Hi mszach,

Thank you for sharing your story, especially about the risks of benzos. You are not the only who has experienced such negative consequences from this class of drug.

Probably safe to say pretty much everyone on this site has lived through at least some of the profound difficulties associated with insomnia, even if not with the same sort of drug cocktails you've been taking. So we can relate to some degree.

Couple of thoughts for you.

First, if you're getting in the vicinity of 5 hours, that's not too bad. 5 hours likely falls into your range of core sleep, and clinical studies have shown we can function reasonably well with just our core sleep for extended periods of time. The human mind-body system is remarkably resilient to sleep deprivation. So I hope that is somewhat reassuring.

Second, are you using any sort of method to track sleep? If not, there's probably a significant likelihood of at least some sleep state misperception. Studies have also found that we insomniacs tend to underestimate how much sleep we are actually getting by at least an hour or more per night. So it would not be at all surprising if you actually are getting more sleep than you think you're getting.

Finally, I would just say this. Drugs that unnaturally force sleep, while comforting and often necessary in the short term, are only treating the symptom. If you get hooked and find yourself in a state of escalating polypharmacy, you may be further distancing yourself from a permanent solution. At this risk of stating the obvious, we need to treat the real true underlying problem that is keeping us up.

I recognize that you may have some underlying psychiatric issues, that when successfully treated, will help improve your sleep. I personally would suggest continuing non-pharmaceutical methods such as counseling, if you are not already doing so, as this might help you cope better with some of these underlying thought patterns that might be fueling your insomnia as well as contributing to other mental health issues.

good luck to you.

I'm not sure exactly how this board works as I haven't used it often or in a long time but thanks Hypnos, I appreciate your candid and informative reply! Part of the deal with the benzos is I refuse to increase the dose, I simply will not do it and I think my tolerance is gone beyond what I'm taking, if that makes sense. Not to the point where I am getting bad withdrawal symptoms but they're not really helpful at all for sleep anymore, at the same time, if I quit taking them I would not sleep at all, have tried that on my own.

5 hours max and that's on a good night and again, it's with a pretty strong cocktail of drugs, I need more but I know there are people who don't even get that. Having said that, there are also nights where I only get an hour or two, two nights last week I didn't sleep more than 45 minutes. I run a white noise program at night because my environment is not always quiet, so I time my sleep that way and I assume it's pretty accurate.

I concur with your thoughts on the drugs, they are doing far more harm than good but I am in a situation now where I can't afford to go off because I am trying to find a job and moving soon. I know from past experiences going off benzos and even remeron causes significant withdrawal and for me, total insomnia. I remember going 45-50 days with only getting between 30-60 minutes a night, some nights no sleep, that was rough.

In the process of setting up some cognitive therapy so I'm hoping that will help! Having been on sleep meds for about 30 percent of my life, it's time to explore other options. It's a shame I didn't look into the long-term effects years ago. Anyway, thanks for the reply and for listening!

Oh, yes, how much do I relate to this! So benzos have been both my salvation and a curse. The problem is that you eventually build a tolerance, and then you wind up with more anxiety than you had to begin with, unless you can see your doctor right away, which usually does not happen. Klonopin has stopped working for me, and the past few days I have had severe anxiety. I cannot get in to see my doctor for 2 weeks. Until then, I am barely holding it together.
So somebody in the anxiety group told me that if I get on a good anti-depressant, that my sleep should improve, and I should be able to get off benzos eventually. This gives me hope, because it's a lot easier to go off an antidepressant than benzos. So, that's what I plan on trying to do. I don't know if you would consider that, but for me it seems like a step in the right direction.

Hey Sadie, I think I remember you from the last time I was here, I'm sorry you're still having such a hard time. You're right, they work very well initially and for me, they worked for a number of years but now they've simply stopped working. Again, to come off them cold turkey doesn't work, especially if you've been on them for 15+ years like me.

It makes sense, I take remeron now but that's more for sleep and anxiety, I tried Effexor for a while but that really caused problems for me. I see my doctor in two weeks as well, maybe she can find a solution but I think this time, it might be more up to me than it is her. I see you're only 36, that is so young to be having these kind of issues, I hope your family is sympathetic. Maybe you can get into see your doctor sooner if you were on a cancellation list? Two weeks is a long time

Well, I thanked the Lord my appointment was moved up from January. Until then, I am taking L-theanine, an amino acid, and it has helped a lot with reducing the anxiety. But I'm still having a hard time sleeping. But yes, my family and even my boss are supportive of me. I'll survive. I think.

