No but it sounds interesting! Will check it out!

Christopher:-)

michael; good article. i will have to reread it,, got to see if it is against my diet to avoid kidney stones. seems hh diet contradicts the low alcalade thing . i don't know that much about stoneage yet but one thing i do know is they huurrrrttt. i advise one avoids them at all cost... thanks for thinkin of us...
oh and no i have never heard of it till now... tanks dc

mich have you checked out wickpedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wheatgrasshttp:
//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wheatgrass
i don't know how to copy the addy that works.. i saved the info. check it out. shows how to grow it and juice it etc...
later,, I wonder if you smoked the wheatgrass, if it would get into your system better..?? probably hard to keep lit!! doa i hate that when that happens!!

Good post! (it dates from 2009 but I'd not read about it)

It reminded me of CURCUMIN, which may also have the same effects. I'd read about it when I first got diagnosed but had forgotten about it completely.
e.g.
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6T38-4HNYK9H-1&_user=10&_coverDate=04%2F01%2F2006&_rdoc=1&_fmt=high&_orig=browse&_origin=browse&_sort=d&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=5ae51f2e23a1caea69f53b5bba597413

and
http://bloodjournal.hematologylibrary.org/content/113/2/270.full.pd

And two more possible chelators I've just noted (seem to work in a different way to above)

BLACKCURRANTS
See lower half of page (note also deceleration of interest at bottom of page)
http://www.internationalblackcurrantassociation.com/archives/archives_FebruaryFeatureStory2011.html

alt article
http://greenbayharvest.co.uk/shop/categories/Articles/Research-on-Combating-Free-Radical-Damage/
It also mentions honeydew melons & redwine.

and HONEY
Note some honey has low iron but others can be around 18% RDA, but may have low bioavailability(?)

I also have a vague recollection of lactoferrin ......?

Got no time to research at present . . . . .

Feral,

Thanks for your post. I checked and Curcumin is one of my daily supplements I take. I also put fresh blackberries or blueberries in my morning shake so i think I am covered on the Black Currant consumption.

What I thought was interesting about the wheatgrass article was that it seemed to be able to remove iron from ferritin. My previuos opinion was that the natural chelators were helpful in preventing iron absorption and possibly chelating "free iron" and the only way to extract iron from ferritin was by phlebotamy.

I am taking a powdered green food supplemnt which has a high percentage of wheat grass in it. Growing and juicing my own wheat grass is a little more work than I am up to right now.

Interesting...thanks! I had read somewhere that you need to push the inorganic iron out with organic iron. Any kind of iron sounded scary to me. This is the kind of info I love....thanks :-)

Michael,
You're way ahead of me! Good for you!

I'm doing like wise and adding berries to my daily diet, any little reduction in iron is good, as far as I'm concerned.

I'm also looking at juicers & growing grass (wheatgrass YREKADC!! ha! ha!). I was wondering if it would work forever or if the body would overcome it. But the fact that the study was over 6mths suggests it does (we need to see the full study to know how/if rates changed month to month). I'm was about to start "cycling" between tea & calcium (1-2 month cycles) to reduce absorption of iron as I've read that both can stop being effective after a time (though cycling may not help?).

I also remember reading that "tea in capsule form" did not affect iron absorption in one study, possibly because some studies suggest it's the saliva produced that reduces absorption and not the actual tea, if only there was a definitive study!

I wonder if the wheatgrass capsules may be similarly affected? I know it's the tannins in tea but the oxalic and malic acid as well as the "two unique active ingredients" in wheatgrass that seem to chelate the iron. Or could it be they are just release more of the compound in saliva that affects absorption? (both tea & WG give me that dry tongue feeling and seem to cause increased saliva, though I have no idea if it's the same reaction). I'll be interesting to see if your capsules seem to increase the rate at which ferritin reduces. In fact I'll go and buy some myself tomorrow, since it'll be some time before I'm organised enough to produce my own WG. BTW also recall reading that some tea capsules could stress the liver . . . .

I suppose "natural" chelation will be of most benefit when we are in the maintenance phase in that we will reduce frequency of phlebs or possibly even stop them altogether if we can match the figures from the above paper (assuming it works the same on us HH'ers long term). Though even during treatemnt stage a ferritin reduction of 300 is at least 3 phlebs over the 6mths (considerably more for some people if we look at the highest levels which reduced from 4800 to 1680).

