Totally, KatB . . . I don't feel guilty about not going, but I feel like I don't fit in a church anymore.

Hi, Well, I feel very easily shamed and guilty regards work. If I can't make a shift, or am too tired, I feel so bad. And if I finally quit a job because I'm too tired - I just feel so guilty. I, too, forget I have PTSD. OR downplay it.

Dbpalm, u don't pertain to any church? I feel exactly the same way- im just not completely there. If u don't mind my asking, does any of your traumas come from there?

Nelliefay, talking about work, i have been jobless since July- I was discharged. Not the best feeling in the world. I am scared of getting a job and not being able to maintain it due to ptsd.

I think that it depends why you feel like you don't fit in at church. If it is the non-belief in G-d, then it makes a lot of sense not to go and not feel guilty about not going. You have simply changed your beliefs and maybe someday you will believe again and maybe you won't. Feeling guilty about not going does not help you at all. If you are not going to church because you feel you don't fit in with the other people at church, like you feel they don't want you there or they are all looking at you, then that's different. I go to synagogue and I do believe in God, however I have a lot of anger against God and I am not sure that I have the faith to be praying to him. But I go to synagogue regularly because it gives me socialization and I love the singing of the prayers. I am part of Jewish community there and that makes me feel good. I go to classes there and have met some people I like there. So, for me I consider it more of a feel good place and don't worry a lot about how I feel about God.

I think if you are not going for the second reason, then it's good to find someplace to go where you do feel comfortable, as staying home all the time and not having some socialization can actually make yourself feel worse that way. There are so many different types of churches, and alternative type churches, that you could try some out and see if one fits. Even if you don't go to services, maybe there would be activities that you would like. On the other hand, you could find other ways to socialize with people that has nothing to do with religion at all. Either way, you have to take care of yourself and if being in church right now makes you feel worse, then it's not the place for you to be. Maybe even find something else to do right at the time you would ordinarily go to church. The point is to do what feels right to you and not feel guilty about not doing something that is not good for you. I don't believe in a vengeful God and I don't believe you will go to hell or be struck down if you don't go to church.

I wish you well in whatever you decide, but find a way to make peace with the fact that church is not meeting your needs just now and that that is okay.

I'm a teacher now, but I used to be a hospital chaplain in healthier days. I learned one on one with patients that I had a deep spiritual life, but that my PTSD keeps me from being comfortable in groups. So I took that into account regarding my church attendance and was patient with myself. Before realizing that, I'd been really hard on myself about not feeling comfortable in crowds at church. Now I realize it's about the crowds, not about the church. Not everyone accepts my explanation, and I'm sure there may be those who judge me spiritually, but I know the truth, and I'm able to speak it here, so it's ok.

Kat,

Yes, I hear you say that you don't want to hear about opening your heart to God and you know about God, I beg to differ. The keyword here is about... is it not?

To begin with, if you truly knew God and not about him, guilt would not be a factor because you'd already know (note I did not say believe) that there is nothing you could possibly do that would take away God's love from you. Nothing, zilch, nada.

Then there is the opening your heart to God issue that's a stickler for many. Opening your heart is not what you've been told it is. It is actually the art of surrendering to love, and thus since God is love that is what opening your heart to God means, nothing less, nothing more. Opening your heart to love, and allowing it to be a constant source in your life simply by closing your eyes and feeling it without judgment.

Then, there is the church bit, well I have an inkling that somewhere you've been told that being absent from church carries a stiff penalty, well, truth be told, God is all, everything and there is nowhere on this huge universe that God is not, so, based on that, we can deduce two things: 1) That God needs nothing from us and best of all 2) God does not need to be worshiped anywhere in particular, and least of all worshiped... period.

So perhaps now that you are having this existential crisis, you may want to start anew in your own concept of who God is to you, (no one else) and create a communion with the divine as you see fit.

God to me is not a "person" but a very personal experience, experiencing the divine every day, in every way. It is a conscious habit that gives the best results and you'll see the results in your life. I have been able to heal myself from addictions, from anxiety, you name it, I simply live by that principle, whatever I need, God will provide, not right away but eventually, yes. When it is not in tangible ways, it is in the form of an answer or a dream.

Like they say, going to church does not make you a devout believer, anymore that going to McDonald's on a regular basis makes you a hamburger.

Guilt is a paralyzing and useless emotion, so my advice is to get rid of it. There's no crime committed here. I, personally, left the church and me and God are a thick as thieves,why? Because I know that God is within me 24/7, 365 days a year and not needing me to worship, after all only the ego needs worship to exist.

Lastly, if you truly knew God, you'd love yourself as God loves you and guilt/shame and the other not so great sister would not even enter your mind because you'd knew that any of those negative emotions keep you from feeling that source of unconditional love, that may I say only exists in animals on this plane because they have no ego.

If more of us gave up the need to suffer through life and we started to rely more on God (Source Energy) our lives would not be as taxing. Trust me, I used to think I'd be plagued all my life with depression, anxiety, addictions, low self esteem, etc. Then, one day, I discovered that all I needed was to go within for the answers.

