Spouses of Sexual Addicts. Community Group
I received the eight books that I ordered for both me and h to read today. I scanned through them before going to work tonight, and took "sex, lies, and forgiveness' to the gym after work...I started back to the gym this week to help rid me of the extra adrenaline from the anger that I'm feeling, and to help lose weight faster
I found that some passages made me feel angry all over again. Brought up issues that I didn't want to think about, or deal with, but it was there, in black and white. I emailed the sex therapist I picked for him to go to. I want to start seeing him so I can deal with my low self esteem issues, and to better understand the man's perspective. Figure the therapist can tie our cases together to help one another. I can't do this alone. I need to vent. When I feel I need to get something out, and say it to H, he gets upset then we are both crying. I just need someone to listen and give me feedback without fear of hurting the other party's feelings.
I've dealt with this twice before. but, by far this is the worse in so many levels. The trust is gone. I deal with my own mentality of trying not to purposely hurt him. I know he won't understand, won't feel the same pain I feel. He will just deal with it and dismiss it as me trying to get back at him
he wasted his sexual energy on looking, fantasizing, lusting other women. I do enjoy lovemaking, snuggling, but sometimes a quicky is better. It's that sexual energy, wanting someone here and now. He said he was thinking that if he "relieved" himself that he'd last longer, do it better with me and I'd enjoy it more. Just the opposite.
now, it seems as he just started recovery, all his sexual energy is gone. He doesn't "goose" me, doesn't stare at my 'girls', doesn't text me sexual gestures for later to come, doesn't initiate. Just numb. I have to wander...is it because he doesn't have those sexual image fantasies, altho he's always been like this with me, even after he was "sober" for years?
I'm at a loss. I'm not sure what to do, what to think. This last time brought up so much unrelated hurt that I never told him about. Not sexual I mean. It makes me wander if our relationship is mendable, if I can truly forgive and let go. I know I will never forget, and that bothers me too.
to follow my instincts...that is what his sex therapist said at our session together. What if....what if they tell me something undesirable, something unrationable, something that is best for ONLY me...to leave him. I want to try, I need to try. I am hooked on him. He's everything I ever wanted and more. His flaws and all, for the most part, I've accepted. But this has shook me to the core of ME. 9 years, 3 times of discovery. 3 times of deceipt, 3 times of lying, hiding, denying. How much can one person take????
I took an antidepressant after having our last child for ppd. Something I never believed in existed (ppd) until it happened to me. I relied on those drugs for two years, trying so hard to quit in between. This past summer I did. In the meantime of taking the antidepressants, my drinking became out of control. I dealt with it, and got it under control. Now, however I don't give a poopoo. It numbs, yet at the same time intensifies the pain. I think everyday how I have a stash of antidep that I keep. I really don't want to rely on a drug to help overcome or deal with my current issues, my pain, but it's a quick fix.
I hope I can see this therapist soon. Before I say or do something I may later on regret. I am not a physical person. I know I am not. But, I became one with H when I found out this past time, and the weeks following. I threw my phone at him, hard, initially waking him up after the hard proof of his porn use. I beat up a spoon and bent unbendablly back while cooking late one nigh then I threw it against the stairs, I was drinking out of a tall glass, with him begging for me not to leave and I threw it against the wall...watching him pick up the pieces, him crying for me not to step in the glass and hurt myself, I busted one of our cupboards with towels, slammed it shut. Totally broke off. He had to superglue whatever to fix. He said he was "impressed" as he didn't know it could be broken like that....we were sitting on the couch together, him listening to me, him trying to rationalize when I punched the couch, and punched his arm in the process. Left a black and blue mark.....Then, I found out he was watching porn videos as I became obsessed with how far his addiction went....I went downstairs and beat on him with couch pillows, hard as he crouched in fetal position, crying. I felt no remorse for trying to hurt him. That was the last incidence. The next morning, while waiting at the busstop, I texted him appologizing for being violent, and I felt like a monster. Didn't know why he put up with me like that. He texted me back saying it was ok and he understood why I was so angry, and thanked me for giving him another chance.
His understanding, calmness makes me feel guilty and selfish for thinking the way I do
Im not sure where to take this, or what to do. us reading the books then reflecting later together isn't so much an option. we work opposite shifts as we have lil' kids so I can't really tell him how Im feeling or what, when I'm feeling it.
