Atrial Fibrillation (AFib) Support Group
Atrial fibrillation (AF or afib) is an abnormal heart rhythm (cardiac arrhythmia) which involves the two small, upper heart chambers (the atria). Heart beats in a normal heart begin after electricity generated in the atria by the sinoatrial node spread through the heart and cause contraction of the heart muscle and pumping of blood.
I'm sure that Surfrat is going to love this thread!
This morning I opened Saturdays mail and found a bill from the hospital for my 3 days and two nights from my stroke. Here it comes, hold onto your hats:
$26,644.68 if I had no insurance. The insurance company wholesale cost reduced it by $11,573.75. So far the insurance company paid $2907. Therefore my resulting bill is $12,163.93.
Tomorrow I need to talk to my insurance company to find out what the glitch is. They absolutely should pay the whole thing (except for the phone).
The cost of medical care is this country is absolutely astonishing.
My ablation is April will probably run 100 grand!
This morning I opened Saturdays mail and found a bill from the hospital for my 3 days and two nights from my stroke. Here it comes, hold onto your hats:
$26,644.68 if I had no insurance. The insurance company wholesale cost reduced it by $11,573.75. So far the insurance company paid $2907. Therefore my resulting bill is $12,163.93.
Tomorrow I need to talk to my insurance company to find out what the glitch is. They absolutely should pay the whole thing (except for the phone).
The cost of medical care is this country is absolutely astonishing.
My ablation is April will probably run 100 grand!
I will not dispute that in the US we over consume health care. Some of that overconsumption is a result of a badly broken system. A lot less people would utilize emergency room and hospital services if our primary care system worked a lot better and didn't encourage (through economic incentives, physician specialization) physicians to abandon the primary care system People get sicker when they are not treated early.
Another element of the overconsumption is that the prices are enormously inflated because there is too much profit to be made from the system. IS it that we consume more CAT scans per capita than other industrialized nations, or that we pay way too much for CAT scans? Probably a lot of both.
But back on the AFIB issue, it seems that the going rate for an ablation is $100-$125K. That's a great deal of money for something that will take 2-3 days of services. What is one to do, take a drug that probably won't work, may do more damage, while your heart gets worse. Or, do what the doctor, who knows a lot more than you, tells you is the best course.
Or put it off, have another stroke and possibly end up in a nursing home at (North East Rates) $10-15k per month. Now I won't pay $100k, for the ablation, my insurance company will get their discount and maybe pay maybe $50K. Well they got a stream of income from me over the last 40 plus years with compound interest that probably adds up to $500k, so they can pay.
However, the point of my post, was that we need to defend ourselves from inadvertent and often overzealous billing. And as we get older, the potential for exploitation grows.
Pleas read the article I mentioned.
I'm tempted to start trouble and mention "death panels". But I'm mature, so I'm not going to do that.
I could say that I've been paying megabucks for health insurance for 44 years and have used very little of the healthcare system. But I'm not going to do that either. Paul already mentioned that.
I could say that the only time I've been to the ER was to get 64 stitches on my leg after a sailboat accident in 1985 (I'm 65 btw). But I'm above that. I know I've been lucky.
I could say that I've taken care of myself over the years (didn't smoke, ate well, no drug/alcohol issues), but many people weren't brought up the same way as I was, so it wouldn't be fair to do that.
I could say that I have worked hard all my life and draw a large salary and have saved money and feel that I should get the best health care available, since many have made poor choices in their lives or have not worked hard to get to where I am... but that would appear elitist... so I'm not going to say it.
I could say the health care system is drained by those that use the emergency rooms for regular checkups or for maternity care as they are undocumented (illegals). But that would sound too far to the left. Not gonna do it.
Or I could say that I have not fallen prey to EPs luring me in to get an ablation when I am an asymptomatic afibber, but I don't want to sound like I'm patting myself on the back.
And finally, I could say that I only want a good quality of life while I am alive and that I don't want to live to be 100. But that would be a lie. I want to live to be more than 100 in good health
So I'm not going to say anything. I've learned to keep some things unsaid. To comment would be just plain wrong. Mature. That's me. :-)
petey
"According to the Employee Benefit Research Institute (EBRI), a 65-year-old couple with median prescription-drug expenses who retire this year will need $295,000 to enjoy a 75 percent chance of being able to pay all their remaining lifetime medical bills, and $360,000 to have a 90 percent chance.
Those figures factor in the premiums for Medigap and Medicare Part D outpatient drug benefits to supplement basic Medicare, along with out-of-pocket expenses for prescription drugs. They do not include the cost of nursing homes or long-term care insurance"
for complete article see.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/101137178
opsyn
Not meaning to offend anyone, but it makes no sense to me that the worlds most powerful country can't provide affordable health care for it's citizens. The UK, France, Canada and many European countries do.
I wish we lived in Canada!
Right now I'm on Obamacame, and it's truly been one problem after another, trying to get my coverage straightened out. Thankful that I have an insurance agent to fax the letters to Covered California. And they say that Covered California is much better than other state programs?!
