You: Here is an address for a site that might be helpful. We have confronted many of the same issues you shared. http://www.dailystrength.org/groups/spousespartners-of-sex-addicts

Hey hun, well my dear, your man is an addict, it is sad really, he has a disease, addiction runs rampid in my family, it stems from an unstable childhood with alcoholic parents. I am a codependent, I have had my share of addict men, that is my disease, codependency, I suggest you go to a SANON meeting or ALANON meeting where you will find women like myself and you. They like myself have been where you have been and healed their lives.
Also some talk therapy would do you some good as well. Going to church to meet caring supportive people would help. You are having a codependent bottom right now, it is rough, been there.
breath girl, it gets better , ONE DAY AT A TIME.
Keep in mind your man is not well, he is not doing this to YOU to hurt YOU, he is in the throws of an addiction, NOT a fun place for him to be I can assure you. Be grateful your not him, you can heal, his journey to wellness may be out of his reach. Sadly for him
addiction is a total BEOTCH

Hello SheenRe and KimmyTime,

Thanks so much for the link, the resources and encouragment.

Tonight i am still struggling trying to think how can I spot selfish nice acts from genuine, giving nice acts of a partner? It is hard to separate out, to look at my past and realize I could not tell the difference. I need to re-write my own history, to discount those good times as just ploys, manipulations, and just all one big lie. And it is very tough to face that his "kind" actions are motivated by his own selfish payoffs.

How do we push aside the so-called romantic times we once felt loved (but were not) to take a .closer look for the signs for pathology? I need to list the and many ways he showed me no respect, no empathy, or really any deep interest in who I am. Maybe then I can write off those times i was fooled into thinking his words were true, his purpose loving.

Wounding me means nothing to him even if he is supposed to be at the stage of an apology (took him 2 years to even try to give a generic apology letter. I am sorry to say for me I believe even that was just about him feeling good he made his therapist happy and can pat himself on the back).

I read on one support post about the addict not only apologizing but asking how to make amends. Any thoughts on this? To me it seems to actually demonstrate sincerity and real concern that arises when one realizes the damage done, feels remorse, and apologies. It is a sign that an apology is not mere words.

Mike simply became defensive and angry when i asked what ways he thought he could make amends, if he had any ideas, saying he could think of nothing.

I kept thinking an apology would help me heal. It never dawned on me that the narcissist is most likely incapable of the kind of genuine apology that is rooted in compassion.

He has not felt any of the pain he caused. Shame ..sure. Remorse...only that there now is evidence that can be used against him that he can't erase. He has not recognized the many cruelties inflicted in addition to the actual deceptions and sex acts that violated his vows and destroyed trust.

I am not sure how I move from feeling so angry, wounded and hurt to just saying none of it matters because he is simply a sick man.

And then to cast blame on partners.... I think the label "co-dependent" strips the partner of dignity and casts blame on victims. We no longer (at least in theory) blame rape victims but here in the land of sex addiction with narcissistic borderline personalities who enjoy torturing partners after reeling them in with "loving words and gestures, somehow the partner is partially at fault.

I mean if a serial killer lures a victim at a party to his home and then kills this person, do people sit around and find fault with the victim who fell for the serial killer's charm? Do we say "Hey, if this person had more self respect, they would have walked away from that serial killer before it was too late. They would have been so sure of themselves that they would not had any need to spend time with that sweet talking killer. "

I just don't get the culture of therapy that thinks it is ok to label and indirectly point fingers at victims of anti-social, psychopaths. I feel the underlying message is partners are NOT victims. They are perpetrators of a different connected crime, they are co-dependents who volunteered to be victims. Message: Go figure out what you are doing wrong to have met and fallen for these sick people.

Am I perfect?

No.

Is anyone?

Not that I know of.

To me it would be helpful to have been taught tips to spot these personalities, to be aware of the tactics they use. to know how to handle their manipulation, and to be armed with ways to escape their grip. I found out everything bit by bit, by chance, by then digging more, scouring the internet on my own. I did not even know about sex addiction when I first met my husband. And it was a long long time before I could match the facts with online articles on psychological patterns of narcissistic borderline personalities to begin to figure out what was going on in my home.

Am I supposed to stop being an empathetic person?

Not going to happen.

Am I going to now always look closer for signs that someone is completely self-centered and has no empathy of their own?

