I´m talking about Narcissists here, not Sociopaths....I know S´s have shallow emotions...

Sociopaths "have" shallow emotions, but they may appear to be extremely emotional. As all sociopaths are narcissists, this goes for narcissists, too. They have shallow emotions. They may emote, threaten suicide because "I can't live without you," and cry rivers. But the minute they get off the phone or you walk out the door, they are going through their list of phone numbers and calculating their next move on a new target or targets. Their emotion all for show.

If a long-term partner dies, these "people" are re-partnered before the body of the former partner is cold. If a relationship breaks up, they will have everyone around them worried that they are going to survive, while they secretly party it up.

Here is an example from the life of my recent P ex: He said to me recently that he saw a tribute to his former best friend who died about a year ago and that he cried. "I do too have emotions," he reasoned. I reminded him that throughout the months that his friend was dying, I could not get him to make the slightest effort to see him or even send a card. Upon his death, he showed no interest in paying tribute. In fact, I was the one who discovered he had died a few weeks earlier by simply clicking on his face on ex's facebook.

They do not actually care about anyone, but they sure can put on a show of feelings when it is expedient.

that's a good question. the first thing that came to my mind was that emotions are so easily faked by watching others. but I think when it comes down to it to really have and show real emotions one must feel some kind of empathy. but then again is hate an emotion? because they can show anger , hate, rage, jealousy etc but not have empathy....right???? that's a tough one

I re read your question and I think it is possible because like I said anger, hate, etc is an emotion. they have those emotions but feel no empathy. I think.

I agree... They often show rage, hatred, and can even feel happy sometimes. What I think they cannot feel is love. They're good actors and can often mimic people they're around. I can actually tell when my N is around the OW. His mannerisms change. So obvious.

And I've also noticed he is "happy" when one of his coworkers, whom he is jealous of, experiences some kind of hardship or bad luck. That makes N almost giddy. Such a sick puppy.

My ex has a best friend that died young. He shows emotion talking about missing him and also his late father. Still not our kind of emotion though. I think I've seen him cry maybe twice and it didn't seem real at all. The recovery was too quick too. Ex S doesn't like funerals. He went to his dads and a couple viewing with me for people I knew. He wants nothing to do with the thought of death. (Not that we do) but N's and S's can't take the thought of dying. Another weird thing about them.

Mandy, That is such an interesting observation. Of course, spaths would want nothing to do with the idea of death since they know, on some level, that they have no eternal soul. Or--as I usually think of it--they are so disconnected from their soul that they do not believe such a thing exists. As this belief and disconnection will lead to an experience of eternal nothingness for them, it is, in a sense, true. For however long that state continues. For them, death is truly the end of existence.

This is a piece of a puzzle for me. My P ex's mother died in her fifties and he never once talked about it. Except once when we went to look for her grave whereupon, we discovered that there was no marker. He told me he had visited several times previously, but clearly, he had not. He was her only child, but he did not see it to it that her grave was marked? His first wife died in her 40's and P arranged for no service and did not attend the memorial service held at her parents' home. I learned this from P's second wife. He had no idea what he had done with his wife's possessions, and he believed that her ghost haunted his house. Of course, they cannot deal with death. It is not part of the life cycle to them. That view is for people with spiritual lives.

They have feelings for themselves only.cannot see other peoples point of view .They are purely selfish

mtu, It's true. They cannot deal with others' suffering. I remember a weekend at P's house, lying in his bed alone while he watched sports on TV in another room. He never even appeared to check on me. To be fair, this situation did improve over time. But it was truly awful early on. I think his later improvement was most likely due to his fear of losing me, so it was essentially for his own sake.

Gigi, They have feelings for themselves absolutely. That one used to just blow my mind. After doing the most egregious things to me--beating me up, cheating on me, telling horrific lies about me to his family, I would be packing to leave my P ex, and he would have giant tears rolling down his face, saying, "Don't you CARE what happens to me? Won't you feel bad about leaving me all alone?"

I thought it was positively astonishing that he felt such overwhelming sympathy for himself after basically pounding me into the ground and making me eat dirt. He was utterly carried away by the epic tragedy of something bad happening to his poor self. Not a tear over what he'd done to me.

I was also the one who stood to "lose everything" in that situation--thousand of hours of work-for-free I'd done on his house, a beautiful place in the country as opposed to a low-rent apt. in the city, a man I loved beyond words, in a place I loved, a life I loved, apart from the abuse--which was intolerable. I even had to leave behind antique furniture that had been handed down through generations of family because I had no room to store it. But the big tragedy, in his view, was all about himself who got to keep everything except me. The one thing that, in P reality, is imminently replaceable.

Man....

I´m asking this question because I suspect my mother might be a narcissist. She does have narcissistic traits and is controlling and manipulative, but she seems to be very emotional also. Not as my exP (who I know for sure faked his emotions). I´m wondering if she has empathy cause she seems to hurt people on purpose and doesn´t care about other people´s feelings or wishes. One day I asked her "Do you have empathy?" and she looked confused, as if she didn´t know what it was or what I meant and then nodded and somehow changed the subject. I wrote about her on another support group for Narcissists victims, but I can´t find that group anymore, is it deleted? Anyway, she´s been like that since she was a child (my grandmother told me), so I don´t know if that is naturally inborn or a result of the enviroment.

Also, is it possible to somehow cure Ns, through conversation, etc? I know psychopathy isn´t curable, but is narcissism? If they see they can´t manipulate someone, do they change? Do they realize what they are doing or they just go find someone else to abuse?

Sunny, No, they don't change. An emotional narcissist may have Borderline Personality Disorder. It's no more bearable to be around than psychopathy.

no just like kris said they cant change because they really don't believe they is there anything bad wrong with themselves, more the opposite they think we are the messed up ones because we waste so much energy on such wasted feelings such as emotions. remember to that n,P,S have learned a very long time ago how to mimic emotions such as love, compassion etc...they knew early on that they were not having the same feelings that other people around them were so they watch other peoples responses to situations and act accordingly. its kind of like flying under the radar so to speak so know one realizes they are what they are. they are excellent actors and have so many different masks they wear that its hard to try and figure out really just what or who they are.