I guess the reason it upsets me so much, is because I was finally able to come up with the words to really express why it bothers me. I think in the long run, it is good, but I am thinking it probably upsets me that I can come up with an explanation, a valid explanation and I can't always get that from my husband.

alexnd, I hope your day gets better. I know exactly what you're talking about. I asked for details and I got them. The intimacy they had kills me inside every time I think about it. There are days that I can't get them out of my mind. It hurts to know that what you once did between just the two of you...they did. I wish I had some way to help you feel better. I'm sorry you're hurting today.

When my husband and I had the "big talk", when he answered all my questions about his A, I was also really hurt that he had performed oral sex on her. She did not do it on him. While it killed me inside that he had the A to begin with (they had a 12 month emotion affair, then a 12 month physical affair, always going to her home at lunch time. they were together probably 15 times)

My husband has always really enjoyed giving oral sex. It hurt so badly that he shared that with her, and as we've been rebuilding (I've known for 15 months), I'm still hesitant to allow him to give me oral sex. He knows it bothers me, and is always patient.

We've been through counseling, he's gone by himself too, as have I. It takes a ton of time, total committment, total honesty, and completely cutting off contact with the OW. My husband has gone over and above what he needs to do to rebuild. We've come a long way, especially in the past 6 months.

My husband and the OW had connected over some mutual pain, it started as a friendship, and grew into some real emotional feelings for each other. I understand why it happened because I know how horrible things were here at the time. (we had a terrible family issue we were both trying to avoid) But that emotional involvement just makes the whole thing worse.

That said, I don't think I would feel any better about it had it been just "sex with no touching and leaving their clothes on..." That just seems sleezy and if I thought he was capable of that, I would really question our connection and relationship. If he had been able to USE someone that way, well, that would really bother me.

I've been here on DS for over 2 yrs. now..... New Years was d-day for me 2 yrs. ago....
And... I think this issue of crossing the line is why I have been here struggling for such a long time...
My husband has done everything right since d-day...immediately broke it off with the OW...zero contact since then...IC.... Marriage counseling... He has been completely open with cell phone/computer etc., he stopped drinking and attends AA regularly...2 yrs. now....he treats me like a queen..everyday... flowers, gifts, lots of remorse etc.
so...why can't I get over it already?

It's because he crossed so...... many lines during the affair....
so many things that I thought would be deal breakers for me... and yet here I still am... well, to be honest, I did kick him out and file for divorce initially, basically had a nervous breakdown, stayed separated for 6 months, and then reconciled....so it wasn't like I just ignored it all.... but... whenever I read other's opinions on what constitutes crossing the line...going too far to be forgiven...nothing seems to close to what my husband did....

so what's wrong with me? I ask myself....


my husband was a functional alcoholic (still not an excuse) and had a 5 year long affair with a married office slut....not months....years....
and... eventhough this woman's behavior gave a clue that she was very experienced he didn't use any protection ever....
turns out that I later find out that this woman has been having affairs with married co-workers for 30 years! (yes, she was no spring chicken)....she would do things like flash her breasts at co-workers during the day (in a very professional office), but my husband didn't think for a minute that this woman who would drink so much that she would sometimes fall off of bar stools would ever be with anyone but him and her husband during those years.
I ended up getting three bacterial infections during that time period...now I know why....
what did my husband do with her? what didn't he do? she was into kinky sex.... half of their encounters involved drinking after work and then her giving him a BJ in his car in the parking lot while other co-workers were still inside! That happened maybe 40-50 times in 5 years.... nice, huh?
I never sat in that car again after finding out...my husband sold it last year and took my car and bought me the most expensive car I've ever owned...a BMW.... nice car butstill not that much comfort in that...

they saw each other at work...she would ingratiate herself into his crowd and be the only female at lunch,drinks, etc...

they went away on work related trips... some as long as 4 days... and they slept together in the same bed..all night long...and then they would have breakfast together... they took showers together, baths... but he insists that she meant nothing to him and he loved only me...

she was into writing very pornographic emails to him and he would answer the same ways... I eventually got copies of about 40 of them... no mention of lovee..that's true... but she talks about 'loving to s..k his c...k' and he called her gorgeous in one (she DEFINITELY is not)
and the kinky sex she was in to? S&M, spanking, a..l sex,getting tied up to bed posts, oral sex, you name it....

she would stalk him...he would go to a work conference that she wasn't involved in and she would show up at the hotel naked except for just a raincoat...and of course he would let her in...

we bought a new house... after our kids graduated from college...I thought it was our new beginning..due to problems we had been having with his bad moods, heavy drinking, depression, (I didn't realize those were symptoms of someone having an affair)...a month or so after we moved in.. I was so happy and excited ,decorating etc. she pushed her way into the house when another co-worker stopped by to see the place... I was at work... of course my husband let her in...and gave her a guided tour of my house...I had the OW peeking into my linene closets etc....
and... when my father passed away.... the OW came to my father's church funeral mass (right before the burial!) she sat in the back of the church, she never came up to me! My husband saw her...she told him she came to support him ! Bull! she came to show how powerful she was... that is what it is all about for female sex addicts...power... and she came to check out what the wife and kids looked like... what did my loving husband say to her? nothing...he told her it was weird to see her there...nothing more....

but he swears he loved only me and not her..that she meant nothing to him for 5 years....
oh yeah, i forgot.... he took early retirement from work but I wasn't invited to the luncheon ...why? because the OW organized it!
and... a month before this... my husband and I went to Atlantic City ..3 days later he made a reservation for the exact same hotel for the next month for 2 nights with the OW!

