You are probably not toxic to anyone.

If an obsession comes from a fear based perspective, then you'll be better when the cause of the fear has been alleviated.

If an obsession comes from anger at a deep level, you won't get better until you've addressed the anger that supports the obsession.

If the deep down anger is there, it's probably from a sense of being shamed and insulted by the failure of the relationship.
Anger can hide in a number of ways...

That post made me worry too. I'm glad it's not just me that had that reaction.

I think I was far more obsessed with him throughout the entire relationship than he ever was with me. I don't think I controlled him though (although I keep worrying in case maybe I did). He definitely did control me though.

It is not fear I don't think as he is not even calling or texting me anymore. Moved on to greener pastures I suppose once again. Seems to be his pattern. Fear would only be when he is controllive and obsessive with me like he was in the beginning both times. He would call or text until he got a reply from me. In the very beginning he would get so frantic he would facebook post until i called him for me to call him.
Anyway, I think I got to where I equated my value with how much emphasis he put on me, how much attention he paid to me. Not sure if that makes sense? He would frighten me with his intensity but yet I would be flattered to be honest.
I know that is messed up, but I am being honest. Coming from a home that didn't seem to pay any attention to the child that worked so hard at getting good grades and being the good child, the child that was pushed away, the one who never really recieved affection, well, when someone starts showing you affection, attention and focusing on YOU, even if it is in a negative way at times, oddly enough, when the focus is off, your undone.

Maybe I am angry that someone who made me the center of their world and made so many promises, who "adored" me, who kept reassuring me to let my walls down and let him in, was a smokescreen? So yeah, I am ashamed and insulted that I am still that foolish child. I should of kept my walls up.

I commented on that post a few different times. I don't believe obsession is necessarily a sign of being abusive unless it is followed by unfounded accusations and an attempt to isolate. I don't think obsessing about the relationship when it's over is unnatural because it's difficult to reconcile the way we were treated, abusively, with what we were told, that we were loved. Love and abuse are direct opposites and obsession has nothing to do with love. In my case my obsession occured during the relationship because I was being lied to but I wanted proof, i felt like i needed to catch him and eventually i did but still it wasn't enough of a reason fro me to leave him and that was after he already had a history of being disrespectful towards me by making snide remarks, standing me up and making me wait extended amounts of time while he talked to other women. Obsession is imo a problem because again imo it's unhealthy and it doesn't change the abuser or the circumstances and it won't stop a liar or a cheater from lying and cheating. For me his abuse was very covert and subtle and so i kept doubting myself and my judgement as I believe that is what all of us have done that have been in emotionally abusive relationships.
if your obsession is interferring with your ability to function and enjoy life then it's time imo to get help.
It helps to really learn to understand and to practice detachment.
And it helps even more to keep reminding yourself that you were not responsible for HIS behavior.

It's easy to chase a mirage in a desert.

A lot of people can meet our needs. Desiring the "bad boy" is part of wanting a piece of his "power". Unfortunately, that "power" comes at a cost.

Perhaps, like the little guy who walks his Doberman's on a leash, you'd like to be a bit like him...and the Dobermans represent what you'd secretly like to be...but sense you can't be.

Power is a tremendous aphrodisiac.

I would like to be able to "play" at life and not suffer the repurcussions as he gets to. I would like to be able to con and not feel badly about the effects it has on the mark. So yes, I guess in the respect, I envy his power.
What I do not envy is that no matter how big the dog is or how powerful his bite, thier is always another dog ready to take his place.
I am not in competition with any dogs at least so I don't have that particular worry hanging on me.
Also I can take some comfort in the fact that I do have a conscience and though I may hurt others, it is unintentional. So that is my power I suppose. I feel we all have our own power, we just don't always realize our potential.

Uhhh...............NO Tigertales.
First of abusers are not powerful, they are weak and cowardly.
And as far as people who have bad dogs being bad or powerful........that may be the image they want to project but
They don't impress me or intimidate me.
Wanting to be like their dog on a leash.........what are you smoking???????? Seriously, Not in a million lifetimes!

"Also I can take some comfort in the fact that I do have a conscience and though I may hurt others, it is unintentional. So that is my power I suppose.'
YES! And having a conscience is by far, more admirable and powerful than any kind or amount of bad dogs or other attempts at intimidation.

