Physical & Emotional Abuse Support Group
Abuse is a general term for the treatment of someone that causes some kind of harm (to the abused person, to the abusers themselves, or to someone else) that is unlawful or wrongful. No one deserves abuse, period. Abuse can be emotional, physical, or sexual.
In retrospect, I realize that there were warning signs I ignored with my two exes. But some behaviors I am still trying to figure out if they were abusive or just a man being happy he found himself a great woman and trying to "mark his territory". For examples, being called several times a day in the honeymoon stage and/or asking in the conversations what were you doing or where have you been. Eventhough I have read articles and even a book called "Why Does He Do That: Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men" by Lundy Bancroft, I realize that each resource made it clear that the abusers' behaviors are sometimes hard to notice since they are good at being subtle.
So how is a woman suppose to know if she is overreacting or he is abuser trying to ensnare her? Any insight would be greatly appreciated.
So how is a woman suppose to know if she is overreacting or he is abuser trying to ensnare her? Any insight would be greatly appreciated.
In addition, if they do something repeatedly and you've stated you don't like/appreciate it or you've asked them not to, and they keep doing it, then they aren't respecting you.
Ultimately, trust your inner knowing. If you don't like the behavior, there's a reason. If you feel uneasy, uncomfortable, afraid, nervous, etc. then there's a reason. If you end up with a stomach or head ache or some other body discomforts, there's a reason.
Trust your instincts. You don't really have to know the exact reason why. Your body &/or your 'higher self' knows.
Thanks for your reply.
I realize sometimes that when a man is asking where you've been and/or what you're doing it could be curiosity. But sometimes it is hard to discern whether or not I am taking it the wrong way because of my past experience. I have noticed that my background has caused me to be defensive when the guy is just being curious.
I get what your saying but unfortunately it is not always so black and white. I have asked a woman if a man calls you several times a day to chat, is that considered controlling and/or excessive. She stated that it depends on the relationship.
If anyone asked me "where have you been?" I would be a bit taken aback. It's not their business. It might be if we had a plan to meet at a certain time & I was an hour late and didn't call to let them know. But even so, it's really not their business. Maybe it would be ok IF I was in a long term committed relationship and that question wasn't asked very often. But it would also depend on their tone of voice & body language & other behavior patterns.
The honeymoon stage you mentioned is part of the abuse cycle. If you are w/someone who is abusive and are in the honeymoon stage, and they ask several times a day where you've been, THAT should be a big fat red flag. Its about CONTROL.
If you hadn't mentioned the honeymoon stage, I would say the following:
Look at the pattern. It might be normal for someone in a committed relationship to ask, say, at the end of the day, 'what did you do today? go anywhere interesting?
BUT, if you're in ANY kind of a relationship and they ask every time you talk during the day, then that's a big fat red flag.
It also helps to pay attention to how you feel when those behaviors are put upon you. Do you feel smothered? Do you resent being asked? Do you feel queasy? Are you worried that if you say the wrong thing, what will they think/say/do?
If you do respond, do they act like they're either approving or disapproving. Are they critical of what you did/where you went? Or do they say something like, hey, that sounds like fun.
But still, regardless of what kind of relationship or how long term it is, if they ask that many times...it's a red flag.
Thanks for the added detail.
I realized I used the wrong terminology (i.e. honeymoon stage). What I meant is at the beginning of a relationship when everything is new and you and the other person is excited about being with one another.
One thing I realized from your response is that I need to learn how to not overshare and to set firmer boundaries in my interactions with the "inquisitive" individuals.
Thanks for being continuously supportive and not judgmental. I realize from this forum that I have a lot to learn before I can move forward with relationships in the future.
WHEN did the man start asking? How does he ask? And if you slow down the pace/intensity, how does he react?
Basically what MTC said...
And if you aren't sure if the person is just being kind vs controlling, I'd say that it's best not to date since your internal gears are spinning out of control. Time to take a step back and work on resting your internal compass.
Hugs.
MTC has written.
To expand on something
that Deli just said, (about
slowing things down),
here's a suggestion:
Observe carefully
his response when
he doesn't get his
way about something.
When narcissists and
other abusers are
frustrated, their
expression is often
way more intense
than other people,
sometimes over
the top and
occasionally extreme,
even going into a rage.
No one enjoys being
frustrated, contradicted
or criticized but abusers
often react with noticable
anger and also frequently
will become hostile
and offensive.
Also, beyond asking
where you are, is he
noticably POSSESSIVE?
Also, notice if he begins
to try to cut you off from
people, activities and
things that give you
pleasure.
If he just wants to know
what you're doing and
you want to tell him,
that's one thing.
If he wants to know
you're every move
regardless of how
much you choose
to tell or not tell him,
that's a blazing
red flag to me.
Him asking the questions isn't the problem. The problem would be if you felted compelled to please him... THAT is were the problem lies...
People can try to control us. we don't have to let them.
It is much easier to lay the ground rules with a new guy.. If he has any thought of controlling you, he will find out right away that you do what you want, when you want and how you want. He will know you are a woman with "no shame in your game" and you know that you have the right to go anywhere you please, do anything you want. Because you should and there is nothing wrong with that.
