The medical profession has determined that masturbation is a healthy practice. When the Bible was written very little was known about medicine, so we cannot use it as reliable source.

Now, when it becomes unhealthy as in unhealthy compulsion it can become an addiction. So, in short I respect your opinion but attempting to guilt others who are stuggling with Bible scripture is not only misguided but also mean spirited since the addiction feeds on guilt, shame, etc. In other words, it is not helpful.

As an aside, children who sassed their parents would also be taken outside of town and be stone to death by the entire town but for some strange reason we do not that anymore though I think the way children are behaving these days, it may not be a bad idea but we both know it would be barbaric.

Enough said,
Wolf

I agree totally with Wolf! Believe it or not, addiction feeds off of shame. So shaming the addict through a bible quote only serves to keep the addict an addict.
One of the things that releases the addiction is letting go of shame. Bringing light in recovery means being able to share openly without fear of being shamed by others.
I know there are many addicts who actually find hope through the bible, but to be clear, nothing should be taken literally.

As a Christian, I believe that the Old Testament was written by the 'unteachable' Israelites who went on to worship the Golden Calf.

Jesus came to fulfill the law and replace it with his own divine inspiration. (e.g. Rebuking Moses' commands for Divorce Procedures and challenging the Fundamentalism of the Pharisees over Sabbath observance)

I do acknowledge, as well, inconsistencies in scripture.

As a Christian, you believe the Bible is the Word of God. Therefore you cannot pick and choose what you want to believe and NOT want to believe. Then you are NOT a Christian. We must accept God as He is. The WHOLE God, even though our sinful hearts do not want to sometimes.

My purpose of giving these verses is NOT to shame people. If you understand God's Word, there is NO shame, because Jesus paid it all. We don't have to be ashamed, but my purpose was to encourage us ALL to go to Him. No, RUN to him and seek His mercy. That is the only way to be saved. Feeling shame? That's your sinful heart. Free yourself by seeking Him. It is right in front of us but for some reason, maybe we don't truly want to be saved.

Sosick,

Again bullying people into conforming to your thinking is not acceptable behavior for a support group. Not all of us are Christians and if this is the way you are going about trying to convert others, let us just say, it is not working.

It is disrespectful but typical of people who think they have "the ultimate truth" on their side, read self righteous, no one goes to God wllingly out of shame, it would not be genuine, in the least. Fear is the opposite of love, even St. Peter said that he who fears does not know love.

But I digress, please be respectful of those who are neither Christian nor religious, this forum is not a pulpit, we try to stay away from quoting scripture that either demeans or shames anynone. It is neither helpful nor supportive.

It has nothing to do with what we want to believe, it has everything to do with some of us living in the 21st century and what we now know about psychology, medicine and biology. It is your perfect right to live in the Mosaic century but you cannot expect the rest of us who know better to live in the past.

Wolf

I do feel you are preaching which is not really helpful to anyone here.

It's like saying, if you don't believe this, then you are doomed which is not true. There are many people who take many paths to recovery and some do not include God or Jesus.

Saying someone has a sinful heart because they feel shame is, in fact, shaming them.

We must all work on acceptance in recovery and learn to let go of that which we have no control.

I

Wolf,

It isn't my thinking, it's God's Word. It is a public forum, and if someone wants to reject God's Word, then let him do so. I'm trying to help those who cannot do it on their own, and need a greater help, through our Lord and Savior. If you find that 'disrespectful,' then you don't have to reply.

"It has nothing to do with what we want to believe, it has everything to do with some of us living in the 21st century and what we now know about psychology, medicine and biology."

And how is science and the world doing these days? Cancer and disease is rampant than any other century in history. Wars and gun violence are on the covers of papers everyday. How is that great world of ours working out? How advanced the world is today than it was even 20, 30 years ago, let alone 2000 years ago? Just curious since you mentioned it.

i am not sure your intent ? Are you a sex/porn addict? The spouse of an addict?

Most Bible commentaries will explain that the divine judgment in this story was not as a result of masturbation, but because Onan selfishly refused to impregnate his former sister-in-law, which was the custom at a time when widows needed offspring to take care of them in their old age. So, although masturbation has been branded "onanism" in some old writings, this is generally recognized as a misnomer. Besides, what this scripture really describes is "pulling out" - which is actually recommended by some denominations (such as Roman Catholics) who do not believe in "artificial" birth control. Some in more traditional times also believed "the fall" was due to sexual relations between Adam and Eve - but anyone reading the Song of Solomon can see God's approval of sex and how it reflects the profound relationship He desires with humankind.

Look, if in recovery, the bible, religion, God or Jesus can help someone become sober, then that's great.
But preaching it here with judgment is of no help to anyone.
I would also reiterate Candy's question about intent.
The most important thing addicts can achieve in recovery is empathy for themselves and others.
Using the bible or religion to judge another's road to recovery is not showing empathy.

God loves you. He cares about you. No one is more empathetic than Him.

sosick, I agree with your understanding that masturbation goes against God's plan for creation, and the more I study scripture -- which I've been spending a lot of time doing lately -- the more convinced I am of this. But I am not sure that pulling out a bible quote is an effective way to evangelize.

For one thing, even if one accepts that masturbation is wrong, knowing that doesn't help the addict stop doing it. I knew for years that it was not what God wanted for me, but I kept falling back into the practice. What I needed was practical advice on how to deal with the urges and thoughts that nagged me when I tried to stop.

Skyman555, I could not have said it better myself! Job well done. Thank you for sharing the truth.

diansky,

I appreciate your response. As you stated, what "I needed was practical advice." What is more practical than the Word of God? As you read scripture, don't you apply what you're reading to each day the Lord gives you? Looking at porn and masturbating isn't something just to be ignored and passed along.

Everything is governed by Him, and you know what you should do you get a moment of sexual temptation? You should say, "Thank you my Lord!."

Thanking the Lord in moments of sin, will remind you that He is there and letting you know it isn't right. If that isn't practical, then I don't know what practical means. Like you said, God has a plan for us. It's now time for us to execute it with Faith and Action. NO EXCUSES.

Sosick,

Agreed but even Joel Osteen said we need to take specific steps to battle an addiction such as joining a recovery program, change our unhealthy habits for healthy habits, change our self defearing thoughts for thoughts of victory, most of which can easily be found on the Bible and we can personalize them to suit the occasion, do a total life makeover, create a tight schedule,etc. Those are the practical steps we can take that I think Dlansky was referring to.

In my experience, God cannot do much is we continue to fight the renewing of our minds, in a matter of speaking. We could spend our lives saying we are free from unhealthy behaviors but we also have to change that behavior to see results.

Am I saying that God is not all that is? No, I am saying that we need to also be proactive in our resolve to live a healthy life.

Wolf