I did believe once in forgiveness but I payed a HUGE price for that belief.
I forgave a 9 month affair ex had in 2002 and things were going good I thought until she dropped the bomb again late last year.
Now we are in divorce proceedings and its destroyed my life while she rode off in the sunset with her new cheater partner......never again,if and thats a big if I ever get in another relationship again, one strike you are out!!

I hope to God there are second chances - because my wife gave me one. My wife has forgiven me - for me the harder part is forgiving myself for something I swore I would never do.

Zenon - Your post really struck a chord with me. It's one thing to ask another for forgiveness (since their response is out of your control), but it's quite another to go about the monumental task of forgiving yourself.

My therapist keeps asking me how long I plan on carrying this guilt around with me. Sometimes I'll think I've finally forgiven myself, and then something will come up and I feel like hell all over again.

I agree with many here. Forgiveness - yes if only for your own sake. I believe that forgiving someone helps you to let go of the anger and helps you move on to a better emotional place. Trust is something entirely different. Like most say here - that innocent, naive, trust you you once had in your spouse and that comfort and security you once felt is gone, if not at least changed, forever. My husband's counselor told him that the marriage we had before is gone now so don't think it will come back and don't get upset when it doesn't because what we have now has replaced it and hopefully will get better with time. I grieve for the loss of that old, trusting, comfortable marriage that we had. It definitely feels like I have suffered the death of an old friend at times and the despair is deep and overwhelming, but I cry a good hard cry and then get on with things. He has been better to me than he was before which helps and our communication is better, but I think there will always be that mistrust and suspicion. Maybe that is the way it should have been all along. He has told me over and over again that he is sorry for what he did and still doesn't understand exactly how it happened since he always loved me deeply and never wanted to end our marriage and be with her although he admits that at one point he wanted both of us and actually thought he could pull it off until it became obvious that I wasn't ever going to be on board with that. I also will not let him call it a mistake since it was a conscious choice he now says he wishes he never made. Unfortunately, he thinks it should be OK to be friends with the OW since the romance is over. Everytime he engages with her it kills me and he just doesn't get this and thinks this is something I should be able to get over using the idea that we can't control other people's behavior we can only control our response. This makes moving on and trusting harder since it is like grinding salt in the wound.

I guess it depends on a lot of things, some of which are more complicated than I had ever imagined. I've been in counseling myself trying to figure things out to my own satisfaction. I've learned over the years that my fiance was abused by her father, an uncle and then by her husband (if you can imagine him bringing others home so he could watch). Does she have problems? Yes she does and it remains to be seen whether I should drop her and run or whether we can overlook a physical affair and try to get to the root of the problem. Maybe we can salvage this relationship that we have both invested seven years into, maybe not. Still much to learn about our current situation and I can make my decision later. I think forgiveness is possible under the right circumstances, but I would say "only one time". Trust is a big issue here. My faith in her has taken a big hit and her trust in men has been damaged by a lifetime of abuse. I want to hear her side of things, but so far she is afraid to talk about it much. Well, time will tell. I'm a patient man, the A was short, it is over now and we are getting along just fine right now. We'll see.

AmIThat,
You sound like a very level headed, intellegent and kind person. One thing you may not know, because you have never been through this before is...HE SHOULD NOT ENGAGE WITH HER IN ANY WAY...EVER...THAT MEANS NO PHONE CALLS, TEXTS, E-MAILS, NO MEETINGS, NO CONTACT AT ALL!

If there is one thing almost all experts and the people here agree on, it is that. In fact, if he works with her, he or she must change jobs. This IS that serious.

The infatuation that occurs in affairs is backed up by powerful chemicals, there are different powerful chemicals that bond your husband to you.

The very differences in the two emotional reactions, is why he WANTS BOTH! Even if he is not sleeping with her, he STILL HAS BOTH!

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but he must drop her and go cold turkey. There are many books on the subject (look under reccommendations, next to discussions at the top of this page), to help him to see this and advise on how to say goodbye to her.

What I have read says that, he must show no sadness or express feelings of loss to her (even if he feels them), he must do this by telephone or letter, with you present.

