autumnwind - your story is so similar to mine. Except our DIL suffers from NPD. It is terrible. Our ES was raised in a loving home but when they got together, she made it her mission that our son was to have nothing to do with us. She succeeded. It has been 6+ years and we have a 3 yr old GD.

I find myself praying for them daily. My prayer for them is that God just squeeze the hate out of their hearts and replace it with love and forgiveness. My son was raised in a Christian home; DIL says she doesn't believe. I am not sure if he attends church or has GD in Sunday School.

Pray for your daughter - AND her husband. When someone suffers from NPD, about the only thing that can change them is God. I will be praying for you and your family.

Autumnwind, welcome! You will find spiritual warmth from these members. My prayers are that your daughter and GD will be safe and eventually be able to again have a relationship with you. Many of our ECs have controlling others in their lives and unfortunately they do not realize how much harm they are doing by allowing this type of abuse to continue. This week is the week of the Epiphany in church; we remember that Jesus came to us as one of us. That God was able to lead the Gentiles to the Christ surely must offer us hope where there seems there is none. God's ways are not our ways; in this difficult time may you find some comfort and hope in knowing that you have given your ED the knowledge of God and she has Him to guide her when you cannot be there with her.

Autumnwind, we welcome you to this community of those who seek refuge in the Lord. All of us have "lost" someone dear to us and place our faith in God that He will lead them back onto the path of love and righteousness. We trust that our children cannot have forgotten all that we have done for them and all that they mean to us. When God leads them back along the path of salvation we will find them once again. In the meantime, all we can do is love them and have faith in God. Your son in law has no power to make you love your daughter and grandchild any less. In the end, the love from you and your husband will prevail over any negativity that SIL can muster. By the way, unless someone is in the police witness protection program or such, they cannot simply move away and drop off the map. A simple $30 people finder fee can locate them by their names and previous addresses. Private detectives can also locate people very easily. So your SIL's threats to hide from you are just simple-minded. You have more power than you realize but be careful how you utilize it. Patience is a virtue. My very best wishes to you and family -- EJ

You are not alone, and like everyone else here, we understand what you are experiencing emotionally.

We all know how it feels to be rejected by our adult child who we will always love in spite of their rejecting behavior.

I will pray for your estranged daughter, as it appears from what you've shared that she is being manipulated and bullied by her husband. Not the healthiest place for your grandchild to have to live out her childhood. May the Lord protect all of our grandchildren who are unfairly being denied the influence of loving grandparents in their lives. My ES also has been married for 6 years...interestingly, he has a 2 year old child that we are not allowed to see...not even any photos!

Someday, we will find out from God the reasons we have to endure this emotional and mental pain, but for now, we must find our comfort and strength in His love. This place is a safe place to share and many of us have found others with similar family estrangements. We hope we can help you get through this difficult period in your life.

I know that I've found tremendous encouragement here over the past year and a half...almost two years now. I first found this place when my estrangement was only in the first three months...now going on for almost two years.

We can pray...we must pray for all our children. They belong to God, and He knows their hearts. My ES has to turn back to God. Only then will he be able to eventually find his way back to a healthier relationship with us. Cutting God out of his life invites such unnecessary heartache..to himself and to those of us who love him. My faith is tested by this estrangement, however, I can rest assure that God is in control and that He is very well aware of the current break in our family..and all of the families represented here on this forum.

May the Lord give us wisdom and courage to endure. He is close to us, the brokenhearted parents...
Praying for you,
Maddie

autumnwind, I am thankful that you were led here. Many of us have found a safe haven here and others who understand.

I found this place almost 2 years ago when our 22 year old ED left home with a bf and his enabling father. There have been 2 years worth of enablers by now and a different bf. Our ED has no desire to see any family and is surrounded by controlling people who discourage family contact even though she lives nearby. It makes you sad what the enemy can do. It is against God's ways.

I pray that your ED and gc will remain safe and one day have contact with you again. We pray that for all of our EC.

Autumn wind, I too wonder if my daughter has narcissistic personality.
Or just plain mean.

Wow...Your story is so much like mine, right down to the details. My ED though has older kids and she is already starting to experience the misery we went though with her in her teen years. Would never wish it on her but it what comes around goes around. Her mind is so twisted she will be lucky to ever get it straightened out, but I pray every day that she does.

Keep reading this site and it will help; we are all in this together and there is a common thread that runs through all our stories. We live in a time where our children's thinking has been scrambled by the principalities and powers, the rulers of this world of darkness. Prayer is our only recourse.

