A LOT of people believe that relationships should just happen. A great deal of divorce is because people fall out of love. And why? Because they don't work at the relationship. It stops being fiery and passionate or it stops being easy and natural and people think, "I guess we just weren't meant to be."

Your wife definitely sounds like the type to just want things to magically happen. They do in the beginning - that's what makes affairs so appealing, right? But after a time, relationships start to take work. It gets hard sifting through the day to day mundane stuff and overcoming issues. It's also work to get your partner to feel that rush of love when they look at you. But it's worth it, IMO. And the work can be fun, too (date nights, exploring fantasies together, problem solving as a team, etc.)

I hope your wife can see the light before it's too late and she loses you. She will look back someday with sadness and regret at all she lost and can never regain with anyone else if she doesn't start investing. It's not so much that you're trying too hard as much as she's not trying hard enough. :(

Thanks. I hope so to.

"This is only a problem because that is what makes me feel loving to her."

An interesting perspective. In "His Needs, Her Needs" the focus is on what does my spouse do that makes me feel loved, and upon learning that, do that. So I'm wondering if this is in essence another way of saying, "This is what would make me feel loved, so it feels loving to do it to her in hopes she'll reciprocate." IOW, by doing that you may still be projecting your needs onto her. That is why she probably feels you are trying too hard, because to her it may feel a bit artificial. Like you should really be angry with her, not showing her affection, so it doesn't feel right or genuine. Because that's not what she would do in your shoes.

I can't recall if you've read HNHN yet, or one of Dr. Harley's other books like Surviving an Affair (recommended, Gabi and I are working our way through it now). But if you did, you know the concept is to make her feel loved in the way that she would feel it. For her, it very well may not be affection and romantic letters, etc.

Her unwillingness to work on this is a problem. For her and you. She needs to face and deal with what happened. But a lot of CSs tend to not do that, or only do it for a short amount of time. They often have an unrealistic concept of how long this will take to work though. Many think once the initial fallout is over, it will be back to normal in a few months, tops a year. They certainly think you should be over it by then, and see that not happening as evidence that you are unwilling to forgive or move on, that you are stuck in the past. Unknowingly, by putting such an expectation on it, they ensure you won't get over it very quickly, because that attitude usually generates a fear in the BS that it is likely to happen again. That in a few months or years, we'll be right back in this mess because she failed to access what happened and find ways to deal with it effectively so it won't happen again.

Interestingly, the Early Church recognized this. Penitence for adultery lasted from 3 to 5 years. It would take at least that long to heal and ensure the CS had effectively dealt with the issue. Like, right now, closing in on 3.75 years since dday, Gabi is still under penitence at our church. Not nearly as strict as it was that first year, but still not back to "normal" status. Our priest is guiding her spiritual dealing with this, recommending books for her to read, guiding her recovery. IOW, there is no drive-thru solutions to this sin. The consequences take years to deal with.

I know where you're coming from. Gabi was proactive. She set up the initial counseling session within a week after dday. She wanted to read books. She wanted us to discuss what had happened. Together, we hashed through not only what happened, but the motivations, crossed boundaries, what internal desires, needs, and cravings in her that brought her to the place of willingly putting it all at risk. A lot of that is in our book.

I know on the Infidelity forum, there is a thread about needs. There is a valid concern that a CS or MC might take that concept and essentially blameshift the affair onto the BS. I've run into those people. One who, upon my blog post that announced the publication of my book, sent me an email with the complaint that my post read like I was putting all the blame on Gabi for the affair, and not taking blame for my failings as a husband. I explained what I've said in these forums many times before. She didn't respond back, so I have no idea if she accepted it or shook her head.

But affairs are need driven. Just not how most people view it. Because the needs that drive an affair are within the CS, not the BS. Then, within the CS the needs are either valid needs or "want" needs. That is, desires within the CS that grow so strong that they: 1. Degenerate into immoral desires (here, one's morality plays a part in this, as well as what the BS will feel is immoral since it will impact him) that should not be met by anyone, and 2. needs that are near impossible for the BS to ever meet them, which means only another person can do so outside the marriage.

