I was exposed to abuse when as a 7yo I awoke one morning to find my hand on the penis of a man that slept with both my younger brother and me, he was a lodger at the time. I know, who would have a man sleep with children, back then though, it was accepted practice unfortunately. So no internal physical violation, but abuse nonetheless.

Any deliberate stimulation of the sexual organ, be it the lightest of touches is abuse, penetration by way of penis is not considered penetration alone either. Your subconscious is the recorder of your life's experiences, it remembers everything, even things that as infant children we have no conscious recollection of. Nightmares tend to reveal this sort of happening later in life, it is just a matter of finding the right person out there to decipher the information contained in such nightmares to find out what these nightmares represent.

It is interesting that YOU raise this point, because believe it or not, we share a lot in common with our partners because of our subconscious connections, and not so much our conscious connections as we initially believe. My partner always believed that we had little in common other than our three precious children, how wrong she was, sexual abuse on both sides of our family is rampant. Connection then? YOU better believe it.

I tend to agree with YOU also about your BF. We men are just not allowed by our MALE beingness to grizzle about being sexually abused of all things, it just isn't the MANly way afterall. Pathetic I know, but sadly it is the TRUTH, it has been so since the creation of time.

I must admit though, in recent times I have had fellow brothers relate abuse of a sexual nature to ME, so hopefully the code of silence is beginning to break. I love my fellow brothers and am disgusted at the way brothers treat each other, it is time to put it to an end. If YOU can talk your BF into talking to ME via the message medium then I would be more than happy to speak with him.

I am not a professional by the way, I am a deeply caring brother who has been the victim of male sexual abuse myself, albeit in a non internal (traumatic?) violation way. I, unlike many of my fellow brothers though am not afraid to speak out against the wrongs committed against ME, and believe ME, your BF is a victim here, and not a perpetrator.

Mind YOU, that is not to say he may not become so in the future, let's hope though that he gets the right help to avoid reaching this point. Because the tendency to overcome the internal pain is to inflict it upon others, such an act fails dismally however, it backfires big time because it in itself is a violation of another instead.

Take care, and I will catch up with YOU again soon, Tim.

I'll let him know you're willing to talk.

I am sorry for all that has happened to you and your wife. I did also read somewhere about being attracted to someone who shares certain experiences, like you talked about in your post; I find books helpful as well as the posts here, like to make connections becasue it helps things stick.

It's true that men have a harder time admitting this to themselves and others than women do. I think, by all the statistics I've looked at that men go through this type of abuse just as much as women and while women also have a hard time going to authorities about it, the men do more so. It goes back to what you said about it not being "manly." Men who where abused tend to think their masculinity was taken away.

But, here goes the big one, for me. What I was wondering about is something that happened when I was about nine. I tend to think, and most people do, that abuse happens between to parties of differing ages, the exception being when the victim is an adult or in their teens. Thing is the boy was my age. Not sure where to go from here, it's difficult.

On some level I did want the attention, didn't really have many friends at this time and while home life was good I thought my family was supposed to love me and wanted to know if others would as much as them.

Anyways, I did encourage touching, up to a point. Then came the touching "private areas" which he initiated and made me uncomfortable; I still jump when anyone's hand goes near there. Part was him touching me and part was him trying to get me to do the same to him.

We were both nine. I did encourage some of the "attention." So my question is "does this qualify as abuse or not, because I wanted part of it and because we were both the same age?"

Let me know what you think.

Are you looking for a legal definition or a clinical one?

Here's a web site that might help you. http://www.rainn.org/

Just read your other comment. Do you think this harmed you as a child? If you feel that it might have traumatized you, then it probably did. Sometimes it is hard to tell if childhood abuse is responsible for pain in our adult years and that is why if might be in your best interest to talk to a professional about it all. YOu could call your local rape/crisis centre and speak to them about it. Most of their client base have been sexually abused in childhood, so, they won't be shocked by anything you might say. And it's free.

I am an incest survivor, and didn't realize how much the abuse had damaged me until i was in my early 30's. A great book to read is "The Courage to Heal." It looks at childhood sexual abuse and the affect it can have on adults years down the road. I felt it to be very healing.

I know some Canadian law with regards to consent. With minor children, if the touching is non invasive (ie, no penetration vaginally, orally or anally) and the parties are within two years of age of each other, then it is not legally considered sexual abuse. Penetration doesn't haven't to be by penis, either. Any threat of violence or actual violence to coerce consent can criminalize the act also. I believe American and English law is very similar.

Abuse is abuse. It doesn't matter if the victim is younger, stronger or the same age. There are other groups on DS that deal with child abuse and incest, if you're interested. Let me know.

Something so I know whether it's SA or I'm just being paranoid because of everything I'm reading lately.

It depends on the group if I'd be comfortable going there, my mom and BF are on some of the SA sites and I don't feel ready to tell my mom yet, if ever.

