I was thinking I need to tell her exactly what I can and cannot do because its only fair to her to know what she is getting into. I guess if she leaves me maybe I can hope for someone who is willing to accept me with my limitations. I guess I am afraid no healthy woman would want to accept a man who is sexually limited.

Maybe I can discuss with her ways to have sex with me that still please her but dont make me feel so tired. Maybe she would accept that. Or maybe she will decide to get another healthy man.

I am just amazed that you and Luna both brought up this subject the same day. You also get a high 5 for having the guts to bring this up.

When I was healthy and in my early 20s I remember a question that would come up among us ladies every once in awhile. Would you rather have amazing sex once a month, or kind of ok sex a few times a week? Seriously everytime we all had to think about it. We had trouble deciding. Usually the majority went for the once a month. We all wanted an option in the middle. Even though we all agreed that it would be hard to wait a whole month (we were young!) no one saw that as a deal breaker. I hope that makes you feel better.

Most women are big into sharing, emotions, and trust. This may go far better than you think. You are right that she might leave you for it. But if she did, and you told that story to a group of women, they'd probably be very sympathetic to you.

I think it would be a very good idea to be honest with her about all of this. I think I have some good guesses about what will go through her mind. Here is how I think it will go.

First you start with telling her that you need to be honest with her about something. She will hear you, look at your face, and brace herself. Inside she is freaking out. She's wondering what she did. She's wondering if you lied to her about something. She wonders if she was wrong about you. Irrational fears may creep into her mind - cheating, really married, criminal? This may be denied if you ask later. Keep in mind she hopes she will find herself feeling foolish for doubting you for a second.

So you are seeing the look on her face and already feel doomed. Then you tell her that because of your cfs it takes you up to a week to recover from having sex with her. She is so relieved it wasn't as bad as she thought. She may start asking questions. It's very important she knows you are not making that up and that she didn't do anything wrong. You may have to say so often. Don't get mad. Women who do this are doubting themselves, not you.

Maybe you grin and tell her that maybe it isn't the cfs and she is just that amazing. Maybe she blushes.

You tell her you don't want to stop having sex with her, but you don't want to be so run down either. She gives you a look, probably of mixed feelings.

Then you tentatively tell her you have some ideas of how you could still please her that won't wear you out so bad. And then this flicker of hope crosses her face. So you tell her. And then you tell her that you are open to any other ideas she has. And she gets quiet. So you say, that is, if you still want to be with me.

More likely than not you get a really good response. She is all happy you trusted her enough to tell her. She is all giddy that you have sacrificed so much just to please her. She feels all extra cared about because sex is not one of the biggest reasons you want to be with her. (If you are smart you will emphasize how much you care about her.) She may even get a wicked gleam in her eye and suggest that she do more of the pleasing.

If you never wanted to do anything sexual with her ever again, it would probably be a deal breaker. But just the fact that you want to try should take you really far.

If it all goes bad she wasn't worth it.

FlyingChicklet has some good advice. There are many ways to pleasure your partner that require less physical exertion.

Again, communication is key. And with women, the emotional connection is a very important part of the intimacy. Hopefully your lady will be deeply touched by your honesty and will want to work with you to determine how you both can feel comfortable in your physical relationship.

And I agree with the "quality vs. quantity".......I always go for quality.

Good luck to you!

Im scared. Today was the first day I felt ill right after sex. I have felt fine right after sex the previous 6 times since I started having sex again. I feel bad the day after. But not right after sex. I dont know why today its different. I feel pretty cappy and scared that I might enter a relapse. Or that I will have to stop having sex completely. What scares me is that I dont understand why I feel this bad when the previous times I have been fine until the day after. I had sex four hours ago and I feel very bad. Im scared.

Gabriel! You have had some really good, tender advice here on how to handle this. You seem to be very passionate about it, and I certainly understand it. However, maybe you are so focused on performance, and sexual conduct meaning SO much, that you are not addressing the real issue here.

You want a relationship, right? That starts with friendship! Friendship doesn't breed fear!! You keep stating that you are scared. Then maybe right now sex is not something you should be so focused on.

As your friends have said here, women appreciate being held, cuddled, wined and dined.....we love to laugh, we love to develop friendships that bring us security and happiness.

Possibly, you could try to be less intensely concerned about sexual performance and more concerned about developing a good relationship with someone. That way, when you are ready to add sexual relations into the conversation, she will already know you well enough to be receptive to what you have to say about CFS and it's limitations.

GIve us some credit. Women, do not sit with score cards with the men they chose to date. They date the men that make them feel good about themselves, and bring them some sparkle and happiness. Very often, sexual relations has nothing at all to do with these feelings.

