Reeling from daughter and sister's alliance against me
It is too bad that positive feelings don't last at all! My father and stepmother who I love very much came to see me this week. They are angry with my sister for allowing my husband to continue to stay with her after he decided not to transfer to Raleigh because he ended the marriage. They have had a very strained relationship with my sister D. due to this and I asked them to behave nicely toward her to keep family peace. So all went well but 2 days ago we had a disagreement over where to eat dinner out. My father was paying so I picked an inexpensive place because there would be 8 of us (D. was bringing her best friend/roommate who she has been with constantly causing me to be jealous because D. doesn't really want to do anything with me since she moved here about 1 month ago). D. wanted to go to a hamburger grill restaurant which would be more money because she said my dad told her he wanted a big hamburger. Everytime we get together she tries to change plans. This got ugly fast so I said I would call my daughter and ask where she wanted to go with her family without telling her the whole story. She said the original plans were better since they had hamburgers the night before. So I call D. and she tells me that she is not feeling well from the heat and probably won't be coming. So she doesn't and we end up having a nice time.
Last night was my parents' final night and I planned on buying pizza to bring to my daughter's house for everyone but my father insisted on paying for it. When we leave and go home I know that my sister is talking about me to my daughter and my father says that I am making my own problems as this is not true. So I know my sister and call my daughter and she admits that they were talking negatively about me. My d. goes on to say that she knows about the restaurant and other things my sister has told her (this happened years ago when my sister alienated my daughters from me because her kids are so screwed up with drugs, etc. but she plays it like she is the greatest aunt in the world). She later apologized to me because she attends Al Anon and must do the step about making amends. But she won't tell her ex that she cheated on him before she asked him for a divorce. So my d. says that her aunt and she have had enough of me and wish I wasn't so manipulative and a liar. My d. was very nasty and said things that a dtr. should not say to her mom. She told me that my therapist doesn't know the real me and I should get help and change. I told her to write down every concern she has and I would take it to my therapist but she refused saying I would only twist things around and make her look like a terrible dtr. I always speak highly of her to all and never want people to know her nasty side which I am no longer going to do. I will be honest from now on. I did that with my ex for many years making him look like he was the best ever and made excuses for him when he refused to go out with others after plans were made because he was angry with me for something.
My dtr. continues on to say that her father is a wonderful nice person and that she loves him so much. I say that of course she does as he buys her so much. She was furious and told me that if he never bought her another thing she would always love him and respect him because he doesn't give her aggravation like me. She told me that he said that he should have never married me because I treated him so badly and threatened to kill myself the first year of marriage. The threat was true (which I never meant) but I was so desperate for affirmation that he cared I was reduced to that. He knew I didn't mean it but was saying that for his attention.
My other dtr. told me today that she is going on a cruise with her dad next week. I am so upset because of the memories of all the trips we took in 34 years even though during most of them he was miserable. I hate that he tells the kids so many things although my oldest dtr. says they never talk about me.
Back to 1st dtr. - she said she wishes I was nicer and that she doesn't respect me in some ways. When I asked about her dad she said she respects him except for the way he handled the separation by dumping me on her in her apt. with a high-risk pregnancy with the twins. But she said he has apologized and she understands why he had to do it that way because he had to get away from the marriage as it was toxic.
She told me that I am losing all relationships with others and so I manipulate to keep them. I told her that my sister D. has always done that and there was a time my dtr. wouldn't speak to my sister and I tried to patch things up for them. I did the same when my dtr. and ex didn't speak for awhile when she lived with my sister. My dtr. said it is my fault because I was happy that she didn't speak to them and tried to patch things up between her and them because I was in over my head and scared. ???
My dtr. is the one who doesn't like many people but she said she has changed now. I get along with everyone except she and my sister. She said only my parents and best friend Nancy like me and my "loser support groups and forum friends' because they don't really know me.
She said that I try to make her angry with my sister which is not true. She said that when I asked for her opinion about the way my sister hung some of my pictures that I had a "gleam in my eye" and was happy because she did not like the way my sister did it and I said that my sister told me that I shouldn't care about what my dtr. thinks because it only matters what I think so I could make her angry with my sister. That is the most ridiculous crap I have ever heard. They are making this s__t up.
I finally told my dtr. that I can't win this because she chooses to believe my sister only and won't even let me have a say. This is in opposition to last week when she apologized for doing this with another situation and threatened to go home when I made dinner for her and her family. I did not beg her to stay like I usually do to keep the peace and put on a front because I did not want my parents to know there was a conflict. I instead calmly told her it was her choice to go if she wanted to and returned to my cooking. She stayed (no surprise there) and later hugged me and apologized for behaving so badly.
