had smacked me with that reality stick earlier.
Read my note titled "A dose of his own med." I've been "rubbing it into him" all day. The trouble is, he's not threatened or worried (like I used to not worry about him).
Although I don't want to strain our marriage in any way, I'd love to figure out a way to give him a little"taste of his own medicine". I think it would be good for him to realize that I'm 'sure thing'. Does that make sense?
Lemme try that again.
jillarie51: YES - I totally relate to the "dose of his own medicine" - but... and this is super important, so please read this carefully:
Will a dose of his own medicine get YOU what you REALLY want?
A lot of people feel the need to prove either to their partner or to themselves that they are still desirable after being betrayed, but that's such a dangerous line to dance. I've seen it happen pretty often where a betrayed spouse will try to stir up jealousy, or will try to get even in some small way, only to find him or herself right smack in the middle of an affair, too.
Two wrongs don't make a right.
I may be way off base, but I suspect that you REALLY want is for your husband to desire and long for YOU, right? Him getting angry and upset because someone else wants you doesn't really achieve that. I suspect you want him to understand and respect the pain he caused you, but I seriously doubt that you actually want to hurt him. Not really.
Even in my most vengeful, hateful, mean spirited stages, I knew I wanted to love and be loved. I wanted a mutually loving and passionate marriage. I knew I wanted a deep partnership filled with respect and joy.
Here's the mantra I have etched into my brain and pull up with EVERY choice I make regarding my husband: "Is this Destructive or Constructive?"
As shtmyhbdid so eloquently described: take control and be the VERY best you that you can be. Be smart and pretty and wise and fun and sexy - build yourself up! Feel good about yourself. THAT will cause more regret in your husband than seeing other men hurling themselves at you because then he can see just how much he nearly lost. Or he won't see it, and who cares, because you will STILL be the best you that you can be, right?
Hey, don't get me wrong. Revenge fantasies of all sorts (images of shampooing the OW's hair with Nair, thinking about scrubbing the cat box with huz's toothbrush, day dreams of running away to a foreign country to find a sexy latin lover...) were balms on my angry soul during my healing process, but keeping them to brief fantasies gave me a smirk or a laugh and then I could move back on track to being constructive, which is ultimately what has brought me the most happiness.
Just saying. :)
BUT -- when he is complacent (or not threatened) by the thought of me with another man, it makes ME think that HE thinks I'm not desirable to anyone else.
In actuality, he's probably just as trusting of me as I WAS of him.
It may not be probable, but it's always possible.
I went through about 4 months at first where we were rebuilding but I had made it clear I did not consider our marriage any kind of limit on my choices and what I might do. I was very believable because he still has not gotten past that healthy amount of jealousy with me...and I love it. Though I know he still cannot fully comprehend the depth of the pain he caused me. He empathizes and has remorse, but it is like feeling bad for someone who lost a spouse or child. You can try to imagine the pain, but you don't get it if you haven't been there.
I think being flirted with especially when somebody knows he's married was a trigger. I'm not sure if that's still how he feels but at that time I needed to hear he reacted the way he did.
I too create and I'm my own insecurities and need to work in them. I don't feel my h does anything to make me feel that way.
Thank you for this post allora
I went through about 4 months at first where we were rebuilding but I had made it clear I did not consider our marriage any kind of limit on my choices and what I might do. I was very believable because he still has not gotten past that healthy amount of jealousy with me...and I love it. Though I know he still cannot fully comprehend the depth of the pain he caused me. He empathizes and has remorse, but it is like feeling bad for someone who lost a spouse or child. You can try to imagine the pain, but you don't get it if you haven't been there.
He answered it's because he trusts me!! Then he added that he thinks that other men also find me desirable, and if he should die,(heaven forbid) I would have no trouble finding someone else. That was nice to hear (like a compliment) but don't agree with him on that point. He is MY 'one and only' ever. God made us specifically for each other. There will never be anyone else.