Women who Love too Much Community Group
WHEN BEING IN LOVE, MEANS BEING IN PAIN... This group is to help women through the journey of realizing they can love themselves. To help realize that they are capable of having a happy, healthy, whole relationship and break the cycle of abuse and heartache from loving emotionally unavailable men.
Hi all,
I have just had a weekend with my NH....and am seeing him through new eyes ...can I share these things with you and if you can help work them out for me, I am going over and over them in my head...
Will keep it to the two things bothering me most....he is in loving mode at the moment, yes I am waiting for the crash off my pedestal! I take all his loving with a pinch of salt these days and try and focus on the choices I make to how I feel and what I do in my day., one day at a time though! I havent crashed off my pedestal for a few days now.....!
anyway we went to a family BBQ this weekend but also this relates to going out in general and to all our time together, I also work for him ( he is a swimming teacher and has his own swimming school so at the end of term I give out the certificates etc and there is a grand OTT giving out of sweets etc too)
my issue is that he makes no eye contact with me at all, I noticed it the first day we met at his work and I watched him teach. He never glances at me, a little smile, touch of the hand. Nothing. even when we have family round for dinner he never once looks in my direction, even when he knew I was nervous, no squeeze of the shoulder or any of the usual eye contact I have had before in relationships. Sometimes I would have whole conversations with just one look with other partners. This Husband never looks my way. I feel invisible.
SO at this family BBQ I was right opposite him...nothing. I might not even have been known to him at all.
Why?!
I tried to ask him about his Mum this morning over breakfast ( I had made!! of course!...after satisfying him in bed as every morning!!!) about how their relationship was...he got pretty cross. He switched the question back on me, well did you tell your Mum about the time you were raped? or the time that old man took you to his room and stuck his fingers inside you ( I was 9) ....I said I wanted to talk about his Mum and their relationship - were they friends? Did they have a laugh together....he kept switching it back to me. I got up to wash the plates....and said but I am not talking about me and my Mum, I wanted to know about you and yours. He just looked at me , kissed me and went to his office. ( his Mum has Alzeimers so I am interested in how she was and how family life was for him.)
Strange response.?!
I am trying to plan things in my life for me that he stopped me doing ( volunteer work at childrens hospice, I used to paint murels with them) but he really doesnt 'approve' so its cold shoulder time. He also keeps questioning my insecurities, maybe I should have a conversation with him about it, about how his behaviour makes me feel his love is unreliable....or save my breathe eh!!!
Hope you are all ok xxxxx
I have just had a weekend with my NH....and am seeing him through new eyes ...can I share these things with you and if you can help work them out for me, I am going over and over them in my head...
Will keep it to the two things bothering me most....he is in loving mode at the moment, yes I am waiting for the crash off my pedestal! I take all his loving with a pinch of salt these days and try and focus on the choices I make to how I feel and what I do in my day., one day at a time though! I havent crashed off my pedestal for a few days now.....!
anyway we went to a family BBQ this weekend but also this relates to going out in general and to all our time together, I also work for him ( he is a swimming teacher and has his own swimming school so at the end of term I give out the certificates etc and there is a grand OTT giving out of sweets etc too)
my issue is that he makes no eye contact with me at all, I noticed it the first day we met at his work and I watched him teach. He never glances at me, a little smile, touch of the hand. Nothing. even when we have family round for dinner he never once looks in my direction, even when he knew I was nervous, no squeeze of the shoulder or any of the usual eye contact I have had before in relationships. Sometimes I would have whole conversations with just one look with other partners. This Husband never looks my way. I feel invisible.
SO at this family BBQ I was right opposite him...nothing. I might not even have been known to him at all.
Why?!
I tried to ask him about his Mum this morning over breakfast ( I had made!! of course!...after satisfying him in bed as every morning!!!) about how their relationship was...he got pretty cross. He switched the question back on me, well did you tell your Mum about the time you were raped? or the time that old man took you to his room and stuck his fingers inside you ( I was 9) ....I said I wanted to talk about his Mum and their relationship - were they friends? Did they have a laugh together....he kept switching it back to me. I got up to wash the plates....and said but I am not talking about me and my Mum, I wanted to know about you and yours. He just looked at me , kissed me and went to his office. ( his Mum has Alzeimers so I am interested in how she was and how family life was for him.)