Friends, I wonder if part of our problem is that we have always taken on our children's problems as our own. When they were children, we did this without even thinking about it, and it was the right thing to do. It shows what wonderful parents we were. But when they become adults they must throw off the things of youth. We must step back and allow them to do this. They have to make their own choices now, for better or for worse. When we try to intervene to keep them from hurting themselves now, they will not appreciate it. In fact, it may cause resentment. They must find their own paths and allow God into their own hearts. We cannot do this for them. As they become filled with the spirit of God's love, the immaturity, pettiness, and resentment in their hearts will be stripped away from their spirits - just as we seek to do in our lives. In this way, they become forgiving of themselves and others. Only God's love can have this kind of profound impact on their hearts. We must give our children time and space to come to Jesus. Blessings to all -- EJ.

Autumn....I think you have gotten some great advice here. EJ's reply #3 has some excellent advice for you. Although you may be limited in what you can do, you are not powerless. It is your daughter that has to take back her self before she can have the courage to walk away from her narc husband. Having had a child unfortunately is going to make it even harder to do because, from what I have learned about it, (yep, DIL is too) standing your ground with a narcissistic over a subject it's a Mexican standoff. Our DIL uses the "you must support me" as her key to getting our son to conform. The narcissist will NEVER back down until they brainwash the other person into their beliefs and if that doesn't work with certain individuals the narcissist can make life miserable for them. Narcissists are high in ego and plain bullies even though our DIL does it in a subtler manner.

Narc people watch for weaknesses and then use those weaker points of others to gain control. Narcissistic people are just sneaky and like to brain-wash those around them into thinking they are more clever than they are.

By your ED submitting her needs to her narc husband, she puts herself into a position whereby she feels the need to defend his behavior just like our son has defend some of the most ridiculous logic she has used against us. In doing so, psychologically, my son and your ED in essence has found their way of being able to survive living with the narc spouse. They have been taught that to resist brings serious consequences. In order to survive they will become just as dishonest and yet be in complete denial that they are enablers. Our son and your ED, most likely can no longer "see" that they no longer have control of their lifves because, after confoming, their life seems "normal" and "peaceful". So now they feel the necessity to become the "protector" of the abuser.

From what I have read, there are two levels of narcissim - low level and high level. My DIL I would say is a low level but your SIL sounds like a High level due to the threats. A High level narc can do physical harm to others. Since you have an attorney, you might ask him to write a letter to your SIL, informing him that there are serious concerns about your DIL and that if anything should ever happen to her in any way, the police will be notified immediately that he should be investigated as the primary suspect. That may cause him to think twice before he does anything. Also, you could hire a detective to find out if he has a criminal record. That could get "passed on" to your ED through another individual if necessary.

Lasty, there is a good book out called 'Narcissism: Behind the Mask' that might be of help to you.

Please keep us posted? We do care about you, and your family here.

Guels thank you so much for this info. You describe my DIL to a tee. I believe she is like your DIL and is low level. She is sly like a fox. We have never had as much as cross word to each other yet we are estranged for things we are supposed to have done that hurt her. We have been told what those things are and they are ridiculous. We feel powerless because our son is powerless; or at least he feel that he is. I think his life is exactly like you describe - seems "normal" and "peaceful". In the meantime, our lives are devastated. Our son is our only child.

My dear friends, have we considered that the perpetrators do not care that their reasons for estrangement are ridiculous, and that their true reasons likely have nothing to do with us? This approach fits the narcs very well. They have their own ulterior motives for complete control and we stand in the way of that conquest. If our children support this behavior we have limited options but we are not powerless. Do no underestimate the power of love. Show them love at every opportunity that you get, but without making them feel that we are butting in or "telling them what to do." It hurts not to be included when we should be, but the holiday cards and gifts, emails and texts, appropriate phone calls, inquiries from friends, coworkers, etc. will have a cumulative impact over the months and years. God is working in their lives whether they recognize it or not.

Thank you EJ - what great advice and reminder. I believe that anything we say can be misconstrued, especially by an in-law and one who has NPD. We just have to believe that God is working behind the scenes.

I am learning a lot about the narc. Our ED has mental issues and this may be a secondary problem. I do agree that our EC whatever their particular problem have one thing in common. My DH and I have always believe that there was an agenda to be had. Our ED had an agenda of freedom and a bf. For some it may be peace with their spouse. How sad for us and them that the agenda could not be one that is of God. By that I mean Peace with one another. We want it and we can continue to prayer that one day they will want it too.