Spellcheck messed up my sentences but I hope you understand what I wrote.

It is very easy for other's, including your brother, to judge you and say that you are not a 'good Christian' because of your daughter ... they have not walked in your shoes and cannot see your heart.

Remember Job? His wife told him to just die already (paraphrasing) ... He lost his children, and yet Job was righteous. Billy Graham's son was a prodigal for a number of years ... and what about Adam and Eve? God put them in a beautiful garden and yet they sinned against God and they walked in the cool of the evening and talked with God ....

I liked what Ruth Graham Bell said: "Dear God, tell them YOU had trouble with YOUR children too!" I would recommend getting her book, "Prodigals and those who love them" ... she has several poems who speak of those who judge you like this.

It isn't you ... it's unfortunately a very common thing .... Perhaps your brother will not be a support for you in this estrangement ... that's okay ... not everyone can handle it or say the right thing in every circumstance. It is what it is .... He may be a great guy in ever other area ... I'd just maybe not talk to him about the estrangement right now.... You need support right now, not judgment.

If you daughter is an adult, she is responsible for her poor choices and her life, not you. Sounds like you were a great mom ... and Christians are not exempt from this kind of thing ... In fact, I think Satan works overtime to destroy and deceive our kids. We can do battle in prayer ... Remember He is on our side ... and that's really all we need! HUGS AND HANG IN THERE ... I will be praying that God will surround you people who will support you through this time.

Difficulttime, thank you! My brother isn't judging me as a mom. He has no doubt that I was wonderful to my daughter and that I don't deserve her treatment. He's judging my reaction. He's quoted every scripture you can think of as to why I should have joy and not be suffering. God forgive me but I am so fed up with the church and their self righteous judgement. He's told me that I attract this kind of stuff because I have abandonment issues after I lost my dad when I was 12. Do all of you have abandonment issues? The only person I had who didn't judge me and understood me was a friend who just died of cancer a few weeks ago :( I feel lonely. My brother told me that people don't like to be around someone who is down. I can't tell you how that made me feel. Not only do I feel alone but I should also feel guilty for suffering. He told me that if I'm not willing to leave everybody, including my daughter, for God then I'm not worthy of Him :( I'll search for Ruth Graham's writings.

tooheartbroken, did your brother chastise you for grieving when your husband died for your having no joy then too?!? Because from my perspective, you're experiencing a different kind a grief over a loss than the kind you had with the death of your husband, but it's a loss nonetheless. An estrangement from a child is a kind of death; in a way, it's a death of one of the most important relationships that you ever have in a lifetime.

I know it's easier said than done, but when your brother says something about your lack of joy, tell yourself that he just doesn't and can't understand your pain, because he doesn't. As a pastor he has to sympathize with much, but I doubt he'd tell someone who just lost their child to actual death to "find their joy in the suffering," because he understands what a physical and emotional loss that truly is. He probably just can't grasp that your estrangement brings a depth of pain that's just as intense.

While I don't know your brother, it angers me that he says you're not worthy of God if you're not willing to let everyone go. NONE of us is worthy - that's the point of God's grace. Nothing we can do earns us the love of God; it's only because of His mercy and grace that we are redeemed. So don't let your brother dictate how you feel and act when he says things like that to you!!! . Every time he says something similar, remind yourself that he has no right to judge you for how you feel and behave because he isn't walking in your shoes!

Hugs and prayers to you tooheartbroken! I'm praying for you, and like difficulttime, I'm praying that God will bring others into your life that understand and will support you!

It is so true. You are grieving. There is no timetable on it. It seems like your brother is concerned for you. I had a father like that. Out of love (the way he knew how) he wanted us to pick up and keep moving for our own good. The loss of a child either through death or estrangement is a deep loss. Jesus is our true and only comfort. Seek Him each day. He is with you. We can move forward with Him one step at a time. Good people in this life suffer. We do not understand His ways but we can trust Him. It does not mean we would have chosen some of the things that come our way. One day we may understand.

We are here for you. We care about you and we understand your grief.

I am so sorry for you. The same thing happened to my cousin. Lost her husband when her daughter was only 14. Daughter acted out, etc. My cousin waited patiently for her return and when she had her own child, she grew up and they are now close.

There is a wonderful Christian website "Praying for Prodicals" that I am on, even though my ES is now back in my life. If you can't find it, I'll look to find the link.

"Let go and let God" - the hardest thing to do. Stay close to those you love and who love you. God is at work and it is all in his timing. Praying for you.

You have a lot going on and my deepest sympathies on the loss of your friend. When I lost my kindred spirit friend I was such a mess for so long. And, although friends are often closer than family, people don't recognize the death of our friends or the grief we are suffering. I isolated for a long time and only in the last year have I, slowly, been cultivating some new friendships, but I am very guarded.

I believe my friend's death seriously added to the feelings I already had regarding my estrangement. I really didn't talk to anyone except my dh about my feelings and there wasn't much he could do. But at least I could trust him and he would listen and certainly not give me negative feedback. He knew better than preach to me or give me verses I already knew. I just needed to be lifted up in prayer and it was between me and God.

