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I was cruising around various sites, looking for some links actually for my daughter, on relationship evaluation. I came across some interesting info here and there and thought it might be appropriate ... food for thought or discussion and definitely, some hope and positivity. Have you ever noticed how "men are men" UNTIL they become "possibly Mr. Right" and then, we get weird inside, lose our self-confidence and all else. Not sure I'm expressing it quite right ... but sure the drift comes across. At least I can take comfort in knowing the opposite sex may be going through their own mental and emotional storms ... and it doesn't always show.
(This is from "Christian" site, but I think the material I'm using is not anything to do with religion, per se ... and I am putting the links in case you want to read more, but not as a tool of preaching ... I went to the author site, but the article linked back to the given site.)
http://www.cbn.com/family/DatingSingles/GuysPursue.aspx
"Mr. Fear of Rejection
As he begins to talk you realize that guys ponder way more than emotions. In fact, if what these guys say is true, emotions are just not enough. A guy may be interested in a girl and still do and say nothing. Why? Because guys believe there are more factors to consider than feelings.
One of these factors is the fear of rejection. One of the guys explains a time when he was bold enough to ask a girl out, but she said no. The no itself was hard for him to take, because he really did care for this girl, but what happened is that this girl went back and told all of her friends and they began to review all of his perceived strengths and weaknesses. By the time it was over not only did all of her friends know, but their friends knew and their friends' brothers knew that he asked, she said no, and that he was not tall enough for the average girl to really honestly consider. His chances with this girl were dead as was any future chances with any of her friends or most girls he knew within the area code. Due to the embarrassment and rejection he would simply rather not go through that again.
Mr. Not Financially Set
Another guy speaks up and points out that his main reason for not being active in the dating scene was that he felt he needed to be financially set before he could seriously commit to a woman. He begins to express how his parents struggled financially and how it put a lot of stress on their marriage. He would simply rather not set himself up to fail. If he could become financially secure, then he would feel much more at ease about being with a woman. In addition to this, he opens up and reveals that he believes most women want this. He expresses his insecurity that even though he has a decent job while still in grad school, that he still feels inept as a man because he could not support a woman even if he wanted to. “To pursue a woman, a guy has to be a man. He has to feel like a man. If not, what does he really have to offer?”
Mr. Doomsday
After the money talk subsided a man blurted out, “I don’t date simply because I’m not any good at it!” This guy was very straightforward and honest about the fact that he would rather put time into things he knew he was good at. He laid out a list of reasons why romance was simply not in his blood. His parents and many other relatives got married only to divorce in the end. His own relationships always ended in pain, and he was much better at so many other areas of his life. Why endure the heartache and waste his and some poor girl's time by starting something that most likely wouldn’t work out anyway? After his initial premise for singlehood ended, he got quiet. Under his breath you barely hear these words, “No one likes to fail…I don’t want to fail.”
Mr. I Hate Fairy Tales
“You’re right…no one likes to fail, but no matter what any of us guys do we will all do exactly that.” A guy says from behind his saddened, but stern eyes. He continues to convey how he feels that no matter how hard a guy tries, it won’t be good enough in the end any how. “I blame it on the fairy tales and romantic comedies,” He says. “There’s knights in shining armor, the biggest engagement rings ever, and guys that always know what to say.”
This strikes you a bit oddly. You have put numerous amounts of hours lamenting how media has affected the perception of the ideal beauty and the pressures you have likely felt with all of the super models on TV, yet it never really dawned on you how that same thing might be occurring for guys. What do fairy tales and romantic comedies say about guys? They should always dress nice, have a nice home (a horse and carriage is a nice perk), never be grumpy, be the perfect balance of sensitive and masculine, able to beat up 1 to 40 guys all by himself if need be, and, oh yes, he must always leave the toilet seat down, because he is the most thoughtful and caring man alive.
