Victims of Psychopaths Community Group
Is he or she a sociopath or psychopath? Think we're only talking about serial killers here? Psychopaths, sociopaths and even narcissists come in every walk of life, every career level, and every socio-economic category.
My (narcissist) husband, (i put in parenthesis as I'm not a psychiatrist and can only make an educated guess), went total AWOL (despite we have children) on me in late May. A month or two leading up to that I had very little contact with him, and he with me, for myself and for him.
During the period of his going AWOL he dumped me on his parents to care for me, which was dealing with a whole other game of pleasure. NOT. After going complete AWOL for a few weeks he began contacting the children again. But the children weren't having it and were really giving him the cold shoulder to the point he cut their phones, our internet, and our television service in an attempt to get their attention and force them to acknowledge him. At that point he also for the first time actually called me to get to them. He actually had to act civil to get somewhere with me to encourage the children to see him. After he got his way with the children he went back to not communicating with me or answering any of my requests.
His parents (my imaginary power of attorney) traveled out of the country a couple of weeks ago. Since that time I noticed he has been responding to my requests. Sometimes he behaves like an ass, sometimes he's civil.
Here's the thing. I had so gotten past venting to him , expecting him to be remorseful, thinking he has any degree of a heart and soul. I had stopped talking to him about anything relating to us, our relationship and all what he and his girlfriend had done to me. Now, that he is responding to me and occasionally claiming I have misunderstood certain things (NO) , I am all over again venting, and blaming, and trying to make him see. I can not get rid of this feeling that he has to see, he has to feel remorse, he has to feel bad. Not only that, I thought I was close to forgiving him. I have been really trying hard on that, but now with these feelings rising up all over again I realize just how far off from forgiveness I am.
I thought i was doing so well. And now i've been tested and think I've failed. It feels so good and therapeutic to vent to him though.
Another thing I want to ask as well. Whenever I bring up to my husband the things he's done to me or with his girlfriend, he never says anything. He doesn't come back with an attack, He doesn't blame me for anything. Just nothing. Is a narcissist capable of being attacked and not respond?
During the period of his going AWOL he dumped me on his parents to care for me, which was dealing with a whole other game of pleasure. NOT. After going complete AWOL for a few weeks he began contacting the children again. But the children weren't having it and were really giving him the cold shoulder to the point he cut their phones, our internet, and our television service in an attempt to get their attention and force them to acknowledge him. At that point he also for the first time actually called me to get to them. He actually had to act civil to get somewhere with me to encourage the children to see him. After he got his way with the children he went back to not communicating with me or answering any of my requests.
His parents (my imaginary power of attorney) traveled out of the country a couple of weeks ago. Since that time I noticed he has been responding to my requests. Sometimes he behaves like an ass, sometimes he's civil.
Here's the thing. I had so gotten past venting to him , expecting him to be remorseful, thinking he has any degree of a heart and soul. I had stopped talking to him about anything relating to us, our relationship and all what he and his girlfriend had done to me. Now, that he is responding to me and occasionally claiming I have misunderstood certain things (NO) , I am all over again venting, and blaming, and trying to make him see. I can not get rid of this feeling that he has to see, he has to feel remorse, he has to feel bad. Not only that, I thought I was close to forgiving him. I have been really trying hard on that, but now with these feelings rising up all over again I realize just how far off from forgiveness I am.
I thought i was doing so well. And now i've been tested and think I've failed. It feels so good and therapeutic to vent to him though.
Another thing I want to ask as well. Whenever I bring up to my husband the things he's done to me or with his girlfriend, he never says anything. He doesn't come back with an attack, He doesn't blame me for anything. Just nothing. Is a narcissist capable of being attacked and not respond?
I think that if if feels good to vent to him, go ahead! Why not? If it doesn't have negative consequences for you (he doesn't lash out at you in return) and you don't really mind that he doesn't understand or acknowledge anything, then go ahead! It's kind of like writing things down in a journal, I guess.
I wouldn't say you've been tested and failed, because it takes a while for someone with normal, human emotions to really, really learn what it means for another person to be devoid of those emotions. It's not normal, and our expectations are set up for normal people.
This isn't about me, but I'll just say that for me, it took a while with my ex. Now I'm at the point where I feel about him like I feel about a computer. No humanity, and sometimes weird glitches that just make no sense. I feel frustration about it, but no expectation for him to be human.
