not really anything new joy, there are people in this world who just want drama. Makes them feel important I guess. I really don't know because I avoid drama. I did have a good time discussing a topic yesterday. I was nice to engage and explore a topic without someone insinuating I am a moron or just dismissing me by saying "whatever" or "If you say so."

ps. thanks for the hug yesterday, I tried to return one, however each time I clicked on hug JoyRide or tired to go to your profile I got hung up in DS never never land.

ya whats up with DS? its dragging like molasses the last couple days!

well, I used to be a "dismisser", "wave people away witrh a hand", even insinuate conservative posters were dumb or blind so I was part of the problem too for months

and then there was this moment I read over one of my posts, to WIlson I think and I thought "what the hell am I doing? I'm not a bitch, I'm not a meanspirited person" and I felt so bad I apologized to him and a few other conservative people I had insulted

and thats when I started trying to understand their POV, because you people are NOT dumb or blind, but see things different from me3

and THEN (I just posted about this) I started seeing Obama, my hero, make choices that built and strengthened the very things that appalled me when Cheney/Bush did them

and it just goes on and on and on, I'm dumbfounded by how far things are going...and I just know, since it doesnt know any party bias, things will continue getting worse no matter who is in office

I'm blathering now arent I? sorry, this stuff is just so important to me and the future I want for my son, and I dont know how it might be reversed

so when the liberals on the forum attack the conservatives
and the conservatives attack the liberals
but they all blame each other for being nasty without taking responsibility for their own part in it
-- i get a headache

no, really

I have a headache

nobody would have to be banned or reprimanded or hurt or feel shushed or dismissed if we could all just figure out how to express our thoughts and opinions without making it personal

I think people who pay any attention to politics form very well defined POVs
and rather than being fluid or open to having their views moulded or change over time by evidence that things arent so black and white
they instead have lenses that see all the evidence that what they think is right
and that dont see things that contradict their well defined ideas

and I think that adds to people becoming further and further polarized

and you end up with some people who go on the offensive
and attack those who have different views
or vehemently defensive in order to defend their views from criticism

I think I sometimes fall into the latter category just because so many of my opinions seem so over the top to so many others

its a very short hop from there into attacking opponents in a discussion

I think its a very easy bog to find oneself in

I cant tell you the number of times Ive posted something and then wished there was an edit function !!

Our life experiences shape our views on EVERYTHING. I have had views on subjects in which I changed because someone posted their experience. It opened my eyes.

You're a good egg Joy, keep up the good work

aww shucks MisRed, I appreciate your views to even if you are a dumb blind conservative (ducking)

hahahaha

I want to believe the forums full of good eggs who just fall into that bog from time to time

call me Pollyanna if you want

sigh

I keep saying but its true, people in power give me more and more cause for concern as time goes on
but I'm putting my faith in other PEOPLE, regular folk to figure out how to create better things

ya, you better call me Pollyanna

ok, wheres the cake?

ha ha, I'm a conservative yet my guy says I'm liberal on lots of things. See, no one is ever just one thing and you along with others only see a wee small sliver of me here.

sorry, dear...no cake, I'm dieting so I can fit in my party dress

Neither party or political philosophy has a lock on virtue or nastiness. People are people, regardless of party or ideology.

Back when I was in Syracuse I attended an April 15th Tea Party rally. I was pleasantly surprised by the diversity of attendees, however I decided to not join any of the various Tea Party groups at the event.

Based on all the recent revelations of IRS targetting, DOJ snooping on journalists and now the cyber-snooping I' seriously reconsidering, even though that might put me right in the crosshairs of some government agency or other.

Concerning the recent W&T drama, I think someone is upset their comfort zone has been invaded by "The Enemy'. And yes, I kow you and bitemepa were the primary targets of her posts.

youre both so very right of course
and echo my sentiments
nobody is ever black and white
and no party has cornered virtue or nastiness

but I am on the lookout for integrity and honesty, compassion and wisdom

and where the hell are those things in the world of politics these days?

Yep, I never once wondered WWMPPD (what would my political party do) when it came to deciding where I stand on issues. I think I am smart enough to decide on my own by doing my own research and asking questions. W&T board could be a great place to do that. At least that is how I use it. Others use it to debate and bash.

i can't go near that particular board.

i don't have a party. i used to be green, but lived with the canadian federal leader of the greens (we watched 911 in her living room, in utter horror) , and another who ran for mayor, and i'll never, ever vote green again.

to be honest, i see north american governance more as a conglomerate of mega-corporations and less about `voice of the people', and it drives me bananas to encounter those who tow the `strict party platform' at the expense of evidence to the contrary.

sighhhhhh.......waiting out this paradigm `blip' is an event for my next life.

i think we're in the same boat on that one Mojo
almost word for word

sounds like theres a story behind your disillusionment with the green party

as for the forum
i've been on the receiving end of personal attacks for a myriad of things, and then accused just recently of living a life of fear and doom (the one person on there who knows me better than anyone else could testify my life is anything but), and then saying i insult the very person who makes those insults about me

i had to pinch myself to make sure i wasnt in bizarroworld with that last one

cuz, well, you missed it Mojo, but my jovial, friendly, flirty, sunny self got criticized for that so relentlessly last year i gave it up on that forum to be more serious...and now i'm being accused of taking things too seriously

i just cant win with those people

i just had to realize for whatever reason they dont like me and will dislike every little thing about me and make it public, its the weirdest thing but what else can a person do?

just have to choose to be ourselves anyway

in terms of politics or people discussing them, its become clear, we have different lenses through which we see things

and each other

Stay true to yourself Joy. Haters gotta hate. Last week in San Antonio (That's in Texas) a young singer born and raised in Texas sang the national anthem. The stuff people wrote on twitter was horrible. They called him hateful names and said he wasn't even an American. I was shocked and ashamed how he was treated. He was on American idol not long ago and sings mariachi music. He was dressing in his mariachi costume when he sang. His voice was clear and beautiful. He got every word correct which is better than most Americans. He was invited back the next night to sing and accepted the invitation. I hope and pray he doesn't get jaded over the experience.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFeFRLvi8TQ

my apologies
most of the time i try to see things from anothers POV
or give them the benefit of the doubt
or even turn the other cheek
although i find i'm still gettin smacked

but sometimes, i feel like a frustrated adult in a room of _______ children

i know that makes me sound like a bitchy snob, but
its so rare to have a dispute in there that has been handled like 2 adults, who are capable of conflict resolution

patti, verne, JAGS, Wilson and Biteme are a few who HAVE been able to do just that
and my hats off to them
i sometimes suspect its more rare than i think for people to resolve disputes

i blame reality tv ha!

do you think we're all susceptible to some degree
to better-to-be-right-than-be-happy?

i reread my last post and think i'm falling right into that myself???

i think true resolution is impossible for people with diametrically opposing viewpoints.

the best one can hope for is a "i respect your right to be wrong, you respect my right to be wrong", which is kinda' like eating bubblegum for dinner; it may be tasty, but it certainly can't truly satisfy.

that is exactly why i avoid the W&T group. banging heads w/ billygoats harshes my mellow, and respect is in short supply.