Mr. I Hate Fairy Tales backs this up with a personal story of how he once bought his ex-girlfriend 12 roses. However, she was hurt, because he did not get her lilies. She felt he should know her better than that, because lilies were her favorite flower…not roses. Many examples followed, but the final conclusion was that he did not feel that getting into a relationship would benefit him. He would always fall short of the ideal, and that just did not sit well with him.
Mr. Can’t Find What I’m Looking For
After hearing all of the things that had been uttered you realize there was one guy who had not yet talked. The entire time he just listened to the others. Some of the guys noticed as well and they asked him what his deal was. He said, “Nothing…I would pursue a girl, but I just have not found what I’m looking for.” The guys asked him what that was exactly. He answered, “It’s simple…I’m looking for the same things you’re looking for. I’m looking for… . ” All of a sudden the audio is lost; then the video also fades and you realize that your masculine passport is expiring.
You find yourself back where you started…in estrogenville. Except there’s something a little bit different about how you view the men in your life. The guy you once looked at with a bit of resentment for not calling doesn’t look like as big of a jerk. In fact, for all of the guys you know, you seem to have a bit more compassion for them, because you are more aware of the things they are walking through. They are not all big jerks who care nothing for you or your lady friends. They are guys -- flawed humans who just have not figured it out yet.
It was good to be a fly on the wall for just a moment, but you would really like to know what that last guy was going to say…what are guys looking for? Maybe next time. Maybe."
(This is from "Christian" site, but I think the material I'm using is not anything to do with religion, per se ... and I am putting the links in case you want to read more, but not as a tool of preaching ... I went to the author site, but the article linked back to the given site.)
http://www.cbn.com/family/DatingSingles/GuysPursue.aspx
"Mr. Fear of Rejection
As he begins to talk you realize that guys ponder way more than emotions. In fact, if what these guys say is true, emotions are just not enough. A guy may be interested in a girl and still do and say nothing. Why? Because guys believe there are more factors to consider than feelings.
One of these factors is the fear of rejection. One of the guys explains a time when he was bold enough to ask a girl out, but she said no. The no itself was hard for him to take, because he really did care for this girl, but what happened is that this girl went back and told all of her friends and they began to review all of his perceived strengths and weaknesses. By the time it was over not only did all of her friends know, but their friends knew and their friends' brothers knew that he asked, she said no, and that he was not tall enough for the average girl to really honestly consider. His chances with this girl were dead as was any future chances with any of her friends or most girls he knew within the area code. Due to the embarrassment and rejection he would simply rather not go through that again.
Mr. Not Financially Set
Another guy speaks up and points out that his main reason for not being active in the dating scene was that he felt he needed to be financially set before he could seriously commit to a woman. He begins to express how his parents struggled financially and how it put a lot of stress on their marriage. He would simply rather not set himself up to fail. If he could become financially secure, then he would feel much more at ease about being with a woman. In addition to this, he opens up and reveals that he believes most women want this. He expresses his insecurity that even though he has a decent job while still in grad school, that he still feels inept as a man because he could not support a woman even if he wanted to. “To pursue a woman, a guy has to be a man. He has to feel like a man. If not, what does he really have to offer?”
Mr. Doomsday
After the money talk subsided a man blurted out, “I don’t date simply because I’m not any good at it!” This guy was very straightforward and honest about the fact that he would rather put time into things he knew he was good at. He laid out a list of reasons why romance was simply not in his blood. His parents and many other relatives got married only to divorce in the end. His own relationships always ended in pain, and he was much better at so many other areas of his life. Why endure the heartache and waste his and some poor girl's time by starting something that most likely wouldn’t work out anyway? After his initial premise for singlehood ended, he got quiet. Under his breath you barely hear these words, “No one likes to fail…I don’t want to fail.”
Mr. I Hate Fairy Tales
“You’re right…no one likes to fail, but no matter what any of us guys do we will all do exactly that.” A guy says from behind his saddened, but stern eyes. He continues to convey how he feels that no matter how hard a guy tries, it won’t be good enough in the end any how. “I blame it on the fairy tales and romantic comedies,” He says. “There’s knights in shining armor, the biggest engagement rings ever, and guys that always know what to say.”