Yesterday she said that I was a good mother but not a wonderful one and that she was doing things differently with her kids so they feel unconditional love. She said she always tried to please me so I could accept her like that but that she will no longer do this as she is an adult. I did expect a lot of her because she was an excellent dtr. and student but always showed her so much affection and love. I told her all parents have expectations of their kids especially the first one and that I did the best I could (which was a lot because all 3 of my kids are successful, never got into any trouble, never took drugs, work hard, etc.) I must have done something right! I am also extremely helpful with the grands and she has said repeatedly that she appreciates it so much.
During the last part of the conversation last night she said that when my parents and Nancy leaves I will be back to her because I need her so much. I told her that she needed me more and she laughed. So I think that I will not be calling her first.
I then spoke to my sister who blew me off and said she didn't want to talk as she was reading a good book. I confronted her about the past 2 days and she said she doesn't want to be with me because of how I have acted the past few days and that I stir up the pot. Mind you, I did not tell her that my parents are so angry with her and that they only acted nicely to her because I asked them to, that they don't like her friend/roommate - I lied and told her they did, that I did not tell her that they told me they were cutting her out of their wills and leaving all to me - I convinced them not to do this) so in many ways I am trying to keep peace not stir things up. But I refuse to tell her all this because it will hurt her and she will just blame me and not speak to my parents anymore. She only started to again because I begged her to because our dad is now 85 and not feeling so good lately.
Anyway, I don't know if I am going crazy and need help or if they are truly ganging up on me due to my insecurities. I know I am very insecure with my relationships with them and that can be difficult for all of us.
I did talk to Nancy this morning (thank God she will be here tomorrow for a visit) and she told me that they were still the same - just like my manipulative narcissistic mother. She has known my family since we were 9 years old. We lived on the same street and were always best friends. She told me that my dtr. has no right to talk to me like that and I have allowed it for many years. It hurts to hear that because you never want someone to really think anything negative about your kids.
Sorry for such a long entry but it helps to vent and I really hope I can be honest with my self-reflection because I want to be a loving and good person with positive relationships with them. I told my sister that I felt awful because I thought when she moved here we could become much closer and be good friends but that she didn't want that because she is always with her roommate and tells me constantly what they have been doing. Originally she was moving into her own place and her friend would move also but get her own house. But now they live together and have companionship but I am not included most of the time unless I ask and then I am usually told that they are so busy fixing up their own house. It is my sister's house but the roommate has moved in lock, stock and barrel like she will never leave.
Well I do have others who like and love me so I will have to accept that now. My 1st dtr. told me she loves me but I told her that she does not act like it because she should not talk about her mother with my sister as I think it is disloyal. She told me that she will say whatever she wants to with whoever she chooses. I did hear from my other 2 children who don't live near me this morning and I said nothing to them about this. I am sure dtr. #1 will tell dtr. #2 who will tell my ex when they are on the cruise together and then he can feel that I am a terrible person and was right to leave me.
I shouldn't care what people think but I can't help it. I am still in disbelief that my husband didn't love me for a long time but play-acted for years. He did this as I constantly told him how much I loved him and talked about our future with our grands around us. I feel so stupid and betrayed that I don't think I can ever get over this. I cry many times during each day and feel hopeless for happiness someday.
I've got to clean my house and go food shopping before I pick up Nancy from airport tomorrow. I hate that I feel so horrible with her coming but I will try to have some fun with her as I don't want to make her miserable on her trip.
Last night was my parents' final night and I planned on buying pizza to bring to my daughter's house for everyone but my father insisted on paying for it. When we leave and go home I know that my sister is talking about me to my daughter and my father says that I am making my own problems as this is not true. So I know my sister and call my daughter and she admits that they were talking negatively about me. My d. goes on to say that she knows about the restaurant and other things my sister has told her (this happened years ago when my sister alienated my daughters from me because her kids are so screwed up with drugs, etc. but she plays it like she is the greatest aunt in the world). She later apologized to me because she attends Al Anon and must do the step about making amends. But she won't tell her ex that she cheated on him before she asked him for a divorce. So my d. says that her aunt and she have had enough of me and wish I wasn't so manipulative and a liar. My d. was very nasty and said things that a dtr. should not say to her mom. She told me that my therapist doesn't know the real me and I should get help and change. I told her to write down every concern she has and I would take it to my therapist but she refused saying I would only twist things around and make her look like a terrible dtr. I always speak highly of her to all and never want people to know her nasty side which I am no longer going to do. I will be honest from now on. I did that with my ex for many years making him look like he was the best ever and made excuses for him when he refused to go out with others after plans were made because he was angry with me for something.