Do you know when I start having adjustment problems? When my ego takes over and I forget who created me can also (will also) get me out of my jam. All I need to do is to be open to the suggestion/hint, even if it's something that requires me to have complete trust and faith.

After all, I can safely say this: No matter how horrible something I went through was, and I have had some ghastly things happen to me that would make anyone cry for mercy, I eventually came out of it not just okay but better than I was before. So I put my all trust in God, not man. God has ALWAYS had my back. I cannot say the same for humans, can you?

My two ruble's worth,
Wolf

Reply5: i don't believe its wrong to feel the way we do. I agree that others may disagree with your opinion. In some way, i disagree. Sometimes, it can be both the church and the crowds. I believe i have a hard time distinguishing one from another. Crowds do make me feel unsafe but maybe the church plays a role, somehow. I think its more the closed environment with the crowds... that's what it is for me.

Reply6: WolfiePa, a lot to digest from your words. I would have to break it down. I believe in what you are saying about the love of God and that God himself is love.i also believe that we, i mean the religious society, are brought up to believe that we are wrong or will receive punishment if we don't visit or go to our church or synagogues. You brought up the omnipresent part of God.

It brings me back to the days where I was a devote Christian and believed that He was omnipresent, omniscient. Experience and tragedies obscure our vision of God's love, grace and presence. We don't see things clearly and it becomes dark and muddy and slippery when taking the road to seeing God for who he is taken or re-counciled. PTSD shouldn't be blamed for us feeling guilty and ashamed because of traumas lived through; how can a loving God love me enough to go through what I have gone through and still allow me to libe after it? That's the real question for me.

You are right. My own concept of God would need to be re-evaluated to His real truth of His love towards us.

Kat,

You asked, "how can a loving God love me enough to go through what I have gone through and still allow me to live after it?"

I used to ask myself that question and even asked: how could a allegedly loving God could force me to go through all those ghastly experiences and still be called a loving God?

For decades I asked that those questions it made no sense to me,. and I had to literally ditch all I have been told about who God was and everything in between.

What I discovered was that every single ghastly incident led me to find these gems within me:

1) Every incident showed me that my inner strength was not only abundant but also easily accessible, all I needed to do was remember I had what it took to make it through

2) Every incident led me to discover something new and awesome about myself that I would have never known for myself otherwise.

3) Every incident taught me a valuable lesson in life, as to what to do next time or even what not to do. But that lesson would have never been learned otherwise, that''s the key part there.

4) Every incident challenged me to step out of my deep ingrained beliefs (either given by others or self imposed) and forced me to look at the incident from a different angle, instead of the victim mode I was operating under as a means for defense.

5) And every time I was able to look at it with detachment I saw that every incident was necessary for me to learn something about myself, life, etc. I then moved to gratitude, instead of dread.

6) Lastly and this was the hardest for me to swallow and even accept and that was: Somewhere in my soul, I had requested that experience so that I would be able to evolve as a person. In other words: every time my soul noticed I was stuck, I found myself being challenged by ghastly incidents and they stopped, as soon as I not only saw the lesson but also stopped seeing myself as a victim of circumstances.

So, in short, God loved me enough to grant me my wish to evolve and not only provided the circumstances but also the inner strength and courage to go through them and thrive.

Just so you have an idea of what ghastly life I lived, I can safely say one of those ghastly experiences where as a child I had been abused in every configuration possible, verbally and otherwise, it seemed that I could not cross the street without some pervert/abuser wanting my attention.

Yet every time, it would happen, I would be perplexed enough to ask myself what on earth I was doing to cause this. Not as a guilty
response but as a serious question to find an answer.

That question went on for years, decades until I decided to get to the bottom of it and then I came to insights I described above.

The mere instant that I stopped seeing my life from the victim perspective, everything changed for me. So hence why I speak of God in those terms because were it not for God, I would not be here sane and rational. I did not want to be a survivor, I wanted to live and living I am.... To me, the God of religion is so darn small, I cannot fathom why many settle for that microscopic concept.

Then one day, a few decades back, I saw the title of a book called, "How big is your God?" while I read the book and did not come to much new information, the question led me to the insight that I was operating all my life with a microscopic concept of God and my life could not improve so long as I held that tiny notion and then one night, I felt God's love for me. You know that passage of Paul where he says that God's love is one that passes understanding?

Well, it does. Not only that but any word to describe it f would fail miserably. All I can say is that once you feel it, you will no longer want to limit God to any religion because that would make God so tiny, that you could not even find God in the most sophisticated electron microscope.

Hugs,
Wolf

Wolfie, you wrote:

"Like they say, going to church does not make you a devout believer, anymore that going to McDonald's on a regular basis makes you a hamburger.'

Ha! Good one. Now that I think on it, looks like I know a few folks who mistakenly but firmly believe themselves to be hamburgers! :-)