Sexual Betrayal Recovery Group Community Group
This board has been created especially for those who have discovered a partner's secret sexual behaviors and suffered resultant mental, emotional and physical damage. And, it is my desire to invite open, honest communication. Each of us are in a different place, from pre-discovery, to immediate discovery, to recovering our bearings, and moving on. Need to talk?
I read this recent article--kind of a primer on manipulation...http://blogs.psychcentral.com/sex-addiction/2012/08/fake-romance-understanding-a-seduction-addict%E2%80%99s-playbook/
4 Types of Subtle Manipulation
By LINDA HATCH, PHD
feeling manipulatedManipulation can be very subtle. We often talk about how manipulative addicts are. And in particular we talk about how sex addicts manipulate others in order to avoid discovery, throw their partner off the scent and “gaslight” their partners. In gaslighting, a term taken from the 1944 movie Gaslight, a person controls another person by finding ways to make them think that they are imagining things or that they are actually delusional.
Manipulation as a weapon of the weak
By definition manipulation is indirect and devious. It is neither aggressive nor passive-aggressive, although it is a cousin to both. It is a way of getting what you want without directly asking for it.
Manipulation does not involve overtly aggressive behaviors like threats or bullying although manipulative people may do these things at times. It is also different from mere passive-aggressive behaviors such as being late for something we don’t want to do or “forgetting” something we were supposed to do.
Someone who resorts to manipulation is doing so as a way to stay safe. Often the manipulator is in a low-power position in a relationship or unconsciously adopts that position. A manipulator is acting out of fear, fear of being direct, fear of being honest, and above all fear of being assertive and vulnerable.
Signs of manipulation
There are some subtle types of communication that suggest you may be dealing with a manipulator. All of them are designed to ultimately control what you think or do in ways that have plausible deniability. The manipulator is hiding their real selfish motive.
Arguing you out of what you want
You are leaving the house and you remember something else you need to bring. Your friend who is impatient to get going may say ” you don’t really need that do you?” or “You don’t want to be late do you?” The “logical” manipulator always has a reason why it is in your interests to do what is actually in his/her interests. This can apply to all kinds of things including things you want to spend money on that are important to you but that the manipulator doesn’t care about. He or she may try to convince you that this or that expenditure is not necessary, when that is actually beside the point (and maybe wrong). I honestly believe that some manipulative addicts try to talk their partners out of things on general principle, as if the idea of someone else getting their needs met is almost threatening in itself.
Non-stop talking
This is one that I observe in highly exploitive people including some sex addicts and sex offenders I have interviewed. Some people are just naturally very talkative, but monopolizing the conversation can also become a habit of people who are furtive and/or insecure about getting their needs met. If it is hard to get a word in edgewise, you may be talking to someone with a very powerful agenda that is hidden from view. This too can become a habitual way of interacting; control the conversation to control the outcome of the interaction.
Derisive joking and sarcasm
In this instance the manipulator is actually pushing you toward or away from something by means of shaming you. This could relate to anything: a movie you want to see, a person you like or don’t like, even your philosophy of life. The manipulative person is trying to influence you in a rather aggressive way without it seeming aggressive. He or she is staying in a safe place but trying to make your position seem trivial, silly, uninformed, unimaginative or wrong. All this is done by making fun of you and seeming to have no malice. But in fact it is a rejection of you.
Reframing your reality
This is a common form of persuasive communication and is not always done in an illegitimate way. I remember I once said that I didn’t want to invite someone to my wedding, someone I had a petty resentment against. My friend said “You are better than that.” This was actually a helpful thing as it helped me get over the resentment.
But when a person attempts to change your reality out of their own self interest it’s a different matter. This is the person who may want you to do something that you think is wrong and argues “life is short” or “if you are really my friend…” etc.
Manipulation in recovering addicts
If you have ever lived with a sex addict, or maybe any untreated addict, you may be saying that this is old stuff to you. You may have experiences so much manipulation that you had it wired.
In recovering sex addicts there is a lot of emphasis on living in integrity and not trying to be devious or controlling toward other people. But even in addicts with long term recovery it may be the case that the habitual ways of relating during the addiction will linger.
Arguably the recovering addict’s most difficult challenge is learning to function in intimate relationships. Intimacy requires trust and openness, and the recovering addict will be working toward becoming more direct and transparent even when the addictive behavior is long gone.
4 Types of Subtle Manipulation
By LINDA HATCH, PHD
feeling manipulatedManipulation can be very subtle. We often talk about how manipulative addicts are. And in particular we talk about how sex addicts manipulate others in order to avoid discovery, throw their partner off the scent and “gaslight” their partners. In gaslighting, a term taken from the 1944 movie Gaslight, a person controls another person by finding ways to make them think that they are imagining things or that they are actually delusional.
Manipulation as a weapon of the weak
By definition manipulation is indirect and devious. It is neither aggressive nor passive-aggressive, although it is a cousin to both. It is a way of getting what you want without directly asking for it.