My dtr. continues on to say that her father is a wonderful nice person and that she loves him so much. I say that of course she does as he buys her so much. She was furious and told me that if he never bought her another thing she would always love him and respect him because he doesn't give her aggravation like me. She told me that he said that he should have never married me because I treated him so badly and threatened to kill myself the first year of marriage. The threat was true (which I never meant) but I was so desperate for affirmation that he cared I was reduced to that. He knew I didn't mean it but was saying that for his attention.
My other dtr. told me today that she is going on a cruise with her dad next week. I am so upset because of the memories of all the trips we took in 34 years even though during most of them he was miserable. I hate that he tells the kids so many things although my oldest dtr. says they never talk about me.
Back to 1st dtr. - she said she wishes I was nicer and that she doesn't respect me in some ways. When I asked about her dad she said she respects him except for the way he handled the separation by dumping me on her in her apt. with a high-risk pregnancy with the twins. But she said he has apologized and she understands why he had to do it that way because he had to get away from the marriage as it was toxic.
She told me that I am losing all relationships with others and so I manipulate to keep them. I told her that my sister D. has always done that and there was a time my dtr. wouldn't speak to my sister and I tried to patch things up for them. I did the same when my dtr. and ex didn't speak for awhile when she lived with my sister. My dtr. said it is my fault because I was happy that she didn't speak to them and tried to patch things up between her and them because I was in over my head and scared. ???
My dtr. is the one who doesn't like many people but she said she has changed now. I get along with everyone except she and my sister. She said only my parents and best friend Nancy like me and my "loser support groups and forum friends' because they don't really know me.
She said that I try to make her angry with my sister which is not true. She said that when I asked for her opinion about the way my sister hung some of my pictures that I had a "gleam in my eye" and was happy because she did not like the way my sister did it and I said that my sister told me that I shouldn't care about what my dtr. thinks because it only matters what I think so I could make her angry with my sister. That is the most ridiculous crap I have ever heard. They are making this s__t up.
I finally told my dtr. that I can't win this because she chooses to believe my sister only and won't even let me have a say. This is in opposition to last week when she apologized for doing this with another situation and threatened to go home when I made dinner for her and her family. I did not beg her to stay like I usually do to keep the peace and put on a front because I did not want my parents to know there was a conflict. I instead calmly told her it was her choice to go if she wanted to and returned to my cooking. She stayed (no surprise there) and later hugged me and apologized for behaving so badly.
Yesterday she said that I was a good mother but not a wonderful one and that she was doing things differently with her kids so they feel unconditional love. She said she always tried to please me so I could accept her like that but that she will no longer do this as she is an adult. I did expect a lot of her because she was an excellent dtr. and student but always showed her so much affection and love. I told her all parents have expectations of their kids especially the first one and that I did the best I could (which was a lot because all 3 of my kids are successful, never got into any trouble, never took drugs, work hard, etc.) I must have done something right! I am also extremely helpful with the grands and she has said repeatedly that she appreciates it so much.
During the last part of the conversation last night she said that when my parents and Nancy leaves I will be back to her because I need her so much. I told her that she needed me more and she laughed. So I think that I will not be calling her first.
I then spoke to my sister who blew me off and said she didn't want to talk as she was reading a good book. I confronted her about the past 2 days and she said she doesn't want to be with me because of how I have acted the past few days and that I stir up the pot. Mind you, I did not tell her that my parents are so angry with her and that they only acted nicely to her because I asked them to, that they don't like her friend/roommate - I lied and told her they did, that I did not tell her that they told me they were cutting her out of their wills and leaving all to me - I convinced them not to do this) so in many ways I am trying to keep peace not stir things up. But I refuse to tell her all this because it will hurt her and she will just blame me and not speak to my parents anymore. She only started to again because I begged her to because our dad is now 85 and not feeling so good lately.
Anyway, I don't know if I am going crazy and need help or if they are truly ganging up on me due to my insecurities. I know I am very insecure with my relationships with them and that can be difficult for all of us.
I did talk to Nancy this morning (thank God she will be here tomorrow for a visit) and she told me that they were still the same - just like my manipulative narcissistic mother. She has known my family since we were 9 years old. We lived on the same street and were always best friends. She told me that my dtr. has no right to talk to me like that and I have allowed it for many years. It hurts to hear that because you never want someone to really think anything negative about your kids.