Oh... I have a ton of these stories.... do you think that maybe he crossed the line?
and of course..he never once tried to break it off with her until he got caught....


and that is why I still have huge doubts that I struggle with every day...

I try to pray for an answer and some wisdom but...

Hurting - Thank you so much for your responce and the hug! I did REALLY needed that!
Loving - I know! You are so right! My husband did use these people totally! It does bother me that he could use other people like this, but it is also comforting to me that he has no emotional attachment to them. His first affair was something he did because he had never been with anyone else before me. From the sounds of it though, she used him too. She was engaged at the time and had been married twice before. It sounds to me it was one last f@#$ before she settled down again.
The second one had a number a factors that were involved with it. My h became addicted to porn and chat rooms. That is were they met. The chatted a long time before she figured out who he was. Eventually, she begain to insinuate that she wouldn't do the online stuff forever, so my husband began to meet her. First for coffee, then for walks, a couple of make-out sessions and their final meeting for sex. He was never attracted to her, never got turned on by her. He said he would have to "fluff" himself before he met her to pass it off as something she had done. Their sexual meeting didn't really work - he could not get an erection. But thought he would make her while. He essentially whored himself out to feed his online addiction. It does bother me that he used these people like this. He built them up, made them feel good about themselves, made them feel special, all to gradify himself.

jrsy - I am so sorry all that happened to you. You do have a lot of strength to do what you are doing and sharing your story. You are right, where is that point of no return? Some stories seem worse than others, but I don't think there is anymore or anyless that could have been done for it to be a deal breaker. It just has to be a decision to make about whether you want to stay or go.

I think those lines get blurred when it happens to us... If you would have asked me 5 years ago if cheating was a deal breaker... I would have said yes.

I have the same thoughts about his "pleasuring her". For my H, it was not emotional but when it came out that he did oral, several months past d-day, I was taken back to the beginning. That is one of the things that I still struggle with in our relationship too. One of the things that helps is that she orgasmed in less than a minute. Yeah right... she was so inexperienced that I doubt she even knew what she was doing or feeling... She had been married for "26 years of hell" (her words) and her H didn't do that with her. In our one and only phone conversation she gloated that my H was sooooo good at it...

I wrote her a nine page letter a few months later and told her that everything he did with her, he learned with me and we've been doing it REGULARLY for the past 30 years. I also told her to look up womens orgasms online and pointed out that it takes much longer to reach a climax that a minute... Gave me some satisfaction to tell her that...

I also got a bacterial infection, non specific cause, my flora and fauna was messed up. My H didn't use protection either because of the fact that she was newly divorced... WHAT AN IDIOT! It bothers me that he was sooooooo stupid. She may or may not have had sex with her phantom boyfriend?!?! He doesn't know, he never asked?!?!? I do know that she would complain to my H that her "boyfriend" wouldn't do anything with her while she was married. She told him that months before he started sleeping with her when I was still privy to her little cry fests in his office. Get a clue dumbass!

Hi room. there is a lot of pain in all of the above replies and the original post.

First off I want to tell anyone who has been through a LTA (long term affair), DS has a room called Recovery from Long Term Affairs.

The idea of where is the line, what will we put up with? All affairs are devastating whether it is a ONS or a LTA, emotional or physical, or some combination, they all cause grief and pain.

That being said, there are some special issues that come up that are very unique to Long Term Affairs and the devastation and grief are enormous. I am a survivor from two LTA's which is something I never ever wanted to be. Like jrsygrl13's situation, my H has worked full out since D-day to save this marriage. I had a nervous breakdown and I still struggle with my decision to stay and save this marriage. I urge everyone, on DS to be careful when giving advice or stating opinions. I have many good people who felt they were helping, tell me that they would never stay if _________ fill in the blank. And often what they filled in the blank with was my situation, longer than x amount of time, or more than one ow.

My point is, we all have different situations, different deal breakers, different marriages, different affairs, and different recoveries. The beauty of DS is we can come together and support one another through the terrible time of grief and suffering, into the stage of doubts and questions, onward to the stage of acceptance and forgiveness, and hopefully to the stage of full recovery to better life.

Sorry if that sounded like a sermon, but I had to get it off my chest.

Thanks Texy - you are right! That is why I feel like I can post on DS. You all give good advise in some form. I needed a good dose of a sermon, kinda like being in church! ;) It always makes me feel better.

And don't get me wrong, my husband is doing EVERYTHING he can to help. I know things will take time and I am in the midst of the initial stages. But he has shown that I am worth it and he IS worth it too.

My husband had 3 affairs, no emotions NOTHING very short term in his words he used them. He had oral sex with them. Yes it turns my stomach more so since I have seen pictures. He now has problems giving me oral...WTF!!! So I remind him to remember who has been down there since we've been married, he still wants his blow jobs and I tell hin to remember who has sucked on it since we been married. Now for him to try and live with that bull-shit.

I crossed the line when I made the effort to look for sex outside of the marriage. I might have used them for my own satisfaction. What I did not realize is what consequences this would have later in my marriage. So yes having intimate contact with someone other than your spouse is wrong on so many levels that I cannot count. But in my weird little head, contact between me and my wife is different than contact between me and the OW. Hard to explain but really to me it was different.

fortunate - I am glad you replied to my post. My husband has said that same thing to me many times.

I guess every person's situation is different. His sexual encounter didn't work. He said all of his actions were not something he was into. He calls them "mechanical" and "nothing". Being a woman, I guess I really don't know what those terms refer to, because having sex with someone is more than just "mechanical" for me. But, that is me.
Again, though, I am glad there is someone else out there who validates what my husband has told me. Thank you!