He must tell the OW that he has wronged YOU and is committed to earning your love and trust. If she speaks about "what about us", he must be cold and say, "what I did to my wife, by seeing you, is wrong and WILL NEVER HAPPEN AGAIN! I will never contact you, see you, write to you etc and I will not respond if you try to contact me. Please go on with your life."

Your husband, must not apologize to her for hurting her. he must make her see, his only concern is for you and his marriage. Look at some books on relationships. This is absolutely a situation that must end.

Sorry, but I am quoting every book I have read.

Good Luck to you
Nave

Thanks Nave,

I have read some books which also said this and I have shared this with him. The counselor we were seeing also told him this.

I was also like you. I would never have thought my husband would do this in a million years. He has always been very loyal, loving and devoted to me although our communication was suffering at the time the affair started. He has always had female friends without any problems. I trusted him completely even though a little voice in my head told me to beware with this woman. She is known as a husband seducer. She is in an "open" relationship and is into new age thinking believing you can love multiple people at any given time. But I considered her a friend and never thought she would go after my husband. Apparently she saw the devotion and love between us and decided she wanted some of that too. She is a master manipulator and my husband was no match since I am very straightforward and do not play games or manipulate.

They got together under innocent conditions with my approval since since I was so trusting. By the time I started to feel uneasy it was too late. She convinced my husband that her model of "more love" was a good and enlightened way of thinking. Now he realizes that was totally wrong and was just a manipulation.

He thinks they should be able to go back to where the relationship should have been in the first place since they have both admitted it should not have become an affair. He also feels bad for telling her things he now realizes he should never have told her and feels the need to make amends. I can't make him understand why he shouldn't do this.

I do believe in second chances. My H gave me a second chance when I had an affair and we had a good relationship. He was probably more trusting of me after for some reason. The problem is, I never forgave myself and as more and more time passed I pushed him further and further away. I got to the point where I avoided almost all physical contact with him and I emotional pulled myself away. Then he had an affair. He needed an emotional connection with someone and I was not giving that to him. Don't get me wrong, I don't blame myself for his affair but I do know that I contributed to the fact that he was emotionaly in need. Now I have forgiven him and we are working on rebuilding our relationship but he is having a hard time forgiving himself and he is very concerned that I will not be able to forgive him completely.

As far as trust goes, like I said earlier, I know he is the exception to the rule, but he actually trusted me more after my affair. At this point I am still having a few trust issues with him but they get better everyday and I always tell him as my trust is rebuilding I may just need proof of certain things or I may need to verify things just to help regain my trust. So far, he has been supportive and has not gotten angry when I check up on him or call and check his voicemail at random times.

Good Luck and try to keep a positive attitude.

i believe in 2nd chances but not third as for forgiveness i keep telling him i forgive him (so that he can forgive himself) but im not sure if i do and we both know the trust is so far gone hes in iraq so its really bad i want 2 trust and he tries reassure me and understands that it doesnt work i guess that fact that he cheated at drunken parties at college b4 we were married helps a lil it all involved alcohol (which isnt an excuse at all) but it helps that hes basically never aloud 2 drink again and its not like he can get it n iraq

Yes,
There is the possibility of a second chance. However each must be committed to starting anew and not hold anything tangible over the head of the other. Yes it does work both ways, the cheater must not cheat again and the wounded spouse must not use it to there advantage in any future quarrels. This does not mean it cannot be used again if cheating occurs. There must be total and absolute honesty in all communications. Just like Nave has said, no more contact.

I agree that you cannot hold it over the cheaters head once they have made amends and regained your trust, but until that time they must be remorseful and accountable and if they aren't you have every right to remind them of what they have done until they take responsibility.

You guys are great. I appreciate your response & all your honesty & insight. I guess we're all trying to believe in something better. The pain of remembering is the hardest. Then again there's the wondering if he's in contact w/ the OW still? If they had an intense emotional affair as well as a sexual one how can they simply cut them off? We live 600 miles away from his ex-mistress so i know they aren't in physical contact anymore. He kept so many secrets for so many years I am still suspicious. I love him more than ever & he's made every attempt to make ammends and I do believe he is sincerely sorry for causing me so much pain. I guess I have to turn it over to my Higher Power & trust that things happen for a reason & we were given this second chance for a reason.