I am at a loss
I found that some passages made me feel angry all over again. Brought up issues that I didn't want to think about, or deal with, but it was there, in black and white. I emailed the sex therapist I picked for him to go to. I want to start seeing him so I can deal with my low self esteem issues, and to better understand the man's perspective. Figure the therapist can tie our cases together to help one another. I can't do this alone. I need to vent. When I feel I need to get something out, and say it to H, he gets upset then we are both crying. I just need someone to listen and give me feedback without fear of hurting the other party's feelings.
I've dealt with this twice before. but, by far this is the worse in so many levels. The trust is gone. I deal with my own mentality of trying not to purposely hurt him. I know he won't understand, won't feel the same pain I feel. He will just deal with it and dismiss it as me trying to get back at him
he wasted his sexual energy on looking, fantasizing, lusting other women. I do enjoy lovemaking, snuggling, but sometimes a quicky is better. It's that sexual energy, wanting someone here and now. He said he was thinking that if he "relieved" himself that he'd last longer, do it better with me and I'd enjoy it more. Just the opposite.
now, it seems as he just started recovery, all his sexual energy is gone. He doesn't "goose" me, doesn't stare at my 'girls', doesn't text me sexual gestures for later to come, doesn't initiate. Just numb. I have to wander...is it because he doesn't have those sexual image fantasies, altho he's always been like this with me, even after he was "sober" for years?
I'm at a loss. I'm not sure what to do, what to think. This last time brought up so much unrelated hurt that I never told him about. Not sexual I mean. It makes me wander if our relationship is mendable, if I can truly forgive and let go. I know I will never forget, and that bothers me too.
to follow my instincts...that is what his sex therapist said at our session together. What if....what if they tell me something undesirable, something unrationable, something that is best for ONLY me...to leave him. I want to try, I need to try. I am hooked on him. He's everything I ever wanted and more. His flaws and all, for the most part, I've accepted. But this has shook me to the core of ME. 9 years, 3 times of discovery. 3 times of deceipt, 3 times of lying, hiding, denying. How much can one person take????
I took an antidepressant after having our last child for ppd. Something I never believed in existed (ppd) until it happened to me. I relied on those drugs for two years, trying so hard to quit in between. This past summer I did. In the meantime of taking the antidepressants, my drinking became out of control. I dealt with it, and got it under control. Now, however I don't give a poopoo. It numbs, yet at the same time intensifies the pain. I think everyday how I have a stash of antidep that I keep. I really don't want to rely on a drug to help overcome or deal with my current issues, my pain, but it's a quick fix.
I hope I can see this therapist soon. Before I say or do something I may later on regret. I am not a physical person. I know I am not. But, I became one with H when I found out this past time, and the weeks following. I threw my phone at him, hard, initially waking him up after the hard proof of his porn use. I beat up a spoon and bent unbendablly back while cooking late one nigh then I threw it against the stairs, I was drinking out of a tall glass, with him begging for me not to leave and I threw it against the wall...watching him pick up the pieces, him crying for me not to step in the glass and hurt myself, I busted one of our cupboards with towels, slammed it shut. Totally broke off. He had to superglue whatever to fix. He said he was "impressed" as he didn't know it could be broken like that....we were sitting on the couch together, him listening to me, him trying to rationalize when I punched the couch, and punched his arm in the process. Left a black and blue mark.....Then, I found out he was watching porn videos as I became obsessed with how far his addiction went....I went downstairs and beat on him with couch pillows, hard as he crouched in fetal position, crying. I felt no remorse for trying to hurt him. That was the last incidence. The next morning, while waiting at the busstop, I texted him appologizing for being violent, and I felt like a monster. Didn't know why he put up with me like that. He texted me back saying it was ok and he understood why I was so angry, and thanked me for giving him another chance.
His understanding, calmness makes me feel guilty and selfish for thinking the way I do
Im not sure where to take this, or what to do. us reading the books then reflecting later together isn't so much an option. we work opposite shifts as we have lil' kids so I can't really tell him how Im feeling or what, when I'm feeling it.
I am at a loss
Yes, reading those books is really tough too. I would feel so much anger when reading any of that at times, that I wanted to burn the books and bury the ashes. It forces you to focus on the whole thing, and not slip into denial. I would read only until I couldn't contain the anger, and then find something to do to vent the anxiety. I prayed a lot too. It helped calm me.
I told one of my friends here recently that if I had all of this to do over again from the first day I found out about it, I think that I might do it very differently. I, like you, just really didn't think that he would ever get how much his doing that hurt me. And, the anger I felt was a fuel to get that done. It is, but if it gets directed the wrong way, it will hurt you both. I did lots of that...although nothing physical. I think that the first bit of rage is necessary...but can really be directed to make the most impact. Your psych may help you do that. I was far too angry for them to help me at all. Nothing could. I had to help myself.
