Rew....thanks for sharing. Nothing like a little humor in the morning. It is sad that our justice system is so overloaded that the defendants only get minimal representation. The public defenders job is to protect the rights of the defendants and that is it. Their case loads are atrocious. The public defenders i knew are competant and hard working. But when you are overworked it is true that they only get the minimum at best.
On the other hand the overpriced lawyers have the time and resources to better represent their clients. But who can really afford 25 thousand dollars to start? The rich. Ive seen it time after time.
I have seen the injustice also when it comes to sentencing. It is who you know and how much you have to spend.
Sad......

Thanks for sharing the clip, Rew.

Sometime in the coming months, I'll be facing court dates for a CP charge, likely in MN State court. The few lawyers I've contacted charge at minimum three thousand dollars for their services. Short of selling a kidney for cash, or nailing that lucky scratch ticket, there's no chance of affording representation beyond a public defender.
Some questions about the process:

First, do I have to be charged before seeking the help of a public defender, or will any of them start working on a case during the investigation?

Second, most of the comments I've read in this discussion group mention an overwhelming number of plea deals. Are there any instances where a plea deal isn't recommended by a PD, and why is that the most common advice they give?

Third, how much time does a defendant usually get with a PD, prior and following a court case?

Finally, are there any other alternatives to high priced attorneys and public defenders? Seems like there should be some middle-ground...

Thanks for your advice, good to meet all of you on this group!

Mallo,

First, do I have to be charged before seeking the help of a public defender, or will any of them start working on a case during the investigation?

No, you have to be charged. A PD is usually appointed at arraignment, which is 48 to 72 hours after you have been placed in custody. The arraignment is actually the first formal court date you will have after arrest. If I remember correctly, the judge reads the charges to you and asks how you plead. They then start the process of appointing you a PD if you cannot afford an attorney. And the bail considerations will be discussed at that time. This process will probably take less than 20 minutes.

Second, most of the comments I've read in this discussion group mention an overwhelming number of plea deals. Are there any instances where a plea deal isn't recommended by a PD, and why is that the most common advice they give?

Going to trial on a CP case is much like judicial suicide. Furthermore, with most sex charges the amount of evidence to convict is so little that most defendants will plea instead of going to trial. It is a huge roll of the dice to go to trial on a sex charge. Remember each image is one count, so if you go to trial they could convict and sentence you on each image, which racks up a considerable amount of time.

If a person does decide to go to trial, the DA will sometimes try him on all the charges and the jury----and if and when you are found guilty----may ask the charges to be run consecutively instead of concurrently. This can lead to prison sentences of anywhere for 60 years to 100 years. Such a lengthy sentence is not common in CP cases as most defendants do not go to trial, but there was one case in Arizona where a defendant received 200 years on CP charges when he went to trial.

Third, how much time does a defendant usually get with a PD, prior and following a court case?

I did not have a PD, but the ladies can give you a better answer. I do know it is sometimes only a few hours.

Finally, are there any other alternatives to high priced attorneys and public defenders? Seems like there should be some middle-ground...

There should be some middle ground, but I don't know of any. If you cannot afford a private attorney, a PD is the only alternative.

In CP cases it is a matter of getting the best attorney you can afford and then plea out to the best deal he can get for you.

rewdiazepam

If you look at the system as a whole it's way overburdened and over crowded leading one to wonder just what are we doing wrong in this country. Just remember per capita the US leads the world in incarceration. The DA, PD and even the PO's have around 200-300 cases for each person. It's mind boggling.

Also remember that even with a good high priced attorney there isn't a gaurentee especially with sex crime cases. I can point to countless cases where the rich may have avoided prison time but didn't avoid the registry and probation.

My husband did not have a CP charge. Instead it was a false accusation of molestation by my step-daughter (a he said/she said) If I had to do it all over again, I would have begged,borrowed or whatever to at least have a paid attorney present for the initial police questioning. They had nothing on him (cos he didn't do it) but at questioning, they asked him some sketchy questions ..asking if it was possible that he might have, accidentally, brushed a breast over clothing during family horseplay...and he said "yeah, I guess so" BAM!!! they took that and ran.

A friend of mine's boyfriend was being accused by his ex of messing with his kid, and they called all over and finally found a lawyer just to go to the questioning part for $500 and it was money very well spent because he got them to toss it.
Looking back, I wish I'd have known. At least our experience paid off in that I told my friend DO NOT LET HIM TALK TO THE POLICE WITHOUT A LAWYER!!!!

As for our experience with the PD, we had a good one. My husband wanted to go to trial, and the PD was okay with that. He was honest and told us, the chances in his opinion of acquittal were about 50/50 and for this type of case, that was very good odds.
My husband got a hung jury...not a good as an acquittal but by far better than the 20+ yrs he could have got. He was then offered a plea for 3mos in jail, 3yrs probation and 10 yrs on the registry nd the PD advised us to take it.
Sadly the AWA was adopted 2 yrs later and now it's registry for life at the moment, although we're hoping to fight it.

I love John Oliver, he has a way of saying things that is just perfect.

I am a little surprised he didn't talk about how much power prosecutors have to basically compel defendants into taking a plea. Like rew is talking about, each image in a cp case is years behind bars so it's rather easy to stack the charges a mile high. It is the same deal for pretty much all crimes now. With mandatory minimums, prosecutors have the upper hand pretty much at all times. The Supreme Court justifies plea bargaining by saying its a contract between equal parties but it is anything but that. The DA forces uneven deals because they are the judge, jury and executioner and hold all the cards. The sorry state if Public defenders is worrisome but it still wouldn't change much if the DA has this much unfettered power.

Independent... In my case it was the judge who wrote the plea offer not the DA, although they both wanted to throw the book at me. Luckily a number of letters from therapists and such calmed the judge a bit so no prison time.

The DA still decides what to charge you with and how many counts. When I say the DA is the judge jury and executioner that's what I mean. They shape everything about your case by stacking pikes of charges. The judge ultimately decides the punishment but 99% of the time the judge rubber stamps what was agreed upon by the DA and defendant.

Well yes in that case they refused to drop any of the charges so on paper it looks worse than it really was.

In my opinion a "plea deal" means you have to plead guilty (admit all the charges) Even if you know you will probably be convicted, if you go to trail and say the prosecutor withholds evidence from your lawyer if a witness backs out, or the DNA evidence isn't as decisive as they claim or the judge makes a mistake during trial, you have grounds for appeal etc. The DA is good at bullying an overworked public defender or doing a deal with your private lawyer ( both may belong to the same old boys lawyers club ) If you take the prosecutor's deal and do not go to trial you will eat whatever sentence they offer with the "deal". It is a short cut for them but might turn out to be forever for you even if there would have been grounds for appeal had you known. Of course if you refuse a "deal" they will try to bury you. The Justice System is a real Cr*p- shoot. Are you a "lucky" gambler?

This is just one man's opinion, but your life is not worth gambling with. When the DA says 25 to life if you are found guilty, and 2 years of you plead, please convince your friend or your family or yourself to take the two years. It is nearly impossible to win a sex crimes case in court. BUT don't just take my word for it, take the advice of your lawyer, especially if you are paying them.