I hope you can stop stressing about this issue. I know it's important to you, but I think you need to take this subject off the top of your list as "things that matter the most" in your relationships. You will find a woman who will be a wonderful partner, and who will understand your illness and the insecurities that come along with it!!

Thanks to everyone here for your kind advice. I really appreciate it. This is a great support group. I have always found great help and support here.

I tried to cuddle, caress and do other things besides having sex but it has not worked so far. I need to think of some other way I can make that happen. She seems to come from a long marriage in which there was no cuddling or caressing, just sex.

As for being scared, I am scared of a relapse. Last time I felt ill after sex it was the beginning of a three month relapse. I dont know why i felt so sick today right after sex.

It's a physiological response. Sexual activity releases a massive amount of adrenalin into the system, and people with chronic illnesses often respond very negatively to adrenalin.

Sexual arousal has a profound effect on mammalian physiology. It's not surprising that someone who already has a compromised system due to illness might respond by getting sicker after sex. It always takes me a long time to recover from sexual activity...partners just never did understand that. I live alone now, and that's not by choice.

HI G -- You have gotten some really great advice here, but A. you MUST let yourself recover from having had sex and B. you do need to talk to your lady friend about this if you have not already. The stress of waiting and wondering about her response will not be good for you. Also, you really may need to put into practic those 'other things' that can be done sexually to pleasure her that are much less demanding on your sytem. If you don't do both of these things the anxiety it creates will be a very big drag for you -- in all ways, depleting you further. I wonder also, if you might talk with your health practitioner about this issue. And I agree, I applaud you for having the courage to bring this up as I am sure you are not the only man who had this experience. I also have had times where having ex was terrifically draining for me and I'd have to spend the rest of the day in bed. So, it is a serious issue, but I think there are ways to cope with it as you can see from all the wonderfully wise and warm responses you've recieved. And just be gentle and take care of yourself. Having sex takes a lot of energy. You need time to then rebuild your reserves. Eat really good food, get lots of rest and sleep! I wish you much luck and good sex!
Denise

I'm 'evildoer' and I really suck at advice. I would be very careful talking to your lady friend. Telling someone they make you sick every time your intimate might not go down too well. You know, "you make me sick" -- literally. Might not play well. Even if she is sympathetic putting off a persons very real needs and instincts isn't always easy.

Everyone is different though. Best of luck to you.

This is another one of those time-warp threads. There's a time gap of 14 months between replies 8 and 9.

Not that it matters much...our inability to have sex regularly is a problem that doesn't go away, unfortunately. It's just one more thing this illness steals from us.

Sometimes I feel like I'm not an entire person...just a fragment of a human being.

Luckily there is more than one, or 10 or even 100 ways to get the job done as it were. Over the years hubby and I have gotten creative. While missionary is rough, there are many other pages to the kama sutra..... timing is also crucial. Mornings are terrific but only if there is nothing else to be done that day. Evenings are nice but there is less energy to go around. Taking a hot shower or bath first helps with pain and stiffness (no pun intended).

She will have to understand that each encounter takes a toll on your body. You stated she "She knows I have cfs but she doesnt really know how much it affects me". You need to give her a warm embrace, sit her down and tell her what happens too you physically after the sex is over. Let her know you love sex with her but you need to pace yourself. There are sensual things you can do in between times of recovery, warm oil massages, cooking delectable treats, watching a movie and just kissing like teenagers on the sofa. If she's worth this worry she'll understand you need time to recover. You deserve compassion with this illness!

I've done some reading on this subject and it seems that the exertion during sex isn't what produces the massive hangover that lasts for days or even longer. It's the body chemistry.

During sexual activity, the body releases adrenalin, lots of it. There's no getting around that, using gentler methods would not make any difference in that. If you get excited sexually, adrenalin is released.

Apparently it's a problem in the way we process adrenalin that causes the after-effects. So emotional trauma like arguing with a partner can do the very same thing by causing an "adrenalin-dump".

I've read posts by ME/CFS people saying that adrenalin is like a poison to them. That's been my experience too. It feels like a hangover or a case of the flu.

And it's strange that it usually takes 12 to 24 hours for the hangover to start. If anything happens that causes a crash, like over-exertion or emotional trauma, it usually shows up a day late for me. Other people with ME/CFS have reported that same thing.

My experience is exactly as you state it Richie. You wrote a clear and concise explanation of what happens to us. Crashing 12 to 24 hours after emotional or physical exertion is predictable with CFS. It's a bummer.....since we can't predict when we are going to have stress or unavoidable exertion. Sex can be avoided, but we may not want to! And, it begs the question: is it better to have loved and lost (energy) than not to have loved? I guess we all have to find our ways through this - yet another challenge.....