And what IF a guy calls you 6 times a day? If you don't feel like talking. Let it go to voicemail. Do what YOU want to do... Don't feel compelled to think.. "well, I have to answer the phone, cause he is a callin" .. If he asks why didn't you pick up. be honest. Say.. I was doing work, I had other things to do... If he gets angry.. that will be your clue. That his wants are more important than your wants.
The best way to prevent "abuse" is to NOT give your personal power away. Don't stand for being treated in a way YOU would never treat someone... as in.. would you call a person 6 times a day, or wouldn't you think that would be a little obsessive... so if you wouldn't do it to someone. Don't let anyone do it to you. You don't have to get mad, or worry that they will. We should all be free to do what we want... we shouldn't ask others to do for us what we can do for ourselves... and we shouldn't fear another person's anger or reaction. Be honest and set boundaries. those two things are not bad things and then...
"Those who mind don't matter. and those who matter ( or will matter) won't mind"
Cause if you have to do something you don't want to do in order to keep some guy around.. you really are better off being alone.
Someone who asks the same question (especially "where have you been?" over and over on the same day, is more than likely grooming his potential 'source.' So that does make it harmful
If, by some SLIM chance this guy who asks that question over and over isn't abusive, he probably has some other toxic issues. And it would still be a red flag.
People SHOW US WHO THEY ARE. BELIEVE THEM.
Further, when in an abusive relationship, even in the beginning, its NOT safe to exert our power or make choices contrary to the abuser. THAT can put our lives at risk. That's why many of us urge others to make a SAFE plan to leave and then leave, but only if they can do so safely.
You said:
"Him asking the questions isn't the problem. The problem would be if you felted compelled to please him... THAT is were the problem lies..."
While that is a problem, it's not the only problem!!! And the way you wrote it comes across as blaming at worst, inflammatory at best. Either way, it's not fully accurate.
Anyone who asks for insight isn't asking to be blamed. They are trying to learn. And there are less harsh ways to offer insight.
You mentioned being honest and setting boundaries. THAT doesn't work w/abusers. All that does is give them more ammunition!
The ONLY way boundaries work is to set them for ourselves & then keep them. For example: He calls me too many times a day. I will ask him to stop once. If he doesn't (or he does & then starts again), I'm gone. No explanations, no apologies. Go Total No Contact and make sure you do everything you can to stay SAFE.
BUT that only works in the beginning of a relationship and sometimes that doesn't always end things because the abuser will continue to try to keep sucking us back into their lair.
Your suggestions may work with non-abusers, but they rarely work with abusive people.
There are too many stories of women who do exactly what you suggest and they end up injured or dead. And even more who were killed or injured when they stayed but tried to take their power back.
Even if your suggestions worked for you (and that's great if it did), everyone is different and what you suggested rarely works w/abusers.
I think the big mystery is WHEN does a person you do not know go from that status to an acquaintance to an abuser???
That magical line is key.
So I think what Shasta means is the FIRST TIME you see an indication that this person may be an abuser, you say, "Buh-bye."
But once you are so deep into it, then yes, it can be dangerous to all of a sudden put up those boundaries they are not used to having.
I think the key is to have those boundaries FIRMLY in your head before ever engaging in a relationship.
Thanks for your input.
Because I am still learning everything there is about abusers' games and I am working on trusting myself, I have not started dating since my divorce 8 years ago. But nonetheless, I am have had experiences since then with men who have boundary issues (i.e. not knowing how to take no for answer when they pursued me) which has taught me these are warning signs instead of what society considers as a guy who is really interested in a lady and she should be "flattered". smh. Sigh. I realized I have been brainwashed with so much bull starting as a little girl that I have to work to undo.
What you just stated makes a lot of sense. I realized the danger with the first encounter with a guy at the library whose was interested in me. I told him several times as nice as possible I was not interested. When I became frustrated with the last time and was firm in my no, he decided to badmouth me to someone I know. smh. Although one would say that he is just being a guy who had his ego bruised when I was a teenager, I realize as an adult that this is apart of abuse. smh. I also realize in reminiscing of my childhood through teenage years that a lot of things guys do to girls (i.e. hitting them because they "like" them, pulling her hair for the same reason, etc.) is socially acceptable. Therefore, society has always promoted mysognistic behavior and I did not realize that I bought into it. Well, now I know a little better so now I am on a mission to know a lot better.
Thank you for the added info. I have witnessed the overt anger of men when they can't get their way with a woman. But what is the most scariest is the anger that is hidden or passive aggressive. For example, hiding a woman's keys so she can't leave and pretending not to have seen them when she asks about them. Another example, is a past friend told me that for years her then-husband had been little by little telling his best friend negative things about her (in addition to other men In their community) and then came back and told her that he did it. And he did this because she wanted to leave the marriage and to ruin any chances of her marrying anyone else (he is very much well known in many states). Sigh. And thing is that she stated the first year of marriage he was very sweet and kind and then after that, he would go into rages.
After doing a lot of reading and talking to women about this matter, I realize that it is very scary out here for women since we are one of the vulnerable populations. I know I don't want to stay alone forever but I am terrified because I know that all abusers do not necessarily read from the same script and don't always show their true colors in the beginning.