This strikes you a bit oddly. You have put numerous amounts of hours lamenting how media has affected the perception of the ideal beauty and the pressures you have likely felt with all of the super models on TV, yet it never really dawned on you how that same thing might be occurring for guys. What do fairy tales and romantic comedies say about guys? They should always dress nice, have a nice home (a horse and carriage is a nice perk), never be grumpy, be the perfect balance of sensitive and masculine, able to beat up 1 to 40 guys all by himself if need be, and, oh yes, he must always leave the toilet seat down, because he is the most thoughtful and caring man alive.
Mr. I Hate Fairy Tales backs this up with a personal story of how he once bought his ex-girlfriend 12 roses. However, she was hurt, because he did not get her lilies. She felt he should know her better than that, because lilies were her favorite flower…not roses. Many examples followed, but the final conclusion was that he did not feel that getting into a relationship would benefit him. He would always fall short of the ideal, and that just did not sit well with him.
Mr. Can’t Find What I’m Looking For
After hearing all of the things that had been uttered you realize there was one guy who had not yet talked. The entire time he just listened to the others. Some of the guys noticed as well and they asked him what his deal was. He said, “Nothing…I would pursue a girl, but I just have not found what I’m looking for.” The guys asked him what that was exactly. He answered, “It’s simple…I’m looking for the same things you’re looking for. I’m looking for… . ” All of a sudden the audio is lost; then the video also fades and you realize that your masculine passport is expiring.
You find yourself back where you started…in estrogenville. Except there’s something a little bit different about how you view the men in your life. The guy you once looked at with a bit of resentment for not calling doesn’t look like as big of a jerk. In fact, for all of the guys you know, you seem to have a bit more compassion for them, because you are more aware of the things they are walking through. They are not all big jerks who care nothing for you or your lady friends. They are guys -- flawed humans who just have not figured it out yet.
It was good to be a fly on the wall for just a moment, but you would really like to know what that last guy was going to say…what are guys looking for? Maybe next time. Maybe."
I agree, the pouty woman ... shivers ... may I never. That's like when people expect you to read their mind and "know" what they are thinking/feeling, or for me, being accused of being "angry" (I get a serious look on my face and sometimes have to work a little to concentrate) instead of asked and believed.
I just wonder, too, from going to support groups in the past, if WE often don't look more "together" than we feel. When I went to those and saw and heard people who otherwise looked like they had it "made" and their struggles, I realized eventually I probably DON'T reflect all the anxieties or whatever ... but it FELT LIKE I DID.
Last year, when I decided to quit my well established job of 17 years because I had a predatory narcissistic boss, my wife...in her anger...told me that: "I need security more than I need love".
I cannot say that, when I get back on my feet financially, that I'm not going to leave over that one.
I'm surely facing being split in two when I try to leave her. Split again, that is...
I hope her security holds her hand when she takes her dying breath.
I'm still on COBRA from that job. When she felt compelled to swap houses in our town, to reduce expenses somewhat, I gave her $6000 toward closing and she's not paid a dime of anything she never payed before.
Things have always been somewhat physical at times with her. If you think guys institute all the physical bullying in a home...guess again. She has Bipolar Disorder and that seldom makes anything any better or easier.
I was getting into my car to drive away during an argument and cool off on a Sunday afternoon. She opened the car door, leaned in and hit me 8 times in the back of my head. One of those hits broke open my scalp and the blood trickled down into my collar.
When someone always steals from you...be it financially, emotionally, etc...it's going to take you toward anger. When your basic needs are quelled and minimized, you're headed toward rage.
Had I swung my elbow backward at that altercation in June, she would have dropped like a sack of potatoes. That's no way to be, but then these things get crazy between people.
I really need something healthy in my life.