Unmet valid needs can add fuel to the fire, can make a person more vulnerable to cheating. But without the want-needs, that will rarely be the "cause" of the CS deciding to cheat. Without the want-needs, a spouse will either work it out within the marriage or decide they can be content without having that need met on a regular basis. Once the want-needs factor into it, that's when a person becomes susceptible to seeking to meet it outside the marriage, because that is the only way it can be met.

In Gabi's case, for instance, we identified that since she was a child, third natural and then stuck into a blended family containing aside from her brother and sister, two step-siblings and two half-siblings, making it a family of seven kids, at one point all living together in a small house; she grew up not feeling wanted or noticed much of the time. Just blended in. There is even the story she grew up with that when her mom found out she was pregnant with Gabi, she went on roller coasters in the hopes of losing the baby (before the days of legal abortions). So she grew up craving affirming attention, that she was wanted. When I met her as a teen, she did try to hard to get people to like her. Not as bad as some, but she was annoying at times.

When she lost weight in 2007, around 80#, she started to feel attractive and desirable. (She was, indeed, to me even before that.) She noticed men looking at her and it made her feel good to get that kind of attention. Between 2007 and 2010, that developed into the "game" of flirting. She enjoyed the attention. So when OM#1 came on the scene, she was receptive to his advances, and bit by bit it drew her into more want-needs that she found harder and harder to resist.

All that to say we identified what it was in her that drove her to have her affairs. I met that need when we first started dating and got married. Then she found it in the kids. But now that the kids were getting older and leaving home and my desire for her was over 28 years old, so no way I could have met the need OM#1 did, and she started having that need met by other men through flirting, it just worked its way up, one step at at time, one crossed boundary at a time.

So Gabi knows what she needs to work on. What boundaries she needs to avoid crossing again, to never have another affair on me. For me, that gives me some basis upon which to rebuild trust. I think that is what you are looking for. Identify the problem, its cause, and apply a solution. Unlike a Star Trek episode, however, it will take more than 45 minutes of run time to do that. ;)

If she's refusing to read any books or work on this, the 180 may be your best bet. The change in attitude may make her take notice that you might be giving up. Will make the likelihood of an eventual divorce seem more real. She'll either do what is needed or she won't. It isn't up to you to win her back. She's got to want it enough that she's willing to do the painful work to rebuild trust.

Okay, now I'm writing another book, except on here! I hope some of that is helpful and will apply. I might be off the mark on what she is experiencing and thinking, but it sounds like she's taking the tactic of waiting for you to get over it, and the fact you haven't after a whole year would indicate that it isn't going to happen. She has to realize it hasn't happened because first she needs to create a safe relationship where trust can rebuild, and two, give it enough time.

It's like planting a grape orchid. For it to be successful, you have to ensure the conditions are prime for growth, soil nutrients, sufficient water, protection from insects and sickness, right amount of sunshine, etc. But even then, it takes a few years before the grapes that grow are usable. If the environment is off, it may never grow usable grapes.

You can't regrow your trust in her without her doing the work needed to create the environment for it to happen. Ignoring, waiting and watching in hopes it will fix itself, like growing grapes, will fail. I hope she will see that, read "How to Help Your Spouse Heal from Your Affair" and do the things in it that will help you to regrow trust in her.

Excuse the length of this. My PD meds are working well this morning and my fingers are flying! :)

If its important that she read books, may I suggest books on cd? She can listen while she drives.

Jason, i was met with the same opposition from my husband... I hurt that he wasn't proactive. I jus could not understand why he would not want to explore how/why he could do something against everything he believed in. Anyway... I finally got him to read an article now and then - something i e mailed or printed out. I think after seeing that we were not going anywhere he reluctantly agreed to read anything "i" wanted him to. Again.. Not proactive on his part, but at least something, right? I would say something like "Here honey, i found this article that might shed some light or put _____ into perspective, it conveys what i have been trying to express, but in a much better way" that would give me an in to ask questions of him ... if anything stood out for him, etc. Sometimes.. That didn't go very far, but again... Gentle persistence. He is still reluctant to read often, however, ONE THING has worked for us so far. I bought 2 copies of the same book and we read it TOGETHER. He happens to enjoy reading to me , so so far, this seems to be a win win.

It IS frustrating, i know, but don't give up.
Cole definitely has some sound advice. Maybe you could even print out one of his blog posts and ask your wife if she will take the time to read what you found through DS. Let her know just how much it would mean to you.