Strange response.?!
I am trying to plan things in my life for me that he stopped me doing ( volunteer work at childrens hospice, I used to paint murels with them) but he really doesnt 'approve' so its cold shoulder time. He also keeps questioning my insecurities, maybe I should have a conversation with him about it, about how his behaviour makes me feel his love is unreliable....or save my breathe eh!!!
Hope you are all ok xxxxx
NH always answers a question with a totally obvious answer....this makes me feel like he thinks Im an idiot - I know I am overly sensitive but its weird ?! He seems serious and not being sarcastic...
such as
Me: I wonder why Lorraine went off so quickly ?( from work, she usually showers after teaching swimming)
NH: she's in a hurry durh.
( what I meant was why was she in a hurry?! but I dont need to say that to you right?!)
He wanted our honeymoon to be at the place he holidayed for 20 years with his last wife!!!
I put my foot down on that and never heard the end of it...he was always saying we would have had a better time at the place I wanted to go to....
and this summer break he wants to go to the same cottage he booked for the last 15 years in the New Forest....we are going there but to a different cottage ( my compromise) but if he doesnt know the area he isnt comfortable at all.
Whats that all about!!!?
what is more important to me is that is how YOU feel and how YOU experience his actions. if they are hurtful and harmful we can support you with that.
most of us have made the decision to get out so once in awhile it's a little hard to support you in staying with someone who is not treating you with respect...to watch you tolerate that......
maybe i could ask you to think about how we can best help you, empower you and what is it you're hoping to hear when you write posts like this???
i hope this comes across in the most gentle way b/c that is where i'm coming from....i really don't care about him or to talk about him. this site and this process is about you and your healing and your health......your best choices....lets go nuts on those things!
sorry.
Finn is right, what matters most are your feelings about it - you feel bad so this is the information you need: something is wrong. But then I think I know where you come from. You are in such place where you just start realising that the marriage is really wrong. You need validation of your feelings, that indeed what he is doing is not right. You want to see it from the outside with our eyes. I hope with time you won't need it anymore, you will learn to trust your gut feeling. But for now - what can I say? To me what you describe is not good.
The part about him being in the "loving mood" and you on pedestal? Isn't it classic dynamics of an abusive relationship? He was awful to you, now came the honeymoon phase.
And all the rest...no eye contact and his inability to talk about himself and his issues...no, it is NOT normal. Not good. And also how you have to do what HE wants? Even with holiday, really? Holiday is about relaxing and enjoying it, not about fighting.
Sunny, remember we are here for you and nobody is judging you - we all have issues, either with bad guys, or with our own reactions, we are all vulnerable and make bad choices. He is a very disturbed, sick person. You are also sick-because you chose him and other toxic men in the past. But you already realised it and want to heal. And also, you are a loving, caring person who deserves the best. So it is time to accept that you can't fix him... but you can fight for your own happiness.
Big big hugs xxx
i am a little forward so i', sorry if i blew you off your rocking chair....
reading panika's post makes me realize you may not be as far along in the process as i thought.
i would really recommend you go to natalie lue's website www.baggagereclaim.com and start reading. she can validate you with all of her talk about assclowns. she is also very talented at teaching us, showing us our responsibility in these very unbalanced relationships.
now where can i go to read up on your story/??
SO yeh still feel a durhbrain though!
Finmyway I have only been posting for a few weeks....
http://www.dailystrength.org/groups/women-who-love-too-much/discussions/messages/16886316
this is my first post...then...
is my husband a bully?
Im just trying to understand all this.