I just had this conversation with someone in church this morning. I told her just because someone is a pastor, pastor's wife, elder, etc. does not mean they are qualified to give counsel. We need to pray and use discernment. If someone is talking to you and you are not feeling God's love coming through, then it probably isn't the best person to confide in. And I do not mean go to someone who will just tell you that you are totally right, etc., but someone that is solid, mature and, most of all, someone that God brings into your life. If nothing else, try a reputable Christian counselor (who has good references). They will also be more objective than your brother. I am sure his intent is good but it doesn't sound like he should counsel you through this.

And, the Bible tells us we WILL have trials, not "when". There are many Godly people who put God first and go thru much suffering. And Jesus "wept".

Joy doesn't necessarily mean "happy". We have God's joy or assurance of our salvation which is always constant but we experience grief, sadness, loneliness, betrayal (just as our Savior did). I don't want to go off on a tangent but lately I have had to stop well-meaning Christians as they would begin their judgment of someone. And I really do STOP them, and I am not interested in their titles. Our job is to love them as Jesus instructed us to do. As I always say, He will do the rest. Not our job.

Prayers for peace and wisdom and strength, my sister.

Thank you Ironcowgirl! You saved me time writing. This morning I wrote a reply almost identical to yours, but my internet suddenly went down and was unable to send. I came back to write again, but there isn't much I can add to what you have written.
Tooheartbroken - I am sorry this has happened to you and makes me angry that others especially ministers, pastors can be so callous and judgmental. You are not alone. It happened to me also. We have to be on guard and be careful who we share with. That is why this site is such a blessing. We all know too well what you are going through and we feel your pain.
We were made in the image of God. Like Ironcowgirl said, even Jesus wept and in the temple, he got angry. Even Job had pity parties. Alll showing emotions which God gave us.
Know that God understands and he will make a way for you.

No, I don't think your brother is right. He does not understand the pain you are in, but we do. I hope the love and wisdom in these responses are of some comfort. Prayers are with you.

1. Job lost everything, did he deserve it? NO, he put God first and was still in turmoil, but God eventually restored him. He didn't sin against God and he didn't lose it all for not putting God first, he had to go through things and God made things better.

2. John was in prison, he put God first. Wine and a seductive dance later and the king sent for his head. Was he made free? No, because it took his death so that Jesus could do something greater. Did he put God first? Yes, but he had to wait until after death to be rewarded for that.

Those are just 2 examples. It is true that we have to put God first, but bad things happening in our lives isn't an indication that we are being punished or that we haven't put him first. The bible is full of stories where someone faced harsh things, despite putting God first. Lack of faith is not the reason for estrangement or heart breaking circumstances.

I find comfort in your responses and it helps to feel understood. Each one of you added something of value. I went to 2 Christian counselors. Both quoted scriptures, just like my brother so it didn't help. Only someone who has walked in our shoes truly understands. I even took my daughter after her father passed away. The minute she opened up and shared her anger and grief, the therapist Pekin to talk to her about forgiveness. I couldn't believe that she didn't take time to validate her feelings. I've mentioned all the people in the Bible who put God first and still suffered, but my brother doesn't get it. It's exhausting and I feel angry. My other brother doesn't even want to hear about it anymore. Nobody does. They all have a quick fix...make yourself happy, stop thinking about it, don't worry she'll be back, move on, she chose it not you, blah blah. In other words, I'm making a big deal over it. I choose to suffer. I get that from believers and nonbelievers alike. I appreciate your feedback so much. It helps to know that I'm not crazy or a drama queen as they make it seem which makes me feel even worse. Thank God for this group and for the love. Sending lots of love back!

I think it's hard sometimes for family members because they don't like to see their loved ones suffer. No one can truly give advice in this situation. You have to live it to know what it's like. Before my exED estranged my friend's daughter estranged. I told her, "Don't worry, she'll be back." I couldn't understand. I saw their relationship. They used to be so close. When it happened to me I apologized to her. You don't understand the pain until it happens to you.

You're so right, Feeling. Until we walk in somebody's exact shoes we don't really understand. Our family doesn't like to see us suffer because of how it makes them feel. I don't think that they're thinking about how we feel. I'm glad that you reconciled as the exED indicated :)

I think sometimes people are made too uncomfortable by the pain/situations of others that their answers are more to get you to stop telling them about it. There aren't a lot of genuinely compassionate people in the world, even our families, and I think hearing about painful situations just makes them feel too helpless to fix it so they offer bad advise that isn't helpful. Advise that feels more like, "stop telling me about it" than, "it'll get better". And the only thing we can do is honor their unspoken wishes to not talk to them about it and seek support from others going through the same thing. Until it happens to them, everyone assumes that estrangement is either a simple argument and cooling off spell or that if it is long term that it is justified, often neither of those things are true. Lean on the ones who have been there and don't talk about it to those who could never understand.

You're so right Lucy. As we navigate this painful rollercoaster ride of estrangement we learn a number of things and I guess it depends on the stage that we were at. I'm finally accepting but those who haven't been through it or are currently going through it don't have a clue and can't or won't want to deal with it. At least consistently the way we do. Even though God tells us in the Bible to bare one another's burdens, I guess that most people choose to not read that scripture. In general most people suffer in silence no matter what they're going through. The new motto now is to stay away from people who are negative or have drama. So much for love and support