I haven't heard of the film... I'll have to look for it

I don't know if this is quite the same thing but I look for reasons to be grateful for things in my life even when they're things that have hurt me

I find that gratitude always lessens the load and I am always able to find things to be grateful for.... They're always there when you look for them

I found DS because I was hurting so much caregiving my folks.... I had just done my Dad's palliative care at home and my mom was failing.... I was a wreck and so angry

I had just gotten my first computer and had a couple of lessons via tutoring and I found this site and it was a God send.... Truly saved me.... I was having some terribly dark thoughts at that time

I will be forever grateful.... I don't know that I would have looked for online help if things had been different in my life ...xo

I still need to compartmentalize the tragedies from the growth which grows out of the pain. Gratitude for those hard and bitter lessons is still somewhere between difficult and impossible for me, but it is getting easier to appreciate the "Collateral Beauty," such as opening ourselves to possibilities we never would have tried without the compelling needs born of those hard and/or bitter lessons.

Even when I can't get that close to my pain, gratitude make any day easier.

I never heard of it either, sorry

Gotta check it out, arfie. They have got Netflix here, just sometimes with a different selection. We will see if they have got that one.

I didn't much like the movie. The title is what provoked the most thought.

Thanks for this reflection Arfie. (Sometimes the title is the best part of a book or movie. I had fun coming up with titles when I worked/volunteered for a publishing company but I don't think I came up with anything nearly that good). One really good moment that felt a bit like collateral beauty came to me a while back. I'd been getting letters from one of my childhood abusers in response to one I had sent to them earlier, in which I named what had happened, that it wasn't my fault and wasn't OK. I just didn't want it to be a secret I carried alone anymore. Anyway, I hadn't been able to respond to these cards and letters they were sending in response because my abuser kept insisting I forgive them while not really admitting they had done anything to me. Anyway, I did finally respond to one as honestly as I could, asking what made it possible for them to forgive those who had harmed them (I didn't know details but had a good sense that they had also been abused). They sent a letter in reply that was honest and brave, naming what had happened to them and saying that while, because of memory lapses/dissociation, they didn't remember what they had done to me, they knew that there had been things they had done and trusted that my experience was real. The answer they gave about what helped them forgive: that they knew that something similar must have happened to their abusers, didn't fully resonate for me though. I couldn't forgive them (or myself) just because I felt sorry for them (or, by extension, for myself). Then a while later, after a moment of being shown a lot of love, I had this insight that permitted me to finally have a taste of forgiveness, something I knew I wanted but couldn't, up to that point, understand let alone feel. My insight was that if, after everything that had happened to me and all the bad choices I have made, there is still something in me that is beautiful enough to be worthy of that kind of love, then surely there is something beautiful like that in my abusers too, even if I will never see it. I've often thought of peoples' shadows (all that shadow psychology stuff) and understand that there are also light shadows. Like I had an uncle who was really violent to a lot of people, hurt a lot of people, but was really kind to my mother when she needed him most. The harsh face he showed the world wasn't the only part of his psyche. He had a bright shadow that most people would never see. It didn't make everything else OK--far from it--but it was also real. And forgiveness for me is about what is. It isn't about minimizing at all, just really looking for what's true and what life is made of, at its core. All of it.

I’ll have to find this movie on Netflix, Artie. I have not seen it. I think for myself that while my traumas have provoked fear, lost trust and disability that may have had a negative impact on my life, at the same time made me realize that those who inflicted the trauma may have had events in their life causing them to act out in away that may be out of character for them. Can I forgive? I am trying, but when I see repeated behaviors that inflict pain over and over again, it’s hard to forgive and I have to find acceptance that they may never change, but I have to move on and try to live my life......”Healing doesn’t mean that the trauma never happened, it just means you have control over your emotions”.

As the concept simmers in the background of kid summer activity, I find myself reluctant to define the collateral beauties born of the tragedies in my life. Like butterflies and bird song, they are clearly there and worthy of appreciation, but words simply cannot do them justice.

I just want to add something to my comment because forgiveness is one of those things that are used by those who want to hold people down and can be wielded like a weapon by people with power. It was inappropriate and hurtful for my abuser to keep insisting that I forgive them. It felt like they wanted to be freed from responsibility and have a "peaceful" relationship with me. The same person also suggested that we heal together and I told them to look for a therapist instead. The only reason I even thought about forgiveness was for my own freedom/self healing and I knew when and if it happened it had to be on my terms. The forgiveness or whatever it was that I experienced empowered me to reach out to that person again, tell them again that I was OK with them continuing a mutually beneficial relationship with my mum and that I hoped they would find healing (interesting that I never actually said I forgave them, I'm just noticing that now). Another thing that has maybe been a beneficial side effect of trauma is that I really love to sing. That has been something I've held onto and has provided lots of solace, slow exhalations, and, (maybe less healing but more just diversion), a chance to escape. Drawing has also been a joy that I got from my mum (also someone who experienced trauma, more than me), and we used to do stuff with puppets too. More recently I also have been studying and working as a therapeutic clown artist. The beauty and joy in my clients elevates me so much as I also am continually trying to access and hold my own joy and humanity (to me the essence of real clown work). I'm lucky to be with a company/nonprofit that understands the needs of clown artists, gives a lot of reflective practice sessions, insists we work with a partner and never more than part time to avoid burn out. I guess you couldn't ask for a better job when it comes to self-care and healing. And I know that all these passions/interests have been born out of trauma. The need to express myself when I am socially afraid, the need to show love when it is so hard for me to hold it and trust it. The need to express what words can't express. The need to escape from myself, at least my traumatized self. I think that maybe fits the category of collateral beauty. I love your metaphors Arfie. There is nothing quite like bird song or butterflies. The thrill of beauty that is so unselfconscious and embodied. The way birdsong feels inside my body, how it actually gets in to places in my heart/soul/spirit? that nothing else can. And there I go, not doing them justice!

Hey, speaking of collateral beauty to you there in Texas, arfie, there a tribute concert to the late great Texan singer Jerry Jeff Walker, writer of the song “Mr. Bojangles.” He died in the fall of 2020, but with the pandemic and teaching from home with no college help, I missed it. It’s kind of cruel of fate that he died of throat cancer, singer that he was. The tribute was last night because by now vaccinated the artists could gather. My hero Steve Earle was one of them. Last night's tribute isn’t up on Youtube yet, but there’s a fall 2020 2 hour solo tribute by Walker’s friend singer Todd Snider. I’m watching it now. He knows a lot of inside stories that are pretty cool.

I first heard about Jerry Jeff Walker through being introduced to Willie Nelson and the Texas outlaw country singers in college.. It turns out that Jimmy Buffet was a friend of Walker’s, too, which makes me glad I went to see Buffet back in the States.

I had the misfortune of partying with Jerry Jeff Walker. On hearing this news of his death, I had to go out on the porch and sing a few rounds of "Ding Dong the Witch is Dead" before I could respond. The man took his outlaw image a tad bit too seriously.

I'm having a bit of trouble connecting the dots of "Forgiveness" and "Collateral Beauty." To my heavily theraputed mind, forgiveness doesn't have much to do with the person I am forgiving, nor is it a guarantee of renewed relationships. To me, forgiveness is about letting go of the pain of the injury. It happened. With acceptance and forgiveness of the facts, I can let the healing begin.

I guess I see forgiveness as a therapy tool more than a collateral beauty.