One of the hardest parts in all this mess has already been stated: We can only sit by and watch helplessly as they self-destruct. Because when they do things like that, it is they that are destructing, even though it feels as if we are. Hang in there Cudaman, and vent when you need to vent, and cry when you need to cry, because ultimately, it is all you can do, for yourself. You can't stop your feelings, your love; it just is. Many hugs and happy thoughts to you!

There is no doubt you love her cuda. IDK if this is all Karma or not. The thing is she has issues that you can't do anything about no matter how bad you want it. It is wise of you not to "step into it" again. People who behave like you describe will pull you down with them. If she were asking for help and making effort to battle whatever she has going on in a positive way it would be a different story. Sounds to me like she likes the drama and knew the story would get back to you. Probably in hopes that you might contact her to tell her how you feel. It's a trap hun.

You guys are pretty much dead on. I would think this is some kind of trap but on the other hand if you tell and ex lover that you had raw sex didnt wear a condom and got pregnant all that is going to do it send that person away. Harry and I are only aquaintences and that is it. If he was around all the time and him and I were hanging out and she knew it she might say this to hurt me and destroy me more. You know vindictive. But him and I are not freinds if I see him its hi Haryy how you harry etc. So I dont know what she would of gained by telling Harry this she knows where not friends. Ther would be nothing to gain from it. She knows that Haryy and I are not freinds and dont hang out. So I am just perplexed. She does seem to be self destructing though I would have to agree. Thanks you guys you really are a lot of help.

The grapevine works in mysterious ways

Yeah it does but these grapes sure are rotten!

Cuda - THIS IS TOTAL BULLSHIT! I'm just now reading your whole story and here's the thing... I went thought a ton of fertility treatment, had tripets, I know how dr's visits, tests, etc work. ...

IF SHE WAS ONLY 6 WEEKS PREGNANT, THERE'S NO WAY IN HELL THEY WOULD DO AN ULTRASOUND...SO THERE'S NO WAY SHE WOULD KNOW THAT SHE WAS HAVING "TWINS" IF SHE SIMPLY GOT PREGNANT & MISCARRIED. .. unless she was going through fertility treatment which they usually do ultrasounds regularly.... HOWEVER, I HAD TRIPLETS AND WENT THOUGH FERTILITY TREATMENT & THEY WEREN'T EVEN SURE IT WAS TRIPLETS UNTIL I WAS ABOUT 8 WKS PREGNANT - AND THAT WAS WITH A FERTILITY SPECIALISTS' ADVANCE EQUITMENT AND A VAGINAL ULTRASOUND.

NORMAL DR'S ULTRASOUND FOR A REGULAR PREGNANCY IS NOT DONE UNTIL AROUND 19-20 WEEKS! So the fact that she mentioned "twins" totally blows this made-up story.

I"m sorry for all the CAPS but it pisses me off b/c I am 100% convinced that she lied!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

She sounds like a manipulating B!&ch, GET AWAY FROM HER, SHE'S NO GOOD!!!!!!

Cuda, I do know this, from many years of experience. If you want the truth you go to the source.

Sorry for your pain.

I don't know if your ex's stories are true, if she has lied in the past, you can't ever trust her to tell the truth whether what you hear is painful or pleasant. that's the problem with someone with no integrity, smart people don't need much to learn not to trust them. And maybe that's all you need to know is, you don't trust anything she says.

having said that though, I Googled my exS a year or more ago and found he had been convicted of identity fraud while he was overseas. I didn't know if what I read was the gospel truth or the result of someone else he had hurt, conned or pissed off who was trying to ruin his reputation. But I know I felt long buried care well up in me. I hated him, but I also still felt affection and care at the same time. That alarmed me some, but as the days went by and I got settled with my feelings, I just accepted them as remnants of the love I used to feel, and in some small way still feel. The heart is notoriously ill connected to the rational mind. I don't let it bother me. I recognize it, acknowledge it, and don't do anything about it, and it goes away eventually, to resurface again on another day.

I think its Faithful77 who reminds us every now and then., emotions are just that -- emotions. We don't have to do anything with them.

Hang in there, this too shall pass.

She is a pathalogical lier that is one the main issues I have with her. This woman wouldnt keep her word if her life depended on it. Again Lucy Q is really shedding a lot of light on this. Question you guys? If you carried twins for 6 weeks and had a miscarrige would the fetus's be some what formed could you see that they where human ie head arms lege etc? Or would they just be globs? Thanks so much you guys you really are helping me a lot! I am just trying to figure this out. Would you know if there were one baby or two babys after 6 weeks?

hugs to you cudaman!!

Lump about the size of a bean. No noticeable development at that time. Smaller if twins, maybe feels like a really bad period.

You guys have really shed a lot of light on this subject. Again there is no way she would have unprotected sex with some dude without a test. This is comming from one person I have no way to confirm or deni if this is true or not. There has been times when I was gone for a long time when we were split up and she never screwed around once not once! That was one thing I really liked about her she was always true to me. If she did sleep with this guy I would be really surprised. For right now I just dont have all the answers. Thanks so much you guys you all are freekin ausum and you have help me alot beleive it or not. I dont really have all the answers but you have all shed a lot of light on this subject. Thanks again!

Cuda, hang in there. Take the advice and don't bottle your feelings up. After 22 yrs, it will take a long time to get over your love for her ... if that is even possible.

Next time you are around someone that starts to mention your ex, stop the conversation there and explain to them you do not want to hear updates on their lives. That is very painful to hear what they are doing. I have learned I had to be blunt...even with my own kids...and tell them I do not want to hear anything about my ex. Hard but what needs to be done.

Sending you hugs and support.

Thanks you guys I dont know what I do with out you! I have come to determination this must be a bunch of lies to hurt me. I dont know if Harry is behind or she fabercated up to tell Harry because Harry told them I was comming over to there place to put in the dishwasher I dont know. I thought would Harry did this on purpose by himself there is no way in hell he would know her tubes are tied unless she told him. Who and hell tells a 18 kid the freind of your sons that your tubes are tied and you had a misscarrige and a guy named Larry is the father? If is where true her tubes are cut and burned she would of had a tubelI would of need an emergency trip to the hospital is what I am hearing. will get to the bottom of this when I get back from my trip. I cant wait to get to the coast and get out of back stabin shit hole town! I just dont know guys I just dont know. You know it really takes some fucked up people to come up with this shit to hurt sombody! Thanks again everbody!