Hang in there, and don't feel bad about the venting. It's good you're thinking it through, though, because you can decide whether next time it'll be worth it to vent or not.
After I got out of there, my relief was so intense I can hardly describe it. The ordeal had been so long and taxing that all I wanted was to relax deeply and let it all go. I moved on to forgiveness in about 2 years. I never felt the need to vent to him again, I think because of the intensity of that long ending. I had gotten it all out.
This much I know: It takes what it takes. If you're not done venting, then it takes some more. And it's much easier to let go when there is low contact. I hope you will be through this before much longer.
I hope I'm getting. There's always though this confusion that plays into my head, the memory of the kind, protective husband he was before the snake came into his life. But then i try to remember the RED FLAGS that were present. This morning he sent me a text letting me know what time he will pick the kids up, preceded with a 'good morning'. He hadn't said good morning in a very long time. Those little things dangerously soften my heart.
I know what you mean about the heart dangerously softening. That is a very tough period of time when you are still vulnerable. With P#2, I went back 1.5 years later. Kep your eyes on the goal.
As unsinkable said, yes N/S/P types can be masters at the non-response. My ex sociopath bf would do that constantly. He was also a master at forgetting the next day. So whenever an issue arose I would flip out on him (for cheating, huge lies etc), he would basically not respond and flip it around on me by saying "I don't want to talk to you when you are this angry, we'll talk about it when you've calmed down. Of course he would start by justifying or denying and then bring out the "you're too crazy to talk to right now". And when tomorrow came and I had calmed down he would just pretend everything was fine and there was no issue to begin with. If I then brought it up he would again flip it back on me "Oh we're back to this? I thought this was resolved" kind of response/attitude. It's one of their best crazy-making plays!
Also, be very wary of those friendly heart-softening responses. They use those to get you back where they want you- submissive to their will. They know that when they're playing nice and responding in ways that we crave (they learned well which buttons to push by studying us closely) we are more likely to give them what they want, less likely to cause trouble for them, and easier to manipulate. So the way I see it, if he's playing nice or using old phrases that he long ago stopped using, your radar and alarms should be on high alert.
As far as forgiveness goes, you don't forgive for them, you forgive for yourself. That happens on your time and in your way when you have healed and are ready. No person or religion can force that on you. God doesn't expect it overnight either, he knows you are human, you are not a saint, you are not Jesus, you cannot forgive overnight. God knows what is in your heart, and if you tried to force forgiveness it wouldn't really be genuine. So take the pressure off yourself. Forget forgiveness for now and focus on moving forward and healing, forgiveness will come when the time is right for you. ~big hugs~
In your first paragraph, yes, he has said those exact words....'Oh we're back to this again'?
Last night we got into an argument after a long while of barely speaking. He has lately been responding to my requests after having been completely AWOL with me. we argued about his choice of transport for the children. In the argument I accused him of always being angry, living in anger. The argument started off with him being very angry and saying ridiculous things, evolving to him sounding like he was backing down and telling me the things I am accusing him of are not true and he doesn't feel that way (in other words he supposedly feels very positive things about me), then he told me to please stop and he backed out of the argument. This morning at 7:30 am for the first time in a very long time, he actually called me. He said he wanted to apologize for getting angry. He then said I was right , that he is angry all the time and he apologized again. One thing about him is that before the affair when he wasn't a problem he always owned his mistakes and was never afraid to apologize. it's only since the affair did he turn into the monster. Ugh. I was planning to ask for a divorce this week , and now I see him changing a little bit and it makes me hesitant.
Thank you for your thoughts on forgiveness. Very soothing.
Forgiveness, totally overrated. Neil Walsh writes some interesting things about forgiveness vs. understanding in a biblical viewpoint that are easier to swallow. I will never forgive my ex. How can I when he is not sorry and is still doing the same stuff? Hell no, I don't forgive. But understanding as to why he did what he did? Yep, I have that. And a desire to move forward. I deserve that. So with my understanding I let him go. With time. He no longer has a hold on me. I get PTSD triggers sometimes that may never go away. But I am happy. Without forgiveness. Anyone who tells you it is a necessary step in healing and letting go is full of BS.
It's all a game to him. You're being played. Your kids were right in leaving the bully behind, no matter his 'title".
