Hi Kelly,

You probably already know what I think; about men looking at the girls. The Mr. Man Mall Guy? Thankfully, it just doesnt bother me anymore. I had needed to quit looking at the men who were looking at the girls. I havent obsessed on it once lately. Do you remember when were first friends; how you let me write (on your thread) about that little problem?

I guess this mostly to say thanks again for that.

Did you know what George Burns had said?, He said, When I was eighteen I like eighteen year olds. Why should I be any different now?
You could guess what I think about that too.

Kelly you said, For a few seconds I had my accustomed reaction of hurt and anger, then I reminded myself that it's just not my problem anymore. That felt pretty damn good.

Now thaswhat mtalkin bout gur.

Arthur

My girlfriend and I both concur that 18 is a proper cut-off age if we are isolating age as a variable. Any age is subjective though.

However, if he is with you, checking a girl out right in front of you is disrespectful if it hurts you, regardless of age.

It also matters how a person checks someone else out. Noticing someone as they walk by is one thing. Subtlety is important. Making the person feel uncomfortable is definitely not ok.

And you know I'm going to draw evolution into this :) Men get a high dose of pleasure chemicals when checking out youth. Youth = fertility = highest chance for reproductive success. That reward is dumped when we see body parts that indicate fertility, regardless of age number. It's very pleasurable for men to check out young girls of reproductive age. It's up to you to decide what age is acceptable for any corresponding behavior.

As a man, I understand why a man would want to check out young reproductive-aged females. But I must say the greater the age difference the greater the creepy factor for me. Especially if someone is going to great lengths to get a peek.

I have two daughters, ages 13 and 24. I do what I can to protect them and teach them to protect themselves but there's a limit to what I can do. I have a friend who's afraid to post pictures of his kids on FB because of how some perv might get off on looking at them. Again, there's a limit to what we can do.

I came to terms long ago with the fact that I have attractive kids and I can't stop people from looking at them, and I certainly can't control their thoughts. But, God Help Them if they lay a hand on my babies. Then they're dealing with the Mama Bear.

With all that said, a man who is checking out teenagers is a creep at best and a potential pedophile at worst. If it were my husband I'd kick his ass, figuratively of course. Men should be expected to exercise some self control, no different than anyone else, and that goes for looking and thinking as well. I'm sick of the idea that boys will be boys.

I think you need to be careful with your definition of teenager. A 13 year old are very different things, yet both teenagers. In the eyes of our culture adulthood starts at 18. Therefore a person can check-out a teenager and be checking out an adult at the same time. I think it would be silly to call checking out an adult pedophilia. However, if I caught someone checking out my 13 year old daughter I'd punch em out.

Edit. A 13 year old and 18-19 year old are very different things.

Kelly,

Maybe I'm the odd critter here but I never really looked, per se. But my estimate would be that if they are not of legal age, it's best to avert one's eyes, you know? The older you become, the older the person you should be looking at, but that alone is a tad distasteful, to me.

Even so, I do think it is extremely disrespectful to look at someone as though they were the last piece of meat in a communist butcher shop at closing time.

I see it all the time, and it really annoys me. It's not just the looks but the comments, I'm left wondering if these guys have been held up in a deserted island for all these years. When I'm with some men, at times, they point them out to me and actually make fun of me for not looking. "Oh I forget, as always, you missed it." They'll say.

Missed it, like the person I failed to see is not a person but a sight, like the sight of a refrigerator, if that. My point is this, other men encourage this behavior and if you are not strong enough to endure the slings and arrows, you'll find yourself obligated to look, also.

Sadly, I am abnormal and no amount of torture would make me do it. But I will admit that during my porn addiction, my eyes would stop and pause at someone for longer than I had been used to (two seconds was too long for me) and that alone alarmed me. This behavior was not normal for me and it was one of the reasons among many why I sought recovery.

Now I am back to where I was, and still being teased, ask me if I care. :)

Hugs,
Wolf

Hugs to you, Wolf, for being one of the good ones. This idea that 'boys will be boys' only holds up in as far as we accept that this is all that 'boys' are. I have a son who has had, so far, very little exposure to this negative peer pressure. He defines being a boy as simply being himself. I hope he holds onto that self image for a lifetime.

i suppose i would like to add my 2 cents on this. I have found myself attracted to girls under 18. I know it is wrong. It makes me worry. I think it's stupid to consider them in a sexual way. My father told me something I appreciate. He said why would I want to think about something I can not do. So am I going to go around dating younger girls? no. So why would I want to be checking them out when I am not going to be involved with them. Why would I even want to consider something I can't have. That line of reasoning has stuck with me in many things. I always think of this too. Would I want some jerk looking at my neice like she's nothing but a body. Obviously people who ogle young girls have no consideration what so ever for other people. If they did they wouldn't be doing that. It's decent to show some respect for young people and the people that care of them.

I like what fiber junkie said, men should be expected to control where they look and what they think of.

If men at this age are checking out teens and thinking about them in ANY sexual manner, they are called pediphiles. This isn't just a passing conversation to accept. It's ok to think someone is pretty but to get infatuated enough to meet the parents to get a closer look is one step too far. I have two daughters and granddaughters that I would seriously be pissed if a grown man,who is supposed to think different as he gets older, gets closer to get a better look.
Has society become that num to perverted behaviors? I'm not closed minded nor am I ablivious to such attractions and where they can lead. Don't fool yourselves too much about this issue. Teenagers are abducted and raped every day because others have inappropriate feelings about them. Sorry,but your husband sounds like a pervert who needs to get himself in check. He is telling you but I'm not sure you are listening. Ask a young girl who has been molested by the parents friends,neighbors and family if this is appropriate. Better yet go on the abuse site,here,if you have any questions. You are not inappropriate but your husband is.

Wasn't attacking you but people need to start thinking different about these kind of people.

Kelly: You shared, "He just gave his stock answer: all guys do." Tha seems to be the "stock" answer of choice doesn't it? That is "so" easy to refute. Until he grows up enough to know that he speaks for no one but himself, he'll keep trying to blame "all guys." I'm sure that there are many, many, many who would be willing to clue him in....he has fed himself a whole plethora of lies until he can't even think for himself.

grand, I'm pretty sure Kelly is talking about her ex, not someone she's continuing in a relationship with. She is not his keeper.

With that said, Kelly, I would agree that he is no longer your problem only in as far as he is no longer your spouse. You do, in my opinion, have a responsibility to your community as a whole to report his inappropriate behavior to whomever can put a stop to it and protect the kids who might be exposed to him. Even if he never acts out his thoughts, if those kids are aware of being ogled by him then they are being affected by his covert abuse, and that perpetuates the cycle.

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to do nothing.

Thanks everyone, as always great input. Grand and Fiber, I feel I need to clarify...the ex was checking out 20 somethings and it pissed me off because that's our boys' age. The 15 yr old at the beach looked to be a 20 something also. I was using the "what age is too young 16/15? as an example to him that 20 something is still too young.

Rude and inappropriate yes, but not a pedophile.

And I'm saying that he doesn't need to know how old that girl is to cause her psychological harm. She may look 20 but she still feels like a 15 y.o. and would respond as such to being ogled by him. If she was aware then the potential for harm is there and her parents need to know in order to support her appropriately.

Letting things like this slide means letting it pass on to a new generation, leaving them to clean up the mess.