So glad you found this article! I don't know how I missed it as I searched for natural chelators when first diagnosed! But all I found were people incorrectly using the term "chelate" when they really meant "reduce absorption". Like you I didn't think there was a natural chelating agent!

I think looking for natural chelators is the way to go too! I started my wheatgrass shots yesterday. I will keep you all posted :-)

Feral,

Thanks for the post on things that block iron and maybe chelate iron. I think that ferritin is such a good chelator it is hard to extract the iron form it.

From some of your other posts, it seems like you and I are one of the few people that have not experienced being tired and fatigued.

So I looked at the black currant info and decided to add 8 oz of "Just Black Currant' juice to my morning shake. From what I can see the black currants seem to have more antioxidants than blueberries.

I looked at my ferritin reduction and saw an interesting datapoint. Suppossedly one shoud have an average reduction of ferrittin of 30-50 for each 500 CC phlebotamy. Over 14 months, I have had the equivalent of 25 phelbs and have seen a ferritin reduction from 1250 to 750 ( or 2o per phleb).

My last reduction in ferritin was 20 for a 250 CC phleb which is twice my historical rate.

In my book the iron absorbning and possibly chelating candidates I consume are wheat grass,circumin, raw oatmeal, back currants, blueberries/blackberries,coconut oil, and a high fiber diet.

I'll keep you guys posted.

michael,
I'll be interested, too as I want my #'s to drop faster than they are (currently at 2327!). How often do they ck your ferritin level? Mine are every 3 weeks now.
Keep us posted.

zzzzzzz

I will check this out also....I added elderberry and wheatgrass to my diet.....

don't forget.............. keep me posted.
Thanks!
zzzzzzzz

Michael
Yes, it does seem like we are luckier than most as we have not suffered tiredness. :-)

I started taking barleygrass pills last week as my local chemist had no wheatgrass and due to public holidays I would have had to wait, also I couldn't get hold of real wheatgrass quickly. Anyhow long story short I hope I will see an increased rate of reduction in ferritin/iron, I have my levels plotted on a graph so should be relatively easy to see an increased rate (I will measure slope).

My ferritin began dropping at a high rate of about 100 each week (from 2300) but rate is now down to about 40 (at around 600), which is to be expected as each phleb of 450ml has progressively less ferritin in it. But hopefully with wheatgrass / barleygrass rate will increase somewhat!

If I don't see any change I will buy fresh wheatgrass and continue as a guinea pig!!! (I wouldn't be surprised if body doesn't absorb or utilise pill form of grass as well as fresh)

I will keep everyone up to date with my progress.
(Hope to get a hint this Thursday when I get levels from last weeks phleb, however I don't expect much as I'd only been on tablets for 5days)

Update:
Had a phleb yesterday and thus first results after starting barleygrass tablets (i.e. not wheatgrass & not fresh juice). Unfortunately it's not of much use yet, as too many variables, but thought I'd post it anyhow.

Ferritin went UP slightly from 528 to 574.

But the following needs to be taken into account
1) Had been on tablets for only 5days prior to last phleb at which time they took the above blood test, so I didn't expect to see any effect of pills.
2) My level has gone up on 5 previous occasions (by as much as 90) but has then normally dropped more than expected the following week
3) I missed previous week's phleb so interval was 14days (though did this once before and levels still dropped by about normal amount)

We'll have to wait months to see results (unfortunately I may not give good ref. results as I've got 3 more phlebs booked then I have 3wks holiday in Hong Kong, so no phlebs)

Did anyone else almost have a heart attack when reading iron content of wheatgrass per 100g? More than double a fortified cereal!!! I recovered once I read the recommended dosage was 2g, (4 tablets) which meant only a small dose in reality and even that should not be bioavailable due to chelating effect.

FYI
These studies/comments should also be born in mind

There may be a delayed effect to begin with
Quote
"Interestingly, the authors noted that the response to WGJ therapy took some months (the neutral period);" End Quote
from original study.

Ref also these replies
http://www.indianpediatrics.net/june2005/618.pdf

and
http://www.indianpediatrics.net/jan2006/79.pdf

This study found no positive effect

Effect of wheat grass therapy on transfusion requirement in beta-thalassemia major.

CONCLUSION:
We conclude that wheat grass therapy for one year is not effective in reducing the transfusion requirement in transfusion dependent thalassemia.

Indian J Pediatr. 2009 Apr;76(4):375-6. Epub 2009 Feb 10.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19205635