Well said.

Agreed and thanks for taking the initiative on this topic.

I frequently suggest AA to those experiencing relapses here since it's free and available in most communities. However, AA is just one of many resources, including but not limited to DS, SMART Recovery, rehab centers, and individual counseling that can assist someone seeking to cease their addiction to alcohol.

To this end, all ideas and approaches promoting sobriety should be freely discussed in this forum without condemnation.

Peace.

"Part of that is pointing out where you believe some programs are effective and where others may need improvement."

The funny thing is that I rarely see programs other than AA being critiqued or challenged. If I am mistaken, please point out the threads in which the faults of other recovery programs are discussed.

Hear hear, BuckStag. I would like to see more cooperation and less fighting on this board too.

We're all here for the same reason. We're all here to do the same thing, get sober from alcohol. Let's knock off the fighting and just encourage and help each other.

I agree that AA is critiqued and challenged much more often than other programs. That fact alone is the basis for an excellent topic of discussion in itself.

In my opinion it is because AA prescribes a 12 step path that requires surrendering oneself to a "higher power" in order to deal with an "incurable disease". There is no doubt that these requirements are inherently controversial and ripe for questioning. There are no other programs that even come close to this philosophy and therefore AA stands out as a very unique and controversial approach in this regard.

Higher power = trust your instinct to do the right thing.

Mystery unlocked.

AA is not a cult, nor is it meant to be religious. I am not religious and aside from saying God in the serenity prayer, make no other mention to it.

Body and Mind!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFj8AaZmZvY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFdmbPS0MZw

Well said, Buck.

I have always advocated for the AA option as my own experience was quite ok when attending meetings for 3 months and as with any method/means to sobriety I am all for personal choice and whatever works for a person. I just don't have tolerance for condescension and blatant disrespect for other people's choices, whether that be someone knocking AA, or any other way a person has made their journey to sobriety. I would love for us to be able to discuss options in a respectful manner. Free speech, and all........

jeffneedshelp - I admire your tenacity and dedication to AA, I really do. I can be nothing but joyful for a program that has been life-changing for you. Pointing out the positives of the AA program (and not the negatives of others) may be a better way to persuade people that your program is a welcoming one. JMO, which really means SQUAT......lol.

To me, it's not even so much debating the pros and cons of the various programs. It's the manner in which the advice is delivered.

Somebody posts a question or problem and the immediate answer is "Go to an AA meeting NOW! Do not stop and pass GO." Then I've even read responses that don't let up and the OP is badgered and badgered about whether or not they attended a meeting. Sometimes that is completely irrelevant to what the OP even brought up.

Or, there are the well-rehearsed AA promotional messages that completely turn the OP's issue into how AA is helping the person who is responding, screw providing support to the OP.

I've never read anybody post, "Get you ASS online right now to SMART Recovery website." (And it's not because SMART Recovery does not work.)

This has been a recurring theme in the more than five years that I have been on DS. It seems to me that the arguments settle after a while and more tolerance results, until a few newer people come along and the flames are re-ignited. That is not an attack on the newcomers its just that they may not realize that they are turning the furrow on a field that has already been well ploughed.

There is nothing wrong with challenging something in a fair and honest manner but it can be easy to become side-tracked by personal prejudices and then the motives become questionable. If I had come to DS over seven years ago when I was in the grip of alcoholic addiction and looking for any excuse to continue drinking it is very unlikely that I would ever have gone to a meeting of Alcoholics Anonymous, based on some of the opinions expressed by people on this forum. Whatever about the rights and wrongs of the AA approach, I believe that it has saved my life and for that I will be forever grateful.

I had misjudged AA long before ever going to a meeting even though I knew nothing whatsoever about the fellowship. Therefore, based on my own experience I like to encourage people to go along to the meetings and see for themselves. Personal experience I think is a better way to judge something rather than endless debate with people who may or may not have their own agenda.

The DS Forum has become a place where it can be intimidating to post anything at all about AA or to even mention the name and that is a sad state of affairs. To even question those who attack AA for whatever reason will often produce a furious reaction, while it seems to be perfectly acceptable to throw out all sorts of outlandish claims, opinions and downright mistruths about AA.

I am all for a truce but remember that it is a bit hypocritical to shake someones hand while you are kicking them in the shin.

Thank you for the original post and all of the well-stated responses. In short, "I'll (not) drink to that!"

Hopefully, DS is one tool in all of our toolkits that helps us and everyone should be free to discuss the other tools that they have used and share what have helped them. In the end, it is everyone's personal journey and it is up to the individual OP to open all the windows a little bit here on DS and decide which ones to close and which ones to open further. They should feel safe opening up these windows and knowing someone here is not going to close it on their fingers...

Yes!! Unresolved issues only mimic the coldness like a old window creates in retaliation for lack of a more modern understanding to the heat to cold ratio dilemma emotionally. that Sooobriety May or May not give you as a Clue :))

Thanks Parth!!

ol drafty windows

I think PJ's comments are pretty spot on...I have been here about that same length of time.....I came to DS for other reasons but when I saw they had an alcoholism forum I knew that my sobriety counted and I either could help someone here or if there were some kind of need on my part I could have friends here that would help me...

the debate does affect me a bit because I am a person with experience in AA....I do not like the bashing that it gets but I also see other side of same coin that there are those in AA who will be my way or the highway here...instead of trying to realize that this new person is seeking help with a subject that is very hard for them to come to accept about their lives....

I guess true to that I know I am ok on trying to cease and desist about arguments here over topics that do not help anyone but fill every ego with puffs of strength....and desire to tell others what they want instead of how not drinking changes lives

Live and Let Live

The slogan, Live And Let Live has two parts. Let live reminds us to allow others the dignity of making their own decisions and experiencing the consequences of their decisions and choices. By minding our own business, we are freed from feeling responsible for changing other. We also learn to live by taking care of our own physical, emotional, and spiritual needs.

You can never build anyone up by tearing them down.