Amen! Amen! Amen!

I needed this word and I thank you that you allowed God to speak to me through you. I had a brief text conversation with my son this week that made me aware that our DIL still does not want us in their lives.

I am not giving up!

oldandbroken (you sure don't sound it), I especially love the line, "Is this how the Lord wants it between mother and child?" (and families). I wonder how our EC would answer this question if they were asked it especially if they ever professed to be a Christian.

Your words speak how my heart has felt for these last seven years of estrangement with my only daughter...thank you for sharing.

forgottenmom This is something that I am beginning to grappel with. In your case it would seem that your daughter in law is the one causing the estrangement. But I am beginning to realize that it is my son who has turned everyone against his parents with his lies. He always kept his first girlfriend away from us, always wanted to be with her family. I thought this was because of their attitudes, and I still believe he sought out bad company. But now I am seeing how he is turning his current girlfriend against us too.

When I first met her, she seemed very friendly. But now she seems to be becoming more and more estranged along with him. I wonder what he is telling her. She loves him and wants to please him and so she is rejecting us also. I am beginning to see that it was my son all along. Now he is gravitating toward her family only and ignoring us completely. Why? Because we know too much? Is he in that much denial? Again I am going through a time of sorrow realizing that the one who has really stabbed me in the back is my own dear baby boy.

I may not sound old (65 y/o) and broken (into a gazillion pieces), single Mom of a now 26 y/o beautiful daughter who married a nonbeliever and after 1 1/2 years of marriage, he has has finally succeeded in getting her to turn her back on me. I said (he) referring to my son-in-law but I have come to the realization the "he" is really the devil himself. I have been crawling on my belly like a snake, writhing in unspeakable pain - physical burning, pressing pain in my chest feeling like someone is steading pounding on my heart with a meat cleaver while having weighed me down with concrete shoes, shaking, crying uncontrollably, feeling like I will drown, at times even asking the Lord to take me - just to get out from under this indescribable pain in my heart.

It has been so bad the last few days that I have been praying even more since sleep escapes me, I'm hungry but have no appetite, crying until it feels like my eyes will fall out their sockets. Night before last, I laid down in the wee hours of the morning to make a futile attempt at sleep and told the Lord that He and I needed to have a serious conversation and so we did. I cried on His shoulder and begged like a child, I questioned what I had ever done so wrong to deserve what I am now going through, I told Him I couldn't take this anymore, that I felt afraid and asked His forgiveness, and this conversation went on until I finally fell asleep.

Yesterday, still in the midst of all the same feelings and torturous nonstop thoughts, other thoughts start coming into my head like little zaps of electricity out of the blue -
* be anxious for nothing but in all things give thanks ...
* I will never leave you or forsake you ...
* Lean not unto thine own understanding but trust the Lord ...
* Yeah, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death ... THEN

* Rebuke the devil and he will flee from you
* Plead the blood of Jesus
* Be strong in the Lord and in the power of HIS might (not mine)
* Cover yourself with the shield of faith
* You are snared by the words of your mouth

Okay, Lord, I'm listening, I will pay attention. I will ignore what I see, feel, and think and will focus only on Your Word. I will fight to win. I will run the race to get my prize, just like Your Word says.

So, yes, I am old and broken, holding on by a thread, still having all of the feelings as I spoke of above but now determined to fight the good fight of faith and win. The Lord gave me my daughter to start with, I have been praying for her feverishly, and now, honestly, I'm having a recurring thought -- you ask ME for help, pray without ceasing, don't you trust ME??? That thought took me to the scripture that speaks to casting down every imagination that contradicts the Word of God, to many more scriptures. I know my Bible, I love the Lord, He has never failed me or dropped the ball, then bam, the bulb went off.

Our God is a supernatural God. He parted the Red Sea, He fed five thousand with how many fish and a loaf of bread? Oh Ye of little faith. Will worrying change one hair on my head? No, yet the Lord knows the very number of hairs on my head. He loves me, then why?? Why? Because I have allowed the devil to captivate my thoughts, to be in control. Do I not believe that the Lord Himself can right this wrong and bring love and harmony between me and my own flesh?