Sorry for such a long entry but it helps to vent and I really hope I can be honest with my self-reflection because I want to be a loving and good person with positive relationships with them. I told my sister that I felt awful because I thought when she moved here we could become much closer and be good friends but that she didn't want that because she is always with her roommate and tells me constantly what they have been doing. Originally she was moving into her own place and her friend would move also but get her own house. But now they live together and have companionship but I am not included most of the time unless I ask and then I am usually told that they are so busy fixing up their own house. It is my sister's house but the roommate has moved in lock, stock and barrel like she will never leave.
Well I do have others who like and love me so I will have to accept that now. My 1st dtr. told me she loves me but I told her that she does not act like it because she should not talk about her mother with my sister as I think it is disloyal. She told me that she will say whatever she wants to with whoever she chooses. I did hear from my other 2 children who don't live near me this morning and I said nothing to them about this. I am sure dtr. #1 will tell dtr. #2 who will tell my ex when they are on the cruise together and then he can feel that I am a terrible person and was right to leave me.
I shouldn't care what people think but I can't help it. I am still in disbelief that my husband didn't love me for a long time but play-acted for years. He did this as I constantly told him how much I loved him and talked about our future with our grands around us. I feel so stupid and betrayed that I don't think I can ever get over this. I cry many times during each day and feel hopeless for happiness someday.
I've got to clean my house and go food shopping before I pick up Nancy from airport tomorrow. I hate that I feel so horrible with her coming but I will try to have some fun with her as I don't want to make her miserable on her trip.
Replies
Honey, step back and stop trying to turn yourself into a pretzel. They are manipulative and controlling. I would not even dignify what they say with an answer. I used to tell my ex when he said that he was going to talk to his mother, well put it in writing, triplicate copies too. One to the Prime Minister, one to me and one to her. You do not need this now or ever. Start looking after yourself, first and foremost. hugs
Sci it\'s almost impossible to have a real relationship with a Narcissist. You have a few in your family. Don\'t fall into those conversations with that daughter and your sister. Don\'t listen to all that trash they are talking. When it starts politely hang up the phone. You can\'t win an argument or heated discussion with an N so don\'t fall into that trap.
You are a good person and you don\'t deserve to be treated this way. Those two know you will take to heart what they say. Don\'t let them do this to you. Talk to your therapist and get some ideas on how to either let go of these two or how to keep from getting into these conversations. I moved several states away from my family. I don\'t get involved in family drama.
sci, I\'m so sorry you\'re being disrespected and unappreciated. It\'s unacceptable, and your words have brought back a lot of memories in my own situation with my daughter and sister.
When my D was a senior in high school, as well as her first few years in college, she treated me so badly and was rebellious and deceptive. She gave me a lot of grief. Finally I got my fill, and told her to never come to my house or contact me until she is respectful of me and that I deserve to be treated better. I set that boundary and I kept it.... which was quite hard to do. I almost gave in several times and called her, but I was sick of being treated like dirt.
My sister played a big role in our problems at that time, which I now realize a lot of her negativity towards me was due to my D\'s lies she was telling my sister. One time, I found text messages on my D\'s phone from my sister, and they were royally awful! The two of them and my D\'s bf at that time actually called the police on me. It\'s a long story and I won\'t go into it, but suffice it to say they lost me from their lives for a long time. I cut them from my life and it hurt like hell. But I let them know I would NOT allow their abusive, disrespectful behavior towards me to continue.
Fast forward almost ten years, and we are all getting along very well. My D and I are very close now, and my relationship with my sister has improved so much. But I learned some valuable things from that difficult time.
sci, please don\'t allow your sister or your daughter to mistreat you. You do not deserve that. They should either respect you or tell them to leave you alone completely. I know that sounds easier said than done, but I\'ve been there and I\'m glad I made that demand and defended myself.
We might not be able to control other people\'s actions, but we can control how we react to them. Sending you a big (((Hug))), my friend. Hope things improve for you soon!
I am really sorry you are going through all this. Really, it was not too long ago that my own relationship with my daughters was really VERY bad. There was a lot going on for everyone learning to accept and live with the divorce. There were lots of expressions of anger towards me by the girls, in particular. Admittedly, I had my own issues to work through and positive changes that I learned to make in myself.
Really, keep putting the focus on you and your healing and your own growth. Find the person that YOU want to be and then let yourself become that person. This can be a very time consuming process, particularly when we come out of marriages where we lost most of who and what we are and have to re-define ourselves. I promise that if you continue to place your efforts in this area, eventually everything else will fall into place.