So, I THINK that what I would do if I could go back and do it over, is first vent the first part of the anger and then steel myself to calmly say something like, "So I see that you have decided to continue something that you know hurts me. And, now that is done. You have. So what do you intend to do now. Please explain.
Sounds so easy when the anger is vented. It took me a REALLLY long time to vent most of it off. Though I sometimes still am. If you can steel yourself and remain at least in control of your anger, it will help you. When you can do that, in between the fits of pain and anger, tell him exactly how you FEEL inside about that thing he is doing. How you really FEEL. Not the anger, the pain, the fear, jealousy if there is any, there will be lots of feelings laying under the rage. Those are what you need to express as calmly as you can. When you feel as if the anger will erupt, tell him that you can't talk anymore at the moment, you're feeling too hurt to do that. Go for a walk, or do something else. I often went to the guest bedroom and just cried until some of released.
You have every right to be hurt and to be angry. You should be...he betrayed you. If you can explain the feelings to him it will help both of you. If you can listen to him, let HIM explain what he has been doing and why. It will help you both.
It isn't easy, and it hurts. I know. I'm so sorry. I know how you feel. I felt the same way.
I will say that writing in the journal area really allowed me to vent without getting physical with him or keeping it bottled up inside therefore hurting me. I decided to let him read my journal and it really let him get an insight into exactly what I was going thru/ feeling. He was honestly taken aback by the level of hurt and anger he had caused me. That may be a way for you to communicate how you feel and not get into a physical altercation.
I am sorry that any of us have to go thru this. I keep the hope that there is a better life at the end of the long hard tunnel!
I think that what "I" needed to address, was getting down to talking, without wanting to commit bodily harm...what HIS "personal" justifications were. What his beliefs were...his morals...his concepts that he based his life on. And to discuss the behavior, and the justifications between us...where it really matters...to me.
And to address all the other bad character traits that he had to accept and foster to go on with those behaviors. For instance, in order to continue those behaviors my H had to become a liar, a cheat, lie to himself, become or maintain being: unloving, selfish, uncaring, secretive, and cowardly. All of those had to be addressed. He had to acknowledge them, correct them...or embrace them...one of these.
I was unwilling, and I still am, for him to run to some group of men for telling his truth. That's fine if he wants to. But, the ultimate truth is my right and his obligation to me. What good does his telling some stranger do for me? If he couldn't be honest with me about all of it, then there is no basis for a marriage...in my personal view. And if he failed to be ready to do that then it was time for him to get out of my life.
I don't respect lust, degradation, secrecy, lies, self-deception, nor cowardice. To stay here he had to address them all. I don't back up...and I don't accept any excuses....not SA, nor anything else. I know that ultimately the choices were his...and that he maintained total responsibility for his behaviors. And, I was unwilling to blame his behaviors on anyone, or anything else.
I came to the conclusion that if he truly couldn't help himself, if he had gone so far with his immorality and self-deception...that he was lost to that, then I had to acknowledge that. Then, do what I needed to do for my life. I had, and I have, no intention of living with anyone of that persuasion nor that caliber.
We found that many of his definitions of "manhood" were far from accurate. We talked about those. And, his definitions of love...well...a selfish concept only to please his needs and none for giving of love...only taking advantage of one who GIVES love. That had to be dissolved.
And, that EVERYONE, man or woman, has the capability of embracing lust and immorality. It is a personal choice. It is not exclusive to men. That the women in porn, the adultresses, the prostitutes, are just as immoral, and just as "lustful" as the men they engage with. And, that it is their choice, and their lack of self-respect, and respect for morality, and respect for others, that feeds their animal behaviors.
We talked about many things...and it hurt...it hurt me in ways I still can't quite fathom...and it hurt him to really face himself and address his behaviors and attitudes that supported them.
So, I think that there are many ways to get to the thing, either through a seasoned well-informed psyc, which is often a help. To ask others who have come to truth how they got there, and ask for help in coming to truth with the mate. And, to discuss and address immorality and character flaws. As long as it gets done...then it gets done.
I asked...he answered...I contained the rage and addressed the pain of it....well mostly...I contained the rage. Sometimes it came out...and maybe that was good too. I needed it...and maybe so did he. At the beginning, I KNOW he needed it. He expected the discovery to hurt me. He expected me to be angry. He expected to remain silent and let me suffer...as always. He expected me to act the "good" wife and simmer a while and forgive him.
Well, he was right on part of those, and he was wrong too. Because I really hit my "rock bottom" and that wasn't good..for HIM. I wanted the truth for a change no matter how badly it hurt. I would rather have a painful truth, and a chance, than lies and no chance at all.