I recentaly printed out one of Gabrel's and one that I wrote and left it on the night stand for her to read. I do not know yet if she read it or not. I hope she did but if she did she has not mentioned it at all. I think Cole is right on the money with a lot of his response.
I do think she just wants me to more on I really have forgiven the act itself but still feel there is a real danger of it happening again maybe that is just my fear. I probably feel that way because there was never a real solid effort to figure out why it happened or how to prevent it from happening again in the future.

Thank you so much all of you, you have been a big help to me threw all of this and I have started the 180 don't know how that will cause me to feel. I really like being a loving person but just can not in my mind be doing all of the work anymore on my own.

She has done work a lot of it but, it just does not seem that trying to understand why has ever been figured out or matter to her to figure out.

I know I am not going anywhere and I will stick it out untill there is just nothing left to stick it out for.
We do have a happy marriage now and there is so many things that are so much better than before, and she has changed into a whole lot more open and honest wife. So there are lots of really good things that we have worked on and our relationship is better than it probably ever was.

I guess the major difference now is that I don't have a whole lot of trust in her or faith in her for not having another affair. Maybe I feel that since she is happy now and that eventualy she will forget of the pain it caused and slip into another.

I think that we lack that very deep love that I once had for her and think she had for me. I know why it is that at this point neither of us feel the safety we once felt. I think she is probably still thinking that I will leave her at some point and I am thinking that she will hurt me again. So I am protecting myself from the hurt by not risking compleatly believing in us. Protecting myself a little from that I am still a little gun shy to fully emerse in our relationship because of fear. She is doing the same becuase of the same fear.

I ask her the other day what is your biggest fear in our relationship? " That even threw all of the work that we will not get threw this" " That after everything we still wont make it"

My biggest fear I guess is the same but is really " Her Cheating again" in essance the same thing because I know that I could not work threw another affair that it would certainly end our relationship.

There is just a lot still to work on. I will be really glad when we get after more time has passed and she has been able to rebuild trust in us, and when I get to a point of not thinking about the passed and what happened so often. I have got a lot better at not getting upset to often and have a large amount of hope for that I will not always be thinking about it.

Hope that we do make it threw this and that we become stronger and that we find happiness and peace together.

Thank you everyone for the replies they help a lot. I feel that I have got to become close to you all here and that even threw a computer screen you all have helped me more than I ever thought possible.

Thank you all really from the bottom of my heart.

Amen to everything on this post.

I didn't have time to read everything .. Just wanted to tell you a story about my sister and her kids.. They had Disneyland year passes, they went 3-4 days a week. One day she told the boys if they were really good she would have a surprise for them on Friday.. She picked them up from school and her oldest asked "what's the surprise?"
She responded "we are going to Disneyland" she said "That's not a surprise"
If something is done on a regular basis it isn't "special" and becomes Empty, and mechanical

I have to partly disagree with jaymee. I would say if you truly love something it never stops being special. I cannot imagine EVER getting bored with or tired of a gorgeous (empty) warm beach, skiing or freshly baked bread (real bread, not a plastic kind) and soft boiled eggs. Even if I lived on the beach or on top of the skiing mountain and would have freshly baked fabulous bread delivered daily to have with my soft boiled eggs (pastured a free roaming hens!) it would still make me happy. Every. Single. Time. Because I really truly love it.
The other thing is appreciating things that we have easy access to. Like warm water or electricity. I don't think of it much until.... I don't have it. So I do make an effort to remember daily that it is in fact a privilege to have running (and clean and warm!) water or electricity. That did require some growing up though.....

Last but not least - a friend of mine asked recently on facebook who do her female friends prefer - Gale or Peeta (now if you did not read the book this is not going to be helpful). And it hit me that this might be your case! Some women prefer Gale, others - Peeta. You seem to be more like Peeta. If your wife would choose Gale, then being too loving and caring and good to her might not give her what she wants (without making you any less wonderful than you are).

Which brings me to the point Cole is talking about. It is what makes her feel loved that is going to make her feel loved, not what you think is going to make her feel loved. What she wants you to do for her not what you want to do for her. Kind of unfair, I know, but that's how it unreasonably is.

Good luck.