Friends of mine have a son who is bipolar . . . when he is on his meds he his a true young gentleman, but when he fails to take his medication he can be spaced out somewhere and talking nonsense or become violent. It is very difficult for those around to deal with. Luckly for my friends, their son usually has himself committed but occasionally his dad (now in his late 60s) has to step in and physicall restrain him. I feel for you and your problems with this. Stay safe and don't let yourself get prompted to hit back . . .you would still be the one going to jail. Keep venting. We are here to give you support. Hugs.
Hugs,
T
My wife's parents are both "pieces of work". I cut them out of my life (and subsequently hers) for the most part because they are amazing to watch.
You can go into a setting (not usually their home...they have no friends and it's no wonder) and have...let's say...Thanksgiving Dinner. They'll argue (as they always do with screaming and throwing things), then gorge themselves, stretch out and take a two hour nap in the floor together...and...when they awaken...they'll go right back to fighting again.
My thinking is that they deserve each other. He was 22 and she was 13 when they got married...seriously...in rural West Tennessee in the late 1950's (get a mental picture here...this is beyond Coal Miner's Daughter). My wife was born to a 15 year old that suffered from rages, later on had month's long open affairs, and survived a couple of suicide attempts. Her parents are no different today than they were then...just older.
We are all largely products of our environments...so, I give great leeway to my wife. Her sister (18 months younger) has more or less taken up the mother's way...only a bit more dignified during the light of day...she's a career long Engineer for the Corp of Engineers.
Characterological anger laces all these things together. It's a hell of a ride...
Thank you for your understanding, by the way.
Well, she drops back to "what works" and that's her arrogance. Funny thing is...she's terrified of abandonment...almost as much as she is terrified of intimacy.
Subsequently, I've had to be very self reliant and that's ruined much of my tenderness.
The rest is history. I should have gotten a restraining order and changed jobs...we met at work.
Keep venting. You have to release some of those feelings. I hope your new relationship brings you some happiness. We all deserve happiness and it sounds like you may have found a woman who will truly understand what you have suffered through. Hugs.
I've also been realizing that, if you can't get away from a disturbed person, it's pretty difficult to remain on a plane of equilibrium and "good behavior". When I had the last contact with ex, he asked a question, didn't like my answer, so "that was it". Dismissal. Found myself going into "bitchy" mode. Glad to be catching myself, but after hearing him describe how he and his girlfriend were working on getting her husband arrested for DV (supposedly, HE was the abusive one. I just laughed about that, as an affair is abusive to any marriage. My ex, in the role of some sort of "advocate"? No.), so I guess there are even people willing to goad others. Intimate partners know our buttons, but whether goaded or not, it can be tough to keep cool. And very stressful.
At least it seems the more aware you are, the better (maybe not easier) you can deal with it all. And you hit the other nail on the head ... when the partner makes the accusations that you're in a bad mood, not loving, etc., it's almost amazing they can't make the connection, instead thinking it's "you". It's not. Everyone has a limit to endurance.
Personality Disorders and Mental Disturbances are "equal opportunity" at the least. If you count hormonal issues, there may be some skew in there...if that can be politically correct. I love the fact that "crazy" is a spectral condition...lol! "How crazy" comes to mind.
I digress.
Insight, coupled with a desire for change, are the two things necessary to facilitate change. But, even that comes with difficulty. We will always go with what we learned first, learned primarily, or learned with the greatest intensity and repetitive nature in our earlier lives. It's nearly impossible to change to the core without a huge chunk of cash, the loss of your freedom (as in prison), or the loss of your life as an incentive.
The Chinese say, "Kill one, teach a hundred".
I wish we could kill a few Narcissists...hey...maybe a new Reality TV Show on Bravo?? We could call it the "Dead Narcissists of Beverly Hills". You think it would take??
There is still a huge stigma attached to men that are battered. Battering is not just physical, though and I am convinced that emotional battering has just as many disastrous effects as physical over time.
I used to apply my "Christian Upbringing" and prohibit myself from going to certain places in argument and defending myself. While "being nice" is the way we should all be; that concept can get your wallet stolen, your face battered, and your body trampled.
You just cannot be nice to some people.