D.
Since you said all that you said you were not gonna say;-). I would add that there are lots of ways to live the "good life" and good drugs and good booze (my preference single malts) are another way...might be short and sweet but sweet all the same. While I was lucky like you in life's financial lottery , one must be careful in assigning guilt to that lottery's losers many of whom work hard for little reward. This is more or less tongue in cheek as you meritoriously almost single handedly carry these threads and I am just a lurker.
My experience on ablation (fairly successful 4 years one event) was that the gross bill (and they are gross) far exceeded what ins. paid and that was significantly lower than the numbers quoted in this thread. Barnes St. Louis hosp. Wash. U. Docs.
BTW, I hope everyone bought a lottery ticket. I bought one. I know my chances are slim, but it feels good to think I have a chance of winning $400M. Actually, I don't spend much money on clothes or food (I am content buying clothes at Walmart, Target, and Jos A Bank online and I eat kidney beans with olive oil and balsamic vinegar for a lot of meals... maybe they have organic beans that cost more I could buy. Seriously, I like to play this game... what would I DO if I won that much money?... not what would I SPEND it on... but what would I DO. It tells me what I should be doing now without all that money. My answer was: travel, donate some to people in need, take care of my family/kids, write more, see Italy and Ireland where my family came from, and consult with the best electrophysiologists.
I guess I got off topic.
petey
My comments, while I suppose are politically charged to a degree, were not meant to be political. Am I not entitled to my opinion? When someone starts a thread about the high costs of health care and I happened to know a lot about health care and have some ideas of how I think it could be fixed, I feel I have every right to chime in. I don't expect to be attacked or told to shut up, but I know that's how the libs like "liljohn" operate. Instead of debating the issues, they shut down the opposition. Will I will not be shut down, liljohn.
Furthermore, while everyone touts how great the health care systems are in every country except the U.S., why is it when the sh*t hits the fan, everyone flocks to the U.S. for the best care they can possibly receive? Our system isn't perfect but it has resulted in the greatest health care advancements in human history. I'm proud of the U.S. and the health care we have. No, it isn't perfect but ObamaCare will (and is) destroying it. Mark my words, 5 years from now if ObamaCare is in full swing you'll be yearning for the supposed broken U.S. health care system you have now.
Furthermore, I doubt Canada's system is as great as everyone says. For every person that brags about it, I can find a hundred stories of people waiting for months for the proper care or "fleeing" to the U.S. to get the cancer treatments they need or whatever life-threatening care they need.
Finally, the U.S. can never be managed by a single payer system. We're 10 times the size of Canada and 5 times the size of the U.K. The government isn't equipped to handle a program for 314 million people.
The health care system we had prior to ObamaCare is as good as you'll ever see it , sadly. It will only get worse and it makes me furious - and worried about what I'll be facing as my afib gets worse. I hope I can afford an ablation when the time comes but more importantly, I hope I'll be able to get the care I need.
Travis
P.S. For those of you that are supposed fans of the government running your health care, please give me an example of where the government has been successful in running any program of this size? Anything government has touched is broken - it's either inefficient, broke, corrupt, or all of the above.
I am glad that finally somebody (liljohny) said something about the REAL cost of an ablation. I am very surprised other people have NOT chime in regarding the cost. Please do since it is important for people who are on the fence like Paul.
Here it is: for my ablation, the hospital charging 92K, and the insurance only paid them about 8200 (less than 10%). My EP charged 8400, and the insurance paid only 2400. I am absolutely amazed how little the insurance is paying to the providers. Of course, I am a number guy, I know the insurance companies have to do this (low ball the providers) to be able to pay their CEOs very high salaries.
So, the problem is NOT the fact that the providers are charging too much, the problem is the fact that the insurance companies are paying the providers peanuts. As a result, the providers inflate their prices so they can get some jelly beans with their peanuts :-)
Travis,
It is the insurance companies who are destroying our great health care and NOT the other stuff that you mentioned. Please let me know if I am missing something here. I am going by the numbers that I see and not anything else. Somehow we got to get the middle guy out of our healthcare OR those companies must NOT be public companies. The insurance companies should be non-profit so more of our money go to the providers rather than the pockets of the insurance companies executives. I hope you see the problem with insurance companies being public companies.
My insurance company has paid less for my ablation than the sum of my monthly payments and my deductible amount.
Paul,
Your ablation will be much less than what you hear people say. They are talking about what the hospital will charge, but NOT what the hospital and doctors will get paid (the so called contracted price) at the end. That number is truly a shame. That is the reason a lot of doctors are getting out this business and hospitals are closing. Blame the insurance companies and NOT the Obamacare and alike.
Note,
Before my ablation, I did not know how little the insurance companies pay to the providers. Now, I see the numbers and I can't understand how our health care system can survive if the insurance companies continue to low ball the health care providers.
Numbers do NOT lie.
At this point would NOT recommend any kid to go to medicine. For the work and money that a kid has to put in to become a doctor, the reward is NOT there when they get a job. Again, I see the insurance companies as the problem.
Scott