Manipulation does not involve overtly aggressive behaviors like threats or bullying although manipulative people may do these things at times. It is also different from mere passive-aggressive behaviors such as being late for something we don’t want to do or “forgetting” something we were supposed to do.
Someone who resorts to manipulation is doing so as a way to stay safe. Often the manipulator is in a low-power position in a relationship or unconsciously adopts that position. A manipulator is acting out of fear, fear of being direct, fear of being honest, and above all fear of being assertive and vulnerable.
Signs of manipulation
There are some subtle types of communication that suggest you may be dealing with a manipulator. All of them are designed to ultimately control what you think or do in ways that have plausible deniability. The manipulator is hiding their real selfish motive.
Arguing you out of what you want
You are leaving the house and you remember something else you need to bring. Your friend who is impatient to get going may say ” you don’t really need that do you?” or “You don’t want to be late do you?” The “logical” manipulator always has a reason why it is in your interests to do what is actually in his/her interests. This can apply to all kinds of things including things you want to spend money on that are important to you but that the manipulator doesn’t care about. He or she may try to convince you that this or that expenditure is not necessary, when that is actually beside the point (and maybe wrong). I honestly believe that some manipulative addicts try to talk their partners out of things on general principle, as if the idea of someone else getting their needs met is almost threatening in itself.
Non-stop talking
This is one that I observe in highly exploitive people including some sex addicts and sex offenders I have interviewed. Some people are just naturally very talkative, but monopolizing the conversation can also become a habit of people who are furtive and/or insecure about getting their needs met. If it is hard to get a word in edgewise, you may be talking to someone with a very powerful agenda that is hidden from view. This too can become a habitual way of interacting; control the conversation to control the outcome of the interaction.
Derisive joking and sarcasm
In this instance the manipulator is actually pushing you toward or away from something by means of shaming you. This could relate to anything: a movie you want to see, a person you like or don’t like, even your philosophy of life. The manipulative person is trying to influence you in a rather aggressive way without it seeming aggressive. He or she is staying in a safe place but trying to make your position seem trivial, silly, uninformed, unimaginative or wrong. All this is done by making fun of you and seeming to have no malice. But in fact it is a rejection of you.
Reframing your reality
This is a common form of persuasive communication and is not always done in an illegitimate way. I remember I once said that I didn’t want to invite someone to my wedding, someone I had a petty resentment against. My friend said “You are better than that.” This was actually a helpful thing as it helped me get over the resentment.
But when a person attempts to change your reality out of their own self interest it’s a different matter. This is the person who may want you to do something that you think is wrong and argues “life is short” or “if you are really my friend…” etc.
Manipulation in recovering addicts
If you have ever lived with a sex addict, or maybe any untreated addict, you may be saying that this is old stuff to you. You may have experiences so much manipulation that you had it wired.
In recovering sex addicts there is a lot of emphasis on living in integrity and not trying to be devious or controlling toward other people. But even in addicts with long term recovery it may be the case that the habitual ways of relating during the addiction will linger.
Arguably the recovering addict’s most difficult challenge is learning to function in intimate relationships. Intimacy requires trust and openness, and the recovering addict will be working toward becoming more direct and transparent even when the addictive behavior is long gone.
One way you know an addict is recovering and sobriety has taken hold is that they no longer need to manipulate. Old communication behaviors do take time to change, but it has been a very long time since I have felt manipulated by my husband. Thanks for posting what is really invaluable information.
For instance, many years ago, he stated that his porn usage and masturbation have nothing to do with me or the marriage. Well, from strictly a standpoint of his feelings on the subject, that may well be true...though it doesn't play out that way at all. So, he either lied to me, or he lied to himself, or perhaps both? I feel like when he takes his time to sneak around and select an image of a person, or persons in order to become sexually excited to masturbate, he accomplishes a few things. One of those is, of course, that he is aiming his sexual excitement toward other folks. That accomplishes a couple of things too. One of them, is that he never had the sexual energy left to fully meet my sexual or emotional needs. Another, is that he trained himself to respond to certain things that had nothing to do with me. So, of course, we weren't bonding. He was bonding himself to images of others. Another, is that even though he suggests his behavior has nothing to do with me, I feel diminished in his eyes. That doesn't mean that I feel diminished in the eyes of others necessarily, but I don't feel comfortable or valued in his estimation. So, though I may feel attractive to some men, I don't feel attractive to him. That isn't conducive to wanting to interact with him at all. Consequently, I feel less and less good having sex with him. That's only a couple of the actual results. There are far more.
So, I feel like his attempting to convince me that his behavior is singular, unobtrusive, not infidelity, and only self service, is not true, and is an invalid attempt at manipulation. Say, he was successful? What is the result of his behavior? He gets to tend his fantasies toward others, ignore my needs, and serve himself. And what do I get? Sexual dissatisfaction and a failed bond. It seems like that is manipulating me out of my normal healthy sexual health.