His Word is very clear that we are in the last days and teaches us that men will be boastful and proud, lovers of money, fathers will be against sons, daughters against mothers, there will be wars and rumors of wars, famine, and disease. I knew this. I have read these scriptures time and again. Do I believe God or do I believe the world? I choose to believe God. How can we have faith, yet doubt? The Bible says "a double-minded man is unstable in all his ways and should not think that he will get anything from the Lord." I can't ask GOD for something and then doubt that he will give it to me. If one of our children brought us something to fix and the moment we went to fix it, they grabbed it back from us, how could we fix it? Same with God. We seemingly give him our problems but continue to try and solve them ourselves, taking the problem back out of His hands and into our own. I don't mean to sound like I'm preaching, really, my keyboard is a comfort where I can just let it all out and if any of my thoughts help any of you, then that's just extra whip cream on the frapuccino.

I will be praying for all of you and ask that you please pray for me. I think we should all be reading our Bibles more than ever before, praying for one another, filling our minds with God's words instead of continuing to listen to the devil - easier said than done, I know - but we have a weapon, a mighty weapon in the blood of Jesus - we have to fight the good fight of faith and believe that no weapon formed against us shall prosper.

As for how would our children respond to the question - is this how the Lord wants it? - they would avoid the question. They know in their hearts they are wrong in the stand they have taken against us, but they are in the "world", in the middle of unbelievers, listening to and believing the lies the devil is putting in their heads and giving them through other people. Prophecy, it's coming down the pike.

Thank you oldandroken. Sometimes I think that's what life is all about, getting to the point where we are old and broken. After all, our children are young and prideful and it doesn't seem to be doing their hearts a whole lot of good.

Tikva, I know that the estrangement is relatively new, and you are still in differing stages of grief and loss. Accepting a broken bond of love is terribly grievous to a mother. I have been through every emotion, the bewilderment, the denial, the absolute devastation, the questioning, the bargaining, the anger, and on and on. They are not clear cut stages nor in a certain order, or with clear beginning and ending dates, nor do 2 people grieve alike. I asked "WHY??" for a long time, and "HOW??". You may never know the exact detailed specific reasons, who is most at fault, for what reason, how is it possible, etc. I still don't, but it doesn't matter much to me now, so many years and so much energy spent. The solution is what matters, and I totally agree with oldandbroken, it's a battle with evil. Maybe our Christian children were targeted, likely don't you think? Maybe that is God's way of getting human fighters on His side, by letting the enemy snare their children? What matters is the solution, and the only weapon we have that I know of is prayer.

I don't think it's your son's "fault", but even if it is, it's a victory for satan. It's no victory for your son. Every broken bond of love is a victory for satan. This is a spiritual battle, LOVE against hatred. Your son is a casualty of this WAR, as most of the world's population is---people are easy prey to the luring calls of DARKNESS--people naturally choose darkness over Light. People remember the dirt on someone and aren't nearly as interested in knowing anything good about them. How often do people stand up for what is RIGHT? Not in my family, evil that dangles the carrot of a large inheritance, is so powerful that no one dares stand up to it, because if you do, not only do you lose the inheritance, but she will DESTROY you in all wordly ways! She cannot get my soul, that's why I won't harbor bitterness toward anyone. I can lose all, and I mostly have, of earthly things, but my soul is mine and Darkness won't ever get it.

Pleae remember this is a spiritual battle, and the battle is age old, it's escalating, but it's not a new battle. It's not about personalities, but about Principalities, though it's very easy to take it personally. I did for the first 10-11 years or so. When you get a bigger picture, by stepping back a little, and the emotions calm down, you can clearly see the spiritual battle raging.

I don't mean to try to cut short or change your process of grieving, but blaming your son is just eating out of satan's hand, exactly what he wants. He loves hurt and wounded people, and broken bonds of love. Your son is a casualty, not a perpetrator. JMO, but shared in love I've been there and know what you're feeling. The most effective prayer for me: "Please show me how to love and forgive as You do". Forgiveness and love are the greatest tools which will empower you to help your son and the side of God. Love can wipe out the hurt, and without the hurt, your son will actually be drawn back to you, this is my instinct on it.

lindajoan, I did ask my once very committed Christian ED, just a few months ago, about her relationship with God, after asking her to pray for the family, because some very dark things are going on in "the family" (long story). And she angrily said "do you think I'd want to share something like that with you?!" And I had my answer. I've known the answer for a long time, I just didn't ask, I was walking on eggshells, so as to win favor, so as to see myGC more. Hate doesn't so-exist with love.

