Em: You said, " Is it really a big deal?" Well, that depends. To some it isn't. To others it is. That I know of, my H hasn't ever committed physical adultry either. Of course, I can never know that. The fact that he was so intrigued with other women enough to fantasize being elsewhere, is enough to make me wonder if he didn't...and if he didn't....why not? But, anyway, what those behaviors meant for me...me personally...was dissatisfaction with me. He needed something more than me. I wasn't the object of his desire? And, like any person in a marriage, I wanted to feel loved and desired by my own h? So, if I'm not it? If I'm not enough, then how can I feel in the marriage? I can't feel very good about that. I guess I'll do, because I'm there, but if REALLY given a choice between me and those he fantasies about, I wouldn't be the one chosen? And so, then, to me, is he really "married" to me? Really want me? Or, not?
No one wants to feel like that. You're here...but you don't really want to be?

So, it's personal I think. Some are satisfied with what they can get...he's here at the moment so? I can't be happy that way. Being with a man who'd rather be somewhere else? Doesn't work for me. I want to be with a man who WANTS me? So, I won't accept that. But, that's personal to me? I need to feel desired and loved...and if I can't then I don't want to be subjected to playing second fiddle where his desire is concerned? I guess I'm just needy?

Em: I don't know how long everyone on here has been married except maybe Trina and Sheen. I have been married 29 years and together 35. I am 52. The first part of our marriage was the porn and then the internet wasn't big so it was mags and maybe a videotape here and there. Then there were strip clubs that business "entertainment" was the rationale. Many people around us did it and the men went for birthdays or business and the women "accepted" it. Didn't like it but put up with it and bought into the bullshit of no touching etc.. Well as Charlie will tell you on the other board this is a progressive disease whether it advances into massage and prostitution or whether the porn just gets more daring and risky and offensive. But it does progress and the effects later are even more devastating. Stick with it and stay in reality. You want to know if "it really is such a big deal"? Look at the devastation on this board alone. Your h needs help.

Thanks all fro sharing your stories. they do sound sooo similar and help me back to a grounded state in the midst of my confusion. I've been on-again off-again on DS for over a year and never wrote out my story on the story posting, but I'll try to do that tonight or soon. Our history does include his solicitation of prostitutes and a two year affair with a coworker. Also strip clubs, an emotional affair, sex club visit and online porn. Every time something happens we go to counseling for awhile, he says he's sorry and it won't happen again, we communicate and work through it, but working through it with the approach that it is an isolated event. Not a bigger issue and not addiction. A year ago I told him "no more" and we went 11 months without a problem. He is a very social person with a very wide group of active friendships. i don't think he is disconnected emotionally most of the time... in fact I think I am more disconnected than he is but that has been changing. I've grown stronger in all my research on this and made strides forward in opening my heart to others. I'm feeling hopeful because we are finally going to a highly recommended therapist very familiar with SA (recommended in my s-anon group) and I know this is the end of the line for me. I know I am worth this process and no marriage is worth all this... it feels degrading... and I want a life of integrity.

Yes, as spouses of SAs we will also disconnect...I know I did for many years and I also had several emotional affairs with other men to make up for what I wasn't getting at home. I'm all done with that and being disconnected from the people who matter to me the most including my husband. This is a long journey, but one I am willing to make because, like you, I also want a life of integrity.

Hi guys, just wanted to share we had our third Saturday session (another hour and 1/2) with our addiction therapist and i think it went really well! I'm feeling good about it. I'm not making any big assumptions that we are out of the woods or he is going to go to recovery, but I feel like i stood up for myself in a clear way. I told him that if he doesn't have a change of heart about this stuff then I will insist on a 6 month separation and then we can get back and talk at that time to see if we will divorce. I told him I don't fear separation any longer but feel sad about it because I love him and feel concerned about him too...I'm not just wrapped up and self-absorbed in my own feelings of pain but also concerned about him and why he needs porn. The therapist asked me to be specific about why I felt this way about needing to separate and I (usually a quiet person of few words) went on at length exactly why in great detail, leaving nothing to the imagination. Then the therapist asked my husband to repeat what I said and I was stunned that he could actually do it! He was actually listening! Wow. I feel like I've been talking to a door knob for months and it just woke up and talked back. How surprising!! And he did it in a very authentic and heartfelt way. As we left the therapist said that was actually one of the most amazing couples sessions he had ever seen (maybe he tells everyone that). But he said it again later over the phone when he called me back to schedule the next session. So maybe it is true... because it has taken me four years of individual work to get here and it all just dumped out at once. All my anger, sadness and love for him poured out. Thanks to all of you here for helping me find the words! :)

I really feel hopeful for you and your H Em. Just the fact that he was able to listen to what you had to say and repeat it back to you with emotion is a huge step for him or for any addict for that matter. Bravo to you for finding your voice! When two people are able to communicate to each other there is always hope for a marriage.

I am glad that you had such a great session and felt empowered to communicate yourself and be heard!! That's the great feeling. You didn't leave that office: I forgot this, I wish I said that or I should've said this when he said that. I am very happy for you.
My h and I did have a 6 month separation out of the house and when he came back we stayed in separate parts of the house for another 2 months. I believe this was critical. It was called a therapeutic separation and no one really explained it to me and why it was beneficial to do this. I needed space to grieve (even tho I wanted him to see that) I was angry and would have gone to him and he wasn't capable at the time to deal with me, He needed withdrawal time with as little outside stress as possible plus I think he needed to see what life would be like without his family to give him the motivation to see it through and get started on a daily program to beat this thing. At first I panicked that he would like a "single" life plus I wanted to hurt him with my hurt. I still do sometimes to be honest but he still isn't at any empathetic stage. You have more recovery at this point in time than I did tho Em. That makes a huge difference too.

Thanks all for your support. Now I am trying to pull together what I want to say for the next session in two weeks. i think I am going to write it all down and then pray continously over it. One of the items on the table is this scenario: he makes certain my son never finds out about it and that it is never in front of my face or around me. He has a corner of his life that is hidden from me but he is allowed to use porn. This feels like danger to me and is certain to bubble back up into our lives. It feels like hiding and pretending and not a true solution...