Please step away from abusive relationships. It is difficult when this is coming from the people we are turning towards to provide love and support. However, you do need to protect yourself while you are healing and re-defining yourself.
There is lots of support on this site. There are support groups. I am also a member of alanon. If your family cannot provide what you need right now, it is ok to get that support elsewhere.
(((((((BIG HUGS)))))))
Thanks for your support and kind words but I don\'t even know if I am right or wrong anymore. My sister D. called me earlier and told me that she will stay out of my life and my dtr\'s. because it causes too many problems. I told her that I wanted to be closer to her but I will not beg, control, or push myself on her anymore. I also said that my dtr. loves her and wants to have a relationship with her aunt.
I expressed my feelings about how I feel that she excludes me from her life and focuses all her efforts on her friend/roommate M. Of course she denied this and told me that she is hesitant to get closer to me because she is afraid of me shutting her out of my life like I did before. I did that because she tried to estrange my dtrs. from me about 7 years ago. She said she wants to take it slow with me.
My dtr. did not call today - she is a stubborn girl. She can be so sweet and loving but her other side can really rear its ugly head. I don\'t think my dtr. is a narcissist but maybe my sister is like my mother. They are very alike with that phony happy side that they present to others. But my mother can be mean and my sister is usually more kind.
I will continue going to the therapist to work out my issues. I am so distraught by all this especially when I need as much love and support as I can get. I also told my sister that it really hurts me that she continues to have contact with my ex. She said she disagrees and will continue to do so occasionally since he calls her sometimes.
Anyway, I do thank you for writing back but I am back in the guilty mode that I could have prevented all of my problems with my ex, and other family members. I know by now dtr. #1 has told her sister and brother about how awful I have been to her and my sister.
I wish I could get a boyfriend to occupy my mind so I stop obsessing about my ex, dtr. and sister. I know this is pathetic but I need affirmation that someone enjoys being with me. I have so much work to do to change that awful quality about me and get some self-esteem and self-respect.
Just to clarify - I am not looking for a guy - I have not met a single guy that I would be interested in and have not gone online. I just fantasize how that might make me happier and less worried about my other relationships.
Sci, you don\'t have to justify your feelings to any of us, that\'s for sure. Divorce itself is traumatic enough -- all the family drama just makes it worse. You may have to do what I did in order to survive the 18 Months of Hell. I withdrew from all of the dysfunction in my family of origin; depended upon a handful of true blue friends, my therapist and my amazing attorney.
Trisha is correct -- you cannot negotiate with a Narcissist OR a terrorist and your sister and daughter sound like a bad combination. Be true to YOURSELF -- set healthy boundaries and just let what they say go in one ear and out the other. Take care of yourself, my dear. You can and will get through this. We\'re all here to help as we can. xoxox
Donna, sorry you are going through this. Take it slow with your sister. Your daughter will probably call in a day or so. Just enjoy your visit with Nancy and take care of yourself
Carol
My dear girl, what a lot of crap they are putting on you and you are letting them.
Have you heard of tough love, boundaries etc? to me you sound like a very normal hurt woman, nothing wrong with wanting family love and peace. Sometimes tho we have to take off the rosey coloured glasses and see those in our lives as they really are and that\'s a hard thing to do, keep working at it and stop accepting all this guilt, love yourself first.
I hope you are feeling better today. Don\'t let what they do or say bother you. Just ignore it - be yourself and let all the rest of it go. Have fun with your friend.
i agree with everyone here who encouraged you not to engage with the toxic stuff that\'s going on in your family -- just focus on healing yourself. I had a horrible period last year when i became estranged from my son -- all down to the same kind of toxic\" he said, she said, he said\" stuff, much of which I attribute to my stbx. My therapist urged me to keep things simple, to avoid what she called \"triangulation, \" the manipulation of relationships in our family by the stbx. I took her advice and It helps a lot.. My son and i have repaired our relationship , thank God, and I\'m careful about keeping my relationships with my kinds one-on-one and not engaging in anything about their father or anyone else in his family.
Stay strong -- you\'re a good person who\'s still reeling from being blindsided. You\'ll be OK, but you must take care of yourself!
Hugs
(((HUGS))) Sorry you are dealing with all this drama. I do think you are being manipulated. Perhaps it\'s time to step back and leave them to themselves. Apparently you can\'t make them happy without compromising yourself.
Friends,
Thanks for the support. Once again, I feel comforted by all of you.