Thanks Livlafluv, it is a wonderful article you posted. I think it can be a long process to learn how to truely love yourself because we were never taught what love is. We were controlled, manipulated etc etc and it still goes on for most of us whose mothers are still alive. We have to be strong so we can start that process of loving ourselves. Also we probably need to learn how to forgive them for their shortcomings; I know this is really hard to do to totally forgive your mother for not loving us, but I think we need to forgive them in order to move on. I don't know where you stand on this issue of forgiveness? I know I can not change my mother as much I would like to, and I know her life was difficult and I don't think that I can totally forgive her, at least I have not done that sofar. Thanks again for the post and have a great weekend.

Thanks Enchanting. I hope you are enjoying a nice day.
I do want to believe that I have forgiven her. When I am far away from her, I feel ok most of the time and know that she is just not wired to love. Even thought it's hard, because I'll never know what a mother's genuine and unconditional love and support feels like. It's only when I am in her presence, and I see her unloving eyes, and hear her unloving words and tone of voice that I realize that I haven't totally forgiven. For now, I am just trying to have as little contact as possible with her and focus on myself for once.

Why should we forgive people who knowingly cause us harm?

I prefer the term 'acceptance' rather than forgiveness. If we can accept what has happened to us then we can perhaps move on.

In a way I agree with you madtraveller and it is very hard to forgive somebody that has hurt you so much and is still doing it. Also forgiving somebody does not mean everything is forgotton. I think we can forgive a person, accept that person for whatever they are in our heart and try our best to be a loving person and don't become like them. I am afraid to become bitter, mean and controlling like my mother and trying to forgive her makes me realize that I am not like her. I feel forgiving somebody in our heart helps us move on and become a loving person and not mean like them. What are your thoughts?

I have become cold and angry the last few years due to my mother's abuse so am not in a position to offer forgiveness right now - don't feel I ever will forgive though. I think if a person has a moment of realisation and apologises then a person may be in a position to forgive them.

It is very difficult living with her knowing what she has done/continues to do. I won't be in a position to leave until next year and I am really struggling at the minute.

HELLO FRIENDS, ENCHANTING I SUPPORT YOU ON THE FORGIVENESS ISSUE, YOU ARE RIGHT ON ONE POINT, I NOTICED YEARS AGO THAT I NEARLY WAS BECOMING JUST AS EVIL AS THE PERSONS WHO VERBALLY AND EMOTIONALLY ABUSED, ME THAN I SAID TO MYSELF, I AM NOT LIKE THEM, AND STOPPED TALKING TO THEM, UNFORTUNATELY THEY WERE FAMILY SO ONE WAY OR ANOTHER I WAS ALWAYS CONSCIOUS OF THE INFLUENCE THEY HAD ON MY LIFE, WHEN I FOUND FAITH IN 'CHRIST' I CHANGED, BUT I WAS BROUGHT UP IN AN ENVIRONMENT WHERE WE CURSED , AND DID I CURSE , AND YES I HAVE SEEN THE VENGEANCE OF ''GOD'', MY SISTER IN LAW THAT STARTED THE EVIL ,IS SINCE JULY A WIDOW, HER OLDER SON ,THE WIFE DIVORCED HIM, THE YOUNGER IS WITH AN OLDER WOMAN, HE HAS ONE LITTLE GIRL, BUT SHE DOESN'T WANT ANYMORE CHILDREN, SOON OR LATER EVIL IS REPAID....SO FORGIVENESS IS FOR US TO FIND OUR PEACE, OURSELVES AND BE LOVING , WE ARE NOT LIKE ANYBODY, WE ARE BEAUTIFULLY MADE AND WE GIVE LOVE . I CAN UNDERSTAND HOW YOU FEEL '' TRAVELLER'', AND I SO HOPE THAT YOU CAN SOON LEAVE AND FIND YOUR PEACE AWAY FROM HER , SO SORRY TO HEAR THAT SHE IS SO EVIL..HUGS AND LOVE LUCY..

I saw something along these lines in another post on this board about forgiveness: Someone cannot be forgiven if they cannot acknowledge the wrong they did or are unable to understand that they did something wrong. To me someone saying that they forgave so and so for what they did without that person asking to be forgiven is not true forgiveness. Often it is turning the other cheek and not holding a grudge against them for what they have done. It is accepting that they did the action and moving on with your life. My mother is incapable of understanding that she has done wrong, therefore she can't ask for nor can I forgive her. I can only heal myself and move on to better myself and my own life.

I agree entirely, Amyrinpa. When I have made mistakes or hurt people (without meaning to), I have addressed my behaviour and have apologised to the person concerned - people who are abusive have no interest in making amends for their behaviour.

i have issues too, madtraveller, as my mum all my way through life she has never bothered to bond with me, and holidays are non existant, anytime she did take me was to her family to punish me some more. i feel she has mega issues within herself... yeah i know that but why cant she seek help. there are soo many people who need help out there without realising.

anyway my mum is an alcholic and she is a heavy smoker. shes not the happy drunk she is cold tough and mean... her eyes blaze and picks fights puts me down and does not want to know me. anything i do get from her its like A BIG deal. like she offered to buy me a leather bag for my birthday right... i say yes because well i have everything i need. so she buys it and liturally had to bitch about the price then accuse me of being rough with the handbag at the store. coz it has magnetic clips so u kinda do have to pull it open)

i do my best to forget and move on but is difficut when she keeps hurting me and having not much to do with me.

HELLO,YES IT IS STRESSFULL TO HAVE TO DEAL WITH SOMEONE ADDICTED TO DRINK, THEIR VISION BECAMES DISTORTED BY THE ALCOHOL, IT AFFECTS THEIR BRAIN, I AM SORRY THAT YOU HAVE SUCH A SITUATION WITH YOUR MUM, WHAT CAN YOU DO, POINT TO HER THE FACT, IT CHANGES ONES PERSONALITY, UNDER THE INFLUENCE THEY BECAME AGGRESSIVE, YOU NEED TO DECIDE WHAT IS BEST FOR YOU AND NOT PUT UP WITH HER, WE CANNOT TAKE SOMEONE ELSE BAG OF PROBLEMS, I HOPE YOU LOOK FOR YOURSELF ,AND MAKE A GOOD LIFE FOR YOURSELF, LOVE LUCY.

I agree with JOYGOY you can try to tell a person, including your mother, what bothers you about them with saying "I don't like it if you...", but we don't have magic wands to change them. It would be so nice to have a "magic wand", I would use mine all day long. Focus on your own life and make the best of it, otherwise their bad habits and behaviour will destroy your life. All of us women on this board have been hurt and dramatized by our mothers and reality is the majority of our mothers will not change. So love yourself and live your life, because I surely don't want to become like my mother. Adios, enchanting123

Some people do not want to help themselves and there is nothing you can do about it. I have an auntie who is bi-polar, has a drink dependency, anxiety, agraphobic and a chain-smoker. She is house-bound and lives a very miserable and depressing life based on routine and repetition. Any attempts at intervention in the past have been met with hostility and obstinance from her.

The only postitive thing about her situation is that I see the influence my grandma has had in her demise. Like my mother, my grandmother opted to abuse her vulnerable child for selfish reasons: the simple reason of not being alone and not having the social skills to go and meet a partner to fulfil their needs. I am pleased I have seen this as I know to keep well away from my mother as she ages...

I would have limited contact with your mother if you can. You may be in a co-dependent relationship with your mother and this needs to stop.