So, I asked, and he answered...sometime he lost control of his anger too. Ahhh, well...I have an answer for that. Buck up. Accept what you deserve...or get out! I paced the floors, rarely slept...cried..screamed...and puked. And, he cried for the pain I had to endure to stay with him. He knew, as I did, that it would be far easier to send him out of my life and forget that I ever knew his name.
I divorced my first H for the same reason. He wouldn't tell the truth, even when I caught him...he wouldn't address his justifications, he wouldn't address his immorality, nor his lack of good character. So, I addressed it for him. I divorced him...and I have NEVER regretted that decision. I did that because he wouldn't tell the truth. He would lie and try to deceive me, call me crazy, which hurt me all the more, rather than act like a man and tell the truth...for MY sake. A SELFISH, COWARDLY liar. Not a man I want to be married too. Thirty years after the fact, I hear through the grapevine that he is still the same. He's too much of coward to fess up to himself, much less anyone else. Well, good riddance.
My H re-earned tiny bits of the respect he lost. It has taken a long time, still earning it slowly back for over two years. He earned it by telling the truth...for ME...which removed his selfishness a bit at a time...he told the truth...for ME...which removed his cowardice a bit at a time...he told the truth...for ME...which was the beginning of GIVING love...a bit at a time. He started re-earning it...just like he lost it...a bit at a time...and then a whole bunch all at once.
He loved ME more than he loved himself at that point. He realized the damage that HE alone had done. The damage to my confidence...to my peace...to my trust...to my mental and physical health. And he turned toward me to repair his handiwork. HE ACCEPTED his RESPOSIBILITY for his choices and the damage he caused to a person he claimed to love. Who had loved him, supported him, treated him with love and respect. Ane he did those things as a selfish, socialized, immoral, cowardly little jerk. He turned to chance what HE finally SAW in HIMSELF. Because if he hadn't, he wouldn't be here now with me.
Two days ago though, I knew I wasn't going to be ok. Something I read in the "porn trap" book set me off. I went into work that night as usual, meanwhile during the day I couldn't wait to go the gym....when I did get home, I was actually hoping he would be sleeping so I could work through my emotions by myself. It was all fine, talking about other stuff, then refecting on the books, our thoughts, but as the conversation went on, that's when I verbally said my hurt. And tried turning the tables by using examples of "what if I did this to you" instead of our situation now.....
he doesn't have a temper, is always calm. He's never yelled at me, nor raised a hand. that's why I feel like crap after I mentally beat on him, but he NEEDS to know my pain in order for us to get through this. I did tell him thursday night that when I discovered his addcition for the second time almost 5 years ago when I was 6 months pregnant, I brushed it off as i had to think about the child i was carrying. I remember as I started to find the stuff, I was having contractions so I didn't pursue the matter much. I told him, we talked and cried. But, for the most part i pushed it aside so I didn't get too upset.
now, I told him how because I never dealt with those emotions, that pain, that now it's all coming out. And then some
I do believe the gym helps. I know the books are calling my name to read. I'm just afraid of reading something that will trigger an emotion, then the cycle starts over. I have to work again tonight which allows those emotions that I enounter while reading during the day to build up. Then, tonight, they will let loose. so...I'm thinking of reading them only on my off days or late at night after work.
H knows he is walking on eggshells with me as my moods change and I go through times when I want to give up and think maybe if HE goes away, all of this will too. I know doing so though would destroy him. He now knows our old relationship is gone. we have to start over and rebuild.
It is true when you said telling the truth is the beginning of giving love. It is. And respect.
That's why this is hard on me...he takes the blame, sees my hurt, he said he hates seeing me like that on the bad days when he sees how angry and hurt I really am. He just listens, and cries. I then feel like a monster, but I am this monster because of him. I told him that the other night...this is what he's made me into.
We've always had a good relationship. We never nagged or picked on each other, didn't fight or bicker. However, there were other issues. Him not talking to me.
I'm going to write in the journal now...
This is heartening. I heard him tell my brother Saturday while we were visiting, that he was so irritated by trying to rent a movie, any movie, that didn't contain nudity or sexual scenes. That when those scenes came up he felt so uncomfortable, for both of us. He mostly rents things like National Geographic, and the like. Because, almost all other films include all that stuff that hurt us both so much. It was good to hear him tell someone else that it made him as uncomfortable as it does me. Took a long time for him to see the societal training to that stuff. But, he does see it. And he expresses an opinion that he doesn't like it.