I'm sorry, and unfortunately know the feeling too.

Even after all the rude awakenings I can stomach about my abusers' behaviour, and knowing logically beyond a single doubt what they are, nothing really kills the memories of my amazement at someone being so "made" for me and me for them. Apparently.

Bottled, this may sound trite, but you WERE an amazing girlfriend and fiance, and you still could be to anyone you chose. He just didn't have the hard-wiring to appreciate it all.

Sometimes, leaving the complexities of forgiveness aside for a moment, it helps me to think of them as someone whose brain is broken and can never be fixed. What they did was still wrong, and the broken brain image is strong enough to sort of put the mystery to rest for me. They were damaged probably at a very early age - so early that it is unfixable in adulthood.

I do definitely get what you are saying, though. To those of us who do not engage in this kind of behaviour, it can frequently be unbelievable that a person could "act" and lie in these ways all the time. I still feel as if I have been dumped on my backside out of a pitch black bag over my narcissistic father whom I last really spoke with in about 2008 - it's as if he lied all those years ago, when I was little and growing up and he at least behaved a bit like a dad, before he decided he didn't want to know me. Now I don't exist to him, so what was all that acting before about...?

Just want you to know you're not alone. Hugs, and wish you peace and healing xxx

It is really hard to continue a lie because the lie gets harder and harder to keep straight in someone's head. Things will catch them every time. Telling the truth is so much easier. I'm sorry that he has been lying to you all of this time and has hurt you so bad, I just hope you are getting out of a deceitful relationship before you get sucked in too deep. Let us know how you are doing, okay? Hugs GB

I do believe that you are a good girlfriend and fiance and this type of guy is just abusive and something is wrong with him. Sometimes I think about it and know that even if it was me, even if it was him, even if it was both of us, it didn't work so its time to move on. Mine lied all the time right in my face and denied it even when I caught him lying. Its crazy and they have problems we cant solve. Don't give up on your future you will find someone who will appreciate and love you properly one day. Maybe this bad stuff happened to us so we would learn something. At least now we know what we don't want right?! I hope we all feel better soon and heal from the abuse and craziness. One thing I don't miss is all the mixed up feelings I had when he was here. Its so peaceful even in my mind now. I try to look at some of the good things in between all the anger and resentment I feel for him and say ok well one thing at a time a little something is better this way. I think we need to get to the point of being able to accept what has happened as just fact. Its bad not good. We hurt right now but we will hopefully grow stronger for it in the future. I am seeing some come on and say how much better things are for them and how glad they are the did it and I want to be one of those people who does it this time. It took me so long to get here.... so long to quit going back to it all... Today I feel a tiny bit thankful just for having some peace in my head, my life, and my home. Even though it still hurts to think of what they did to us having no concern for our feelings. Ya know?

Thank you everyone for the kind words, understanding, and support. I've been officially and entirely out of the relationship for a very long time, almost a year. I've been No Contact for almost as long, aside from a quick apology I sent just to clear my conscience not long ago, but he is still blocked and staying that way for my wellbeing. There's nothing more to say to him. I know I'm doing better than I was, but yeah, I still hurt. It really sucks knowing that he's not the only person like him, and while I've learned to recognize red flags, being with him turned my perception of people completely upside-down. I don't like that at all. I miss liking people in general.

Living with his paranoia and negative assessments of others, combined with pulling the rug out from under my feet after he created some "you and me against the world" environment, it has rubbed off on me more than I care to admit. I know there's no set timeline on healing, but I'd seriously kill to reach that day where I wake up and the first thought I have isn't "so it wasn't all a bad dream."

I don't feel I learned a lot from that relationship. I feel as if I grew so much as a person before I ever met him, and maybe some in between. But there's absolutely no sense to be made of what happened, and I've accepted I'll never know other than he was sick/disordered/abusive, and that he's unfortunately not unique. I don't know where I fit in the world anymore, because I'm super uncomfortable knowing that I chose that for myself for awhile. I hate that some people choose to be cruel on purpose, when at least trying to be nice is so damn easy. It's so sick.

Is it possible he did love you?

I mean in a seriously messed up, not right way.

I love chocolate in an, extra 15 pounds, don't touch mommy's emergency stash kind of way, and when I am in pain I seriously have some passionate feelings about Vicodin that can't be explained with words (I'm not addicted).

I think they don't know the difference between love and using. They don't know the difference between people and things.

Is it weird to say, its love, but not really love at the same time?

Thanks for posting. I so agree with you. We have been separated since March, and I have been away from here for awhile, but I am back because I realize just how difficult it is to deprogram from all of the craziness that was done to us. I have lots of books and they do help to explain the way the sick mind works. And now my stbx has begun the process with a new "woman of his dreams" who he will come to be the perfect reflection of, only to, once he has sucked her in and wrapped her up tight, ...turn the tables and begin the process of sucking the life out of her. So sad.

Tangelo, while there is a possibility he did love me, it became very conditional and was clearly unconventional. It would be more accurate to say, if he did love me, he both hated and was indifferent toward me throughout, all at the flip of a switch. It was the sudden indifference and hate that threw me for a loop, and yes, using me was very much a part of it. I've read about how it can be similar to love for an object, and by your description, it very much relates.

Rosiekins, that sounds about right, from how I understand it. It does feel better knowing you guys can relate to what I'm talking about.

Bottledbreath, I know I connected with my ex-fianc so quickly, much more so than with anyone I've dated before. I have been married once before and I wasn't even nearly as open and close to my ex-husband as I was to my ex-fianc. He knew how to be charming and how to pretend to be vulnerable so that I would do the same. I was only with him for 6 months total. The love that they had was more of a desire to control and manipulate, rather than truly loving us for who we are at the core.
I've thought about the growth I've had since leaving my ex-fianc. Like you, I feel like I had made so much progress before going into this relationship and totally got blindsided by him. I don't even know how this has happened. How did I let someone who was such a misogynist, racist, prick get so involved in my life? He has a close relative who's said he feels he's a sociopath and the thought of him being that scares me, but I believe them. Anyway, I also feel like this whole relationship has set me back so much, because now I feel jaded and angry and don't know if I'll be able to trust someone again. In fact, the idea of dating again (and yes, it's only been 2 weeks so it is very soon) makes my skin crawl.

I'm sorry for your pain.

No one who isn't able to love
themself can truly love anyone
else. Emtionally disordered
abusers can't actually love themself.

If they love their victim, it's
because they love having
an accessible "supply"
bonded to them.

They love having someone
bonded who won't up and
leave them, the moment
they become abusive.
The victim might get up
and leave eventually,
but generally not right
away ---- so that gives
them time to attempt
to manipulate the
victim back into
their control.

It's a painful reality
to wrap one's mind
around.

The best antidote
is to practice
meticulous self-care.



It's just consistent
with their disordered
emotional condition.

Unfortunately, I know the feeling too. I'm sorry for what you've gone through, compliment yourself for seeing it when you did and for getting yourself out of it before the time became any longer than it already was, that took a lot of strength in you. Sending you hugs

Thank you again everyone for all of your support and understanding. On a logical level, I know you're all right, and everything makes complete sense. It's just sending all that info to my heart in a way that it can grasp the concepts that's the kicker.

I think it was one of the hardest things for me to understand. It looks so much like real love.