I am certin that my ED doesn't pray and that her relationship with God is NOT right now. If she were to pray, it would be in conflict with the offense, blaming and bitterness that she needs in order to maintain the estrangement.

oldandbroken, how wonderful it is to see a poster who writes as much as I do! At least I don't stand out as much this way.

We have much in common. A single parent, a Christian ED, well one EC is (was) a Christian. I heard so many of my own words and details of my story in what you wrote. I felt for several years i was hanging onto life by a thread, and had no connection to anybody. It was by default not choice that I turned to God for dear life. I think that there is a hidden trap for single parents, that in our over developed sense of responsibility, being two parents in one, we may unknowingly develop an inordinate affection for or attachment to our child, or children, and God doesn't like it--it's too much, it looks like idoltry, our child comes first before God. This is what I found with myself anyhow. I was cured of this by losing them, and having to make Him number one. Because I see this, I think that most of the battle is won--I'm just waiting on His timing. I think that my EC have important things to learn, that are in God's purpose for their lives, and I know that He will not cut short their lessons to deliver them back to me on my timing.

I also was writing to you as well in what I wrote to Tikva, above. It is a spiritual battle, as it always has been, but is escalating.

I feel very much for your suffering which is so raw with the wound being so fresh. It's an intense betrayal to lose a child, I think more so for a single parent because a single parent parents for two. And so having to pour more of oneself into that child, to compensate for the other parent's absence. More invested and a more pulverizing loss. I felt pulverized, that was the best word I could find. Thanks for your post, and keep praying with that solid faith, and know He IS there, and will deliver you from this, just as promised! I know He will, and I pray He will ease your great agony, I feel it in your writing.

oldandbroken I believe you are right. Our EC would avoid the question of "Do you think this estrangement is pleasing to the Lord? They know the answer. I would still love to hear our ED's answer to it since she professes to be a Christian who honors God.

Forever Our ED has text back (in the past) similar things. Any time an EC is confronted with what they perceive to be a guilt trip or something to be accountable for they run. They only want affirmation in their defiance, not truth.

PRAYER is truly our only defense. We are in a spiritual battle. God is not finished, yet!!

Nothing or no one has ever come before the Lord for me, not even my daughter because without Him, I wouldn't have her and feel she is the biggest blessing in my life, even in the midst of this turmoil and angst. I do appreciate your prayers -- please keep praying for me and my daughter. I don't believe it is the Lord's will that any of us should be apart from our children, rather I believe the devil is a busy guy and will devour whoever he can. In my case, my daughter marrying this nonbeliever made her an easy mark.

Thank you.

I need to reflect on this often.

oldandbroken, I think many non-believers love their children very deeply. Loving a child too much is hard to detect --- it's subtle.

As with Job in the Bible, God allowed evil to have his way in Job's life. The council given by Job's friends sounded wise and reasonable to me, but God was not pleased with their council. God had His reasons, and us humans could never fathom those reasons. We're told to never try to understand the mind of God because it isn't possible. And to never judge situations because we aren't aware of the true picture God sees. I have seen some extremely surprisingly good come out of this disastrous and pulverizing LOSS, the pain being so severe I was sure it would kill off my body--and wished it would sometimes, I must admit.

It's unavoidable to question God, to ask why, to suffer beyond the imaginable. I suffered terribly for many years. The answer to my constant prayers, wails, and rivers of tears, was very slow in coming, and came in unexpected ways. The answers and relief began only after I had exhausted every possible attempt at reconciliation that I could think of, read or ask about, (about 10 years later) when there was no choice but to give up and told God it was all His. I surrendered and "let go" something that was impossible for years. One day I noticed that my pain seemed to be gone, and I knew it wasn't anything I'd done. My children aren't back, my GC aren't back, and I accept that I may never have them back on this earth. The amazing thing is that that idea was okay with me, that's God's grace. That would have never been an acceptable idea, my plan was to enjoy my children and grandchildren all of the rest of my life and savor every memory. I am certain that He will transform all my pain and grief into something better than what I lost.

It's an anguishing situation, I wouldn't wish this kind of pain on anyone. Trust in God and PRAY, that's my advice.

oldandbroken....First let me say...Welcome to the group!

I just want to add that I really like what you said in your post about...."What is the point to read the Bible, study the scriptures, and profess your faith in the Lord if you are so willing to throw in the towel."

So true. So true.