There is a center not far from here, so I'll check that out as well as the site you sent. Thanks for everything so far.

The best thing is to be guided by your gut instinct, very rarely will such an instinct be wrong, in fact in my experience at least, it has never let ME down, invariably though I fail to listen to the messages that come from within. As for the described experience, maybe a violation occurred, again your instincts determine that fact, but I just wonder about the nine year old boy.

If your instincts are founded then I question what he was exposed to prior to your experience with him. It sure does open a can of worms. Good luck with it, and I hope it isn't as serious as it appears maybe face value to be.

My inquiries into the various websites have been answered in the affirmative, for the most part.

The boy, and his family, are very close to my family. We grew up together and activities such as those described above stopped when we were around eleven. The parents he and his younger brother have are adoptive; the family they stayed with before being put into the system abused him (at least not sure of the younger) sexually, hence DCF stepped in.

As far as myself I found I share some of the effects that I've found on various sites and in a book I started reading to help me comprehend what my BF does. I don't think there are set "symptoms" to this type of abuse, but there are some patterns that crop up due to dealing with self-esteem, control, etc. I do deal with occluded memory, can't remember a whole lot from when I was a kid; mostly good is what I remember, but the above incident as well as a few others are still there. I also deal with self-mutilation and self-harm; not drastically, but I'll pick at skin blemishes ALOT and hit myself sometimes when I'm mad.

Don't worry yourselves too much. I will be getting help for all this. The above & co. is just inquiriy and sorting things out.

Thanks for everything. You've been a great help.

One thing that I'd like to point out, is that it is SA even if it ONLY HAPPENED ONE TIME!

AND, One can get PTSD just from that ONE TIME Occurence of SA, or any other type of trauma.But, then there are those that do not get PTSD, and that may be based on other factors, such as resilience, etc. Of note, the symptoms of PTSD may not fully manifest themselves until way after the abuse...like 30's-40's-50's.

I think maybe how you look at it may have an impact on how it affects you..."...it is an individual's subjective experience that determines whether an event is or is not traumatic." Sidran's website

check out this article from www.Sidran.org
http://www.sidran.org/sub.cfm?contentID=88&sectionid=4

Here is one definition I found:
Defining CSA
The National Center on Child Abuse and Neglect defines CSA as contacts or interactions between a child and an adult in which the child is being used for the sexual stimulation of the perpetrator or another person. Sexual abuse may also be committed by a person younger than 18 when that person is either significantly older than the victim or when the perpetrator is in a position of power or control over the child.

CSA may include specific acts such as exhibitionism, voyeurism, solicitation, kissing, fondling, oral sex, and intercourse. Particular acts may or may not be considered CSA, depending on culture and family norms (such as nudity). When evaluating cultural influences on CSA, the criterion for determination is harm. Harm is the result of an exploitation of the child's ignorance, trust and obedience. While exploitation of a child through sexual abuse can be pursued without conscience, it cannot be pursued without intent.
http://www.darkness2light.org/KnowAbout/articles_prevent_abuse.asp

Another:
Child sexual abuse (CSA) is an act of assault or exploitation by a person who has authority over or the trust of a child.

Sexual assault includes:

Exhibition
Masturbation
Fondling
Intercourse
Rape
Sodomy
Bestiality
Ritualized Torture in cults
http://www.againstsexualabuse.org/csa.asp

Here's the RAINN site's link to SA:
http://www.rainn.org/get-information/types-of-sexual-assault/child-sexual-abuse

But, really I think is how the incident affected you psychologically.

Hope that helps some!

I'm not fully sure of how it affects me right yet. Not drastically, I know, I don't have PTSD or anything major. The biggest thing is that I'm rather jumpy and tend to do alot of things in the co-dependency area; which could have occured due to something else as well, not SA just irritating people. I'm not fully ready to put it under SA catagory, as far as the above stuff is concerned. I'm rather confused about it all, but time will tell I guess.

I will check out all the sites recommended. Thanks so much for everything.

Yeah, or some of it could be your personality type too. I was REALLY Type-A Personality before my PTSD kicked in. And, reading some of the Signs and Symptoms that could occur during your 'survivor' years, I seemed to have a lot of those too...control issues, perfectionism....

I hope it doesn't turn out to be anything full blown for you. I'm here for you if you need anything!

((Hugs))

What do you mean by Type-A personality?

I've not done much reading lately. Lots of school stuff going on. End of semester etc.

Take care.

Here's some info to describe Type-A Personality:

People who fall under Type A exhibit characteristics such as being impatient, excessively time-conscious, insecure about one's status, highly competitive, hostile and aggressive, and incapable of relaxation.

Type A individuals are often high-achieving workaholics who multi-task, drive themselves with deadlines, and are unhappy about the smallest of delays. Although they may exhibit some or all of these characteristics, it does not mean that people with the type A personality are incapable of showing love, affection or other types of non-pessimistic behavior. Many are also capable of "coaching" some of