I do need to work on my detaching. I am pretty good at staying away and taking awhile to get into a relationship or to trust anyone. Where I screw up is believing someone when they say after months and months of online and phone conversations and a few public dates that they are different, they are really into me, I am amazing, let my walls down, blah, blah, blah, where I screw up is to believe there words.
There is a song by Jeff Beck called Hallelujah where the lyrics go:
Well maybe there's a God above
But all I've ever learned from love
Was how to shoot somebody who'd OUT DREW YA
And it's not a cry that you hear at night
It's not somebody who's seen in the light
It's a cold and it's a broken Hallelujah

To me it kind of puts into words how I feel about people who con you by playing on your emotions. Some will con for money..but the ones that do it for personal gain are to me so much worse.

I think this is what tigertales meant by the abuser's power ( his or her con, so to speak? )

Thank you Learned for that. I would just like to get back to me and feel good about myself. I once had that and lost it somewhere.

I find it so odd that I can look back and none of these abusers were in themselves anything so impressive as to think I would really get hung up on wondering the why of it? Two of them I had to really second guess myself on even dating and my friends encouraged me into it, also they seemed like they would be a change from the typical type I had been dating, not so rough and tumble. They had a more "city" boy look and way about them so I agreed to date them thinking they would be "harmless"..wow talk about the proverbial wolf in sheeps clothing.
Sometimes you really can't tell by physical presentation and your gut really does kick in. Listen to it. With both, my gut practically screamed at me to not give them a second date.

Actions! Pay attention to what they do not what they say.
And to really get to know someone, imo it can't be done online or on the phone, it has to be in person, face to face and even then that isn't a guarantee that what you see or what you are told, is what you will get but it is a better indicator because a lot is revealed through facial expression and body language. That's just imho.

I think we posted at the same time because I didn't see you last post until after mine.
And yes always always always, listen to your gut, your intuition. Looks can be deceiving too, but if after one or two dates , that inner voice is screaming at you, listen .

Learned, I agree with you that...ultimately...abusers are cowardly. But, until their hand is forced, they have the power for an awful lot of destruction.

Ultimately, the abuser uses all sorts of power in their environments. They use the collective power of others that they can convince to side with them. These are the cunning Narcissists.

Likewise, they can use the advantage of a lie, of their physical advantages, their familial relationships, their financial advantages...and so on...and create havoc for their targeted victim.

Whenever anyone is taken advantage of, they can naturally feel ashamed...especially when culture places a premium on being smart, beautiful, and strong.

What is your yardstick? Where do you derive your sense of worth? Is it conditional? If not, how unconditional is it??

Everyone has limits.

Grrrr I typed a long response and DS froze on me - and you can't even copy text from here any more! Anyways, the gist of it was that the kind of obsession I was talking about in that other post was the controlling type of obsession that you mention in one of your posts here - like calling and sending texts obsessively until a response is received. Healthy would be to call or send a text and allow the other person the right to respond in their own time.

I also agree with Learned that obsessing after an abusive relationship is over is natural because you are trying to get your head around the incomprehensible - how can you be the whole of someone's world one day, they can't imagine being without you, never felt this way before etc etc, and the next day they are gone and have already moved on. Of course you are going to obsess a little about how that could happen - but again, it's not about you trying to control them, it's about you trying to figure yourself out.

And in Maybe's case, I suspect the obsession comes from the mixed messages he was sending - such as the idea that being mean and sarcastic proved he loved you. It's again hardly surprising that you obsessed a little when the whole thing make your mind, heart and gut go in different directions. Again, the obsession wasn't about control, but about trying to make sense of the senseless.

I do agree that obsession isn't necessarily about abuse. But the point of my other post was that obsession in the early stages of a relationship is often about or a precursor to control and abuse, and should at the least be viewed as a warning sign and a reason to proceed with caution.

Joanies, I totally understand what you mean about seeing that sort of over the top obsession as flattering. I've made that mistake myself. But it sort of falls into the category of "if it looks too good to be true, it probably is". I will now run a mile from that kind of "flattery". I'll never again believe anyone could be THAT into me that quickly - without even really knowing who I am or what I'm about.

Liv - I'd never thought of it like that before, but I think you might have actually got it completely right. Part of the reason why I was so obsessed with him was because he was so intriguing. He was endlessly interesting and I wanted so desperately to understand him. He was like a drug, always giving out little bits of information, but never enough for you to see the big picture or to make sense of it all, so I was scurrying around, always hungry for more information so that stuff could start to make sense. Of course now I realise that stuff just didn't make sense. All the information he gave would go in circles and confuse everything even more and there was no logic and a whole load of lies and manipulation.

Through the entire relationship my mind, heart and gut were always fighting with each other.