When did you insomnia start Sadie, was there a really stressful period in your life leading up to it? Mine actually started in 1998 or 1999, so it's been happening a long time, feel like it's taken years off my life :(

Hi mszach,

Middle of the night awakening was one of my worst nightmare. Sometimes I am confused, did I go to bed to sleep or did I go to bed to wake up and wake up and wake up?

I quit pills after struggling for a long time. As I always said "Medication comes with side effects. Solution don't." So I turned to sleep hypnosis and visualization. Meditation. The combination of these 3 methods helps me pull through.

I forget again..to add this:

that baby...so cute.

To answer your question, Mszach, no, when my insomnia started I was not stressed out. My doctor thought that a Vitamin D deficiency was to blame. Turns out I did have a major deficiency. But I got my levels up and still had insomnia. So the only thing left I can think of is a chemical imbalance. So that's why I want to try an antidepressant, see if that helps.

I also agree with the point that sometimes benzos drugs shows side effects. But before taking this you need to do the proper diagnosis and take advice from your doctor.

Thanks Westchen, that's one of my nephews, he's one of 3 (triplets) That's actually impressive that you were able to quit pills, I don't believe I would sleep at all without them, at least not for a long time and unfortunately, I don't have the kind of downtime that would allow me much time to experiment, need to be able to function. Can you elaborate in terms of what methods you use? Would be greatly appreciated!

Wow Sadie, seems like I stumbled across that correlation years ago and completely forgot about it, I'm not sure how low your levels have to be to cause insomnia?? I used to get epidural shots in my back and those would cause terrible insomnia, I didn't put it together for a long time. Some of the antidepressants can actually cause insomnia, found that out with Effexor, couldn't sleep at all on that despite the fact that the doctor told me it's not a side effect.

As for meds, there's not much else I can throw at this beast without really causing harm to my body. Unfortunately, winter is here and I live in Minnesota so exercising can be tough with a gym membership. Think I will try taking vitamin D and perhaps look for holistic solutions, meditation etc....Going through another bad stretch after just a couple days of relief....

I agree with Hypnos. We all are in the almost the same boat in regard to a cocktail of drugs and quality of sleep. This is so disappointing as it proofs the fact that there is no effective remedy for insomnia. Then, the surrounding circumstances play a great role. You practically have to live in a paradise to recover from insomnia naturally...I mean just stop taking drugs, start exercising regularly, live on a pleasant schedule, eat healthy, implement CBT and whatever other recommended methods. I am personally very desperate and hopless.

Biatta, I understand the feeling of being hopeless. Until the last week, when I started on Remeron. I am starting to sleep better, and also less anxiety and depression. I have even decreased the amount of Ambien I am taking, and starting to wonder if I need it at all anymore. I hope this medication will also help me eventually get off Klonopin. My point is, that there may still be a solution for you that you haven't found yet. Keep trying.

Thank you Sadie, no I do not believe there is a solutions for me anymore. Taking care of an Autistic child feels like running a marathon 24/7 and never approaching the finish line. My life is a real nightmare, and I do not see how it can be improved. Insomnia worsens my emotional health, poor emotional health feeds the insomnia and on and on. I tried all the medications other users mentioned, they only give a tempo relief. I started Zoloft, it calms me down. But, my sleep is worse..2-3 hr of nap, this is what I get now. And, I still take Seroquel. The thing is that I am living against my biological rhythms. I have to be physically active and fast when I am tired the most, my son wakes me up at night exactly when I fall asleep..Medication can not change my circumstances, and I can not change the situation as well. I can't make my son a healthy and normal child. He is 4, acting like a 2 y.o at best. He is fast, mischievous, distracting in a way...though very friendly and lovely kid. He is growing up, but is not getting smarter and maturer.Every simple thing, like feeding, dressing, using a toilet and going outside with him is a great deal of a problem,it is a straggle. Not to mention that our house looks like a cave after a barbarian attack. I clean it constantly, the child messes it up right away. I know it is only gonna be harder for me. This is why I am desperate.

Hi mszach, yes, I have had that kind of insomnia before despite a cocktail of meds. I worked regularly with my doctor, who helped me a lot by supporting me when I said I needed more sleep than I was getting. We slowly built up to my current cocktail, which works really well now, except during times of stress.

A lot of people are really opposed to the idea of being on as many meds as I am for sleep, but my doctor and I feel that sleep is just too important for my well-being to sacrifice.

One treatment I found that made a significant difference, was acupuncture. That made a huge difference in the quantity and quality of my sleep! It doesn't last forever, and it was difficult for me to go twice every week. But it's an option I would recommend trying, especially to those who want a non-drug choice.

I wish you well in your journey! I know how hard it is.