Make 'em proud, MOM! Show 'em a lesson in self respect and all that right and good and ethical and moral and all that stuff we're supposed to lose focus of in their fogs of BS...
Please? For them?
& get away from his enabling parents. Freedom is SO worth the efforts! :) GL!
{{hugz}}
similar to Jodi Arias, so he had a good scare and was somewhat willing
to listen. Plus he also had key colleagues turn on him simultaneous to his
affair partner going honker, so he finally had a taste of his own medicine.
There's a great website called ChumpLady-Leave a Cheater, Gain a Life
http://www.chumplady.com Highly recommend. She's extremely
skeptical of reconciliation and that "being nice" suddenly is usually a tried and
true tactic as Eternity pointed out. My exP has "been nice" quite a few times,
but it has always been short lived. I've worried how any venting that I've done
could inadvertently have given him some information that he could use later
on to hurt me.
So vent away, but still be cautious. As for forgiveness, like LiveinTruth says he
actually has to be sorry first. And in his case, wouldn't that need to be done
in the form of remorseful actions over a period of time, in order to make
restitution for the harm he's caused both you and the kids? ChumpLady
recommends that a remorseful abusive cheater begin their demonstration of
remorse with a good divorce settlement. I see a lot of merit with that. Because
after all if he's lying, then you and your children are protected. If he's actually
one of the rare snowflakes that can change, then there's no harm in getting
remarried down the road when he's proven himself. Long term. Then you are
truly in the position to forgive as he's proven both his true remorse and commit-
ment to you.
think is hysterical and very supportive to those who have been cheated on.
While not all serial cheaters are P's, the entitled selfish mode of thinking and the
lying and blame shifting are entirely too familiar. Her blog makes for a great read.
My kinda folk...as are you! :) You have my eternal gratitude. I'm new to snarkdom, officially, but it's become my style, post crap, as well, and it's just another word for truth, IMHO. With, as you write, humor and flair. This gal is gifted, as are many of her commentators! True survivors, all! :) Cyberstrength to share! :) VIVA!
{{hugz}}
has picked me up off the floor many a time. One of my favs is
Ego Kibbles. . . .
Ego Kibbles
April 28, 2012 by Chump Lady
"Cheating is a profoundly narcissistic act. (Of course, cheaters don’t see
it that way. Usually they cast it as selflessly liberating someone from the
oppressive bonds of sexless marriage to a jerk…)
But really cheating just all boils down to – ego kibbles. Cheaters need
ego kibbles. Lots and lots of kibbles. Shrinks call ego kibbles “narcissistic
supply,” but I prefer to think in terms of Narcissist Ego Chow. Cheaters need
to feed. They need lots and lots of validation that they’re special, sexy, and
understood by only a special chosen few. Problem is, ego kibbles are not
very sating, and so they always need more. Part of that problem is the cheater –
they’ve got a hole in their soul where empathy and connection should be. So,
a person can shovel ego kibbles at the cheater, but they don’t fill up.
The other part is the unfulfilling quality of ego kibbles themselves. Narcissistic
supply is like bad chicken feed. It’s full of arsenic, dead chicken bits, and barnyard
poop. It’s cheap, commercial grade filler. It’s crap.
What’s in a bag of Narcissist Ego Chow? Flattery. Attention. Easy sex. Admiration
without accomplishment. Shallow attachment. Infatuation. Fantasy. Centrality.
Cheaters prefer kibbles to love. Love requires reciprocity and connection. Love is
messy and demanding. Kibbles are easier.
And remember, it takes a lot of ego kibbles to feed a cheater, and they don’t have
any to spare for you, okay? Betrayed spouses tend to be very neglected during an
affair. Kibbles are very, very precious. If cheaters give kibbles, it’s only because they
want more kibbles back, and it’s going to be a lopsided trade. Look for a healthy,
fulfilling relationship based in mutuality and respect. Don’t traffic in kibbles."
BINGO!
Yes! I'm still reading through the posts about "things cheaters say", and the strength of these people, and the humor, and the "realness" had me going until @ 8PM. :) Please know that you have aided me very much, and i've already told a friend to check out this site, as i know it will raise her spirits also, so your ripples are ripplin' for the good of other survivors wantin' to be thrivers again. :)
Ms. BettyBean~you will alway be a cyberangel to me, with much gratitude and best wishes. TY! {{hugz}}
& no kibbles! LOL! ;)