You bet.

But if anyone else has been there, let me tell you it is not as easy as it sounds with these double whammied addicts. I refuse to beat myself up land think if I was emotionally healthier I would have spotted that my husband is very malicious and sick.

I do know how to create a safe environment for connection, to ask questions, to try to communicate, to compare words with deeds. I did try to work towards dialogue and solutions with my husband. But he would stonewall, deflect with anger, all the usual methods of avoidance used by addicts I did not roll over and just hope for the best. And maybe that is why I resent labeling. Just because my heart ached then and now. I felt sad or disappointed and still do that I did not have a loyal, loving partner, why does this necessarily mean I am some kind of love sick, co-dependent who can't see things as they were and are?

So these are the kinds of conflicting thoughts and emotions that swirl through my head. I do not mean to bite the hand that is feeding me! I am just trying to share that I have a lot of feelings wrapped up inside. I may be right about some things, wrong about others, imperfect and confused.

One positive I can sure say I am armed now to ask better questions, will seek only those who CAN communicate openly and work for solutions without attack, and be with people who value honesty.

How do I know who these people are without giving lie detector tests? How do I recover from the knowledge I was so masterfully lied to in complex, extremely intelligent ways that nothing I believed was true actually was?

On the negative side, I have lost faith in my own intuition and the value of trust. I feel I have too many scars, have been betrayed on all levels to such a degree to ever want to truly give my heart to anyone in a romantic relationship. I don't think I will feel truly safe again in this iifetime.

And despite all the times I hear people say "Don't take Mike's actions personally, I still believe that many of the personal attacks made WERE individually directed at me with sadistic pleasure. Sadists "enjoy" inflicting pain and I think narcissist borderlines can too.

Even when my husband apologized this weekend, his facial expression and body language at certain moments seemed to show there was an undercurrent of smug satisfaction. He was self-congratulatory that he was able to use me, to deceive me, to succeed hiding so many of his sexual addiction affairs from me.

If someone has no remorse, has a conscious relishing for their harmful actions, even our criminal justice system ranks that higher in terms of severity of offense and how we regard what should be done. He is a sex addict because he is a narcissist and I think that it is different than someone only with a sex addition who is still capable in some ways of actually knowing how to love. I don't think a narcissist is capable of love as we know it. He or she has no basis for even comprehending what it is.

I do want to thank you SheenRe and KimmyTime, for taking the time to reach out. I will try to stay open to healing, will check out resources you both suggested, really try to listen to your words and absorb what they mean, and try hard to believe it will get better.

Sorry for all the typos! Wish there was a way to edit posts after pushing REPLY. Ok, at least there is good evidence I am not perfect, ha, ha!

Cheers and hugs

You: Only you can determine what "you" are, or are not, willing to tolerate in a relationship. That includes things small to large. I found that the small things were indicative of disrepect and insensitivity, which were telltale markers for much more disrespectful things. So, when I began to tend the wee ones, the larger ones had no support. I think my H had to get so busy tending his wee bad behaviors, that he had no muster for any larger ones. If the wee ones couldn't be dismissed, then the larger ones were without question not going to fly? I once had the mindset that wee things didn't matter much. I was waaaaaay wrong about that! Tolerating nonsense and insensitive behavior only led him to believe he could get away with that and more? He no longer gets away with any of them. I let him know the script of my life reads like this "I expect that you always treat me in a way that indicates that you are very happy to be here with me...and...if you can't do that...then you'll have to move on to someone who is willing to tolerate otherwise."

Hi SheenRe,
About the small things, he makes me feel I am the one who overreacts about "small" things, paints a picture that I am the unreasonable one. Yet, these "small" things are always signs of underlying disregard and disdain for my feelings.

I am trying very hard to not get sucked in yet again by his emotional manipulations and focus on the countless times he shows no concern or care or empathy for anything I feel. The many "smsll" cruelties, the way he knows I am upset and continues to just ignore that he has done something callous, never apologizes, cuts me off angrily, gives me no safe space or time to express anything without lashing out or stonewalling.