Thank you xxxx
xxxxxxxxx
sunny thanks for the link to your first post and then to the 2nd post about him being a bully.
i have re read everything. i feel like you are sort of naieve in a sweet innocent way but you are with a holy terror of a bully so trying to educate you and get you to wake up is probably what felt so awful from me. you are in it deep sister. you do not sound at all feisty when i read your posts. and he sounds like one of the bigger bullies i've heard of. so how does an innocent woman who is basically clueless to this cruelty be brought up to speed in a gentle way??????
i may not be the person first of all. second of all you need to start studying your ass off. read everything that is recommended if you want to know what's really going on here. wwltm live in a fantasy world. you are expecting him to be do say things he doesn't feel and won't ever do for you. the fantasy has to stop so you can get to the business of saving your soul!!!!
these are my recommendations;
read WWLTM by robin norwood
ready codependent no more by melodie beattie
buy the daily meditation book by melodie beattie called the language of letting go.
go to www.baggagereclaim.com and read natalie lue's blog posts particularly about fantasy ASAP!!! read as much as you can!!!
why do they do that?? by linus is a good book about abusers.
you in the VERY LEAST need the ability to have some solid boundaries with your husband if you have no intention of leaving him. he is absolutely a bully and you are ill equipped to handle him. i'm sorry. you have to know this about me, i am totally here for you!!! all the way whatever you need but i will always tell you the truth as i see it. i am totally open to being wrong and i will be the first to apologize if i'm wrong. no one ever got through to me until i get here and they broke down my fantasy of loving a psychopath. i fell in love with a psychopath. a very bad man. i love him still. i always will but i cannot be with him b/c it is insanely unhealthy for me and unsafe for me physically, sexually and emotiounally. i had to save myself and get out.
it was VERY deep and extraordinarily hard for me. i've been around a bit. i'm not flower. i'm a recovering alcoholic and addict, am a rape survivor, i've only ever had abusive relationships. i have chronic pain, obesity and health problems as a result of trying to cope with ptsd by myself *Which cannot be done* i've tried everything my way and it never ever worked. i was a social worker in the deep trenches of child protection and addiction and domestic violence and i've seen some really ugly stuff. there is not a lot that will surprise me. so i am sorry if i am a little hard on you or the women here. i've had to take responsibility for all of that crap for a lfetime of crap that i chose!! i chose to hate myself and punish myself almost to death literally. all this to say i'm a straight shooter.
what i know for sure is you cannot do this alone. it's great you are here. it's great you are questioning. but you are not a victim. you need to step it up and learn about the relationship you have chosen. if you want to stay i personally would never judge you for it. on the other hand if you want out i'm front row and center ready to cheer lead for you.
lots of women come and stay and stall for a bit before they make a move. that's great. they are staying. they are open. they are leaning. preparing themeselves perhaps.
out of all of the pain i have breaking up with my love was the worst pain i have ever felt that's why i'm still here. i know how fucking hard it is. and it's cliche but if I can do it then so can you.
i really appreciate that you answered my question by leaving the links for me to refresh. i see you. i want to pick you up like a baby biddy and put it back in it's nest while at the same time shake you and wake you up!!! please tell me to back off whenever you need to. practice your boundaries on me if you think i am being too hard on you. you will need boundaries with your husband that is a great place to start. i do hope you'll read your ass off. and take back one thing. at least one thing. if it's hospice do that. if it's getting a cat do that. if it's being proud of yourself or buying yourself a new red bra without asking for permission, go and do it and come tell us what it's like!!!!!! you are more powerful than you know!!! PROVE TO US HOW FEISTY YOU ARE!!!! you seemed to take pride in that but i don't see it in your posts.......show us how feisty you are and take your life back bit by bit. that doesn't require a divorce. but it will require strength. you've lost your voice. take it back!!!!! we'll help you take it back!!
I know how I got here. I chose this man. I was tired of being alone and wanted someone to make those hard decisions for me and shoulder the burden of life.
As for the feisty, I am talking about the girl before the guys.....! She is in there somewhere! Need to dig her out and kick her ass!
I too have survived rape ( and unwanted pregnancy from it, also abuse at age 9. )
I have enrolled on a counselling programme related to self-esteem.
My daughter leaves home for Uni next year, I cannot leave before then it will mess her up completely, we only moved here last year and it threw her schooling right off. In the meantime I plan to save and get things in place for me, I have signed up to finish the degree I dropped out of when I met him.