Somehow I think that there is a big emotional trap that he does something nice, or says some therapy speak that sounds like he has made progress. Yet, the actions in regards to me personally remain the same despite his claims he is making progress. I think with a narcissist, and most likely borderline one at that, even his recovery is all about him and never about comprehending the emotional damage he caused and continues to cause whether acting out or not

Here is what I emailed the other day:
"I offered unconditional support and understanding. I gave you words of genuine comfort and care.I am no longer going to reach out to emotionally connect. Your actions show we have very different values in terms of how friends and people who love choose to be there for one another. No need to reply. I can no longer accept marginalization and being someone of little consequence in your life. I deserve better."

So your comments about unless your partner acts in ways that demonstrate he is very happy to be here with me, go find someone who is willing to tolerate otherwise" resonate deeply within me.

It is the emotional rollercoaster of being with a narcissist borderline sex addict---on top of not knowing how to be intimate, he seems to take satisfaction in kicking me and then reaching out, making sure I am still there to mistreat. He always gets the most upset when people he has deeply wronged are angry. Even years later he will try to get that woman to make peace with him. It is not that he reaches out to help this person heal for the damage he has done. He wants to get absolution for himself. There still is no recognition of the suffering and pain someone endured at his hands.

I sent the message above after yet another "small" thing, refusing to pick up the phone or text two days after writing he wasn't doing that anymore and that when was I ever going to "at least let this one thing be put to rest", as if I have a multiple set of issues that somehow i foolishly refuse to let go.

When I finally gave up just trying to connect to share and hear about a mutually loved event he was attending that I was not present at, I simply sent his text back to him, only to be attacked that it doesn't mean he has to respond right away (anytime that day), only within a "reasonable" time.

Reasonable is always on his terms even when he knows I am being hurt and "blown off" as he calls it.

I have not heard from him since that response. I have not contacted him at all. By mistake today he pocket dialed me. I made the mistake of answering the phone to hear static. He heard me saying "hello, hello" and finally came on the phone and admitted it was an error the phone was dialed. Said he had to hang up right then to talk to his therapist but would call later. He never did. So this is yet another example of the "small" things that make me feel discarded, not a welcome part of his life, and end up feeling sick.

I am trying to be civil and the kind of person I can be proud of. Yet, I feel that being good to him only results in more abuse.

While he was here last week he actually suggested I might want to attend Thanksgiving with him at the house of the women he slept with while acting out, someone he had just told me about during his apology, a complete stranger. Just the idea cuts me to the core and I reel in disbelief that this man can actually think his wife who loved him and has been faithful would want to spend a holiday where we are to be grateful for loved ones with someone he cheated with. I feel like my heart is cut out, diced up, and fed to dogs while he smiles and says "Wasn't that a nice meal?"

And then he will turn around and ask me do dinner, talk about all his achievements, maybe appreciate my feedback and insights even. I feel like he is a vampire who grows stronger while I grow weaker.

I am trying hard to escape him. If I try to confront him directly, to challenge him even politely, to press on the financial matters he has not dealt with, the divorce settlement checks he has not mailed, he changes on a dime, becomes a hardened, vindictive attacker. Usually he just becomes angry and either refuses to talk to me or else blames me for always choosing the wrong time to have conversation--even if I preface a conversation with "Is this a good time to talk?"

I grow more despondent each day thinking this will never end. And if somehow at least I manage to get the divorce papers signed and my own money returned, I will never stop hurting over the many cruelties.

It is a hard, hard night, SheenRe. You are the only one I have to talk with. Thanks for listening. I do so appreciate that you have taken time to give me some words of encouragement and share your own insights.

You are kind. And generous.

best wishes

It will end, when "you" decide it ends. I know that sounds trite. But, it's true. I once would do as you're sharing. I came to the realization that "I" have to talk to no-one at all. And, I can walk away any time I choose to do so. And, that "anyone" who would even consider treating me with disrespect isn't worth the time or effort to remain. I learned to respect me...accept my own decisions...and allow no one to tread on me...at all.

It sounds to me as if he is under some kind of impression that if he can uspset you, he owns you. So? Does he? Or, do you respect yourself and own your decisions? Remember, that only "you" can make decisions that include him in any way at all in your life. And, if you've made a decision to allow contact, own that decision. Until you own your decisions, you can't change them.

Have you approached the court about them collecting what he owes? I believe you can assign someone there to collect and send you the money? It seems like you're somewhat caught in a trap. So, don't allow the trapper to set the trap, or release the trap. You release it.

This person of whom you speak is whacky. Do you understand that? His behavior is quite insane. So, do you intend to entertain that?