I need to address the issues which make me make these choices I know that. Living in this bubble is no place to be.
Relationship before this one was with a man who turned out to have Aspergers, that messed with me totally but previously I had been a carer to my husband of three years who had Paranoia / Borderline Personality Disorder and chronic pain due to a back injury ( although this turned out to be in his head, when they got to surgery on his spine there was nothing wrong!) I loved that man and being with him and his illness 24/7 turned me into even more of a co-dependant! My marriage to H2 was good, I felt strong and he urged me to be brave and does to this day. but his red-mist rages among other things made me leave him for the BPD H3...so out of the fire into the fire!!!
BPD H3 had three suicide attempts in two years. One day he just walked out and never came back.
I went back to Uni. It saved me.
So anyway here I am.
Happy? No.
Im so sad that I have made this bad choice again, of course he is god-like to everyone, ' such a generous man'
Im just deeply sad and coming to terms with the concept of this marriage failing which I hoped to be my last and this man who I hoped to spend the rest of my life with.....
As my Dad said about H2 the mistake or shame isnt in leaving it was in marrying him in the first place!!!
So Im focusing on me, and that is where I should have been focussing all along.
Today - is a painting day.!
Oh and yes I did buy some walking boots and trousers....there, Im reclaiming that!
(cant have pets as we are in rented, broke me and my daughters heart to rehome our two cats.)
xxx
i hope you stick around here and get yourself really strong and ready to leave once your daughter is where she needs to be. (that could be co dependent too but i'm not touching that one as long as you are not "pretending" it's about her and not you which it doesn't sound like you are).
i can hear the sadness in your tone....there is no shame in having a broken picker the only shame is in staying when it is abusive to do so.and that would be appropriate guilt actually.
i'm super happy you get to paint today!!!! what are you painting????
He 'made' me give up the things when I relocated, I realise now I made the choice to please him and not me!
He said No more to working in the hospitals. I was on a program of education to enable me to work as an art therapist you see so this was relevant to my future. He said I didnt need to work and that he would look after me.....blahblah! yup I fell for it!
and as for the degree, he kind of screwed up his face and said thats a waste of your time, what use is a degree?! made negative comments and if you dont do what he approves of the price is high, Im sure you know how that goes! SO the thought of his scorn every day when I went off to study did not fiull me with joy!!! I just couldnt face that.....so what did I do instead, I invested my money in an art fair business ( against my better judgment aaaargh!) which is far too slow to make any money. But starting this business was an eye opener, with him tut tutting at every decision I made. I did put my foot down on occasion but the price of his contempt at my decisions and the 'well, if this fails it will be because of the decisions you have made...I havebeen in business for 20 years, I know what is the best thing to do'.
I might add I have also been in business since my twenties when I had my own design agency....but hey who is listening right!
I am struggling to not look at him and cry right now. We went dancing last night and every wrong move was because ' I wasnt in the same mind-set as him'. Grrrr.
so my daughter, she's a great girl. Works three jobs and studies hard. Shes training to be a paediatric nurse. She sees right through him and challenges him all the time. In fact she just challenged him while they were at work ( he is a swimming teacher and she helps the small children in the water) she challenged his calling her a fat ogre ( as a joke!) and also on his method of teaching. ( that wasnt so clever!) so of course he took it upon himself to sack her in writing and call her to a disciplinary meeting....I quickly text her to resign before he got the chance to give her the letter but jeeez! Shes 17 what a shitty thing to do. I can see he is fuming that she question him. I cant bear to think about how someone , her step-father, would do such a thing.
Anyway, my painting....I paint dimensional sculptured paintings, flowers mostly but sometimes all sorts.
I do have dreams of being a success and being able to sell my work and I continue to try....in fact I will join the local art group TODAY! yes good plan, they exhibit....hmmm yes.
I have a website, www.artbuzz.co.uk and am on FB etc.
Have a great day.
xxx
Did I ramble?! sorry!!!
beautiful and so are you!!
i see the 3D. being an art therapist sounds like a wonderful career!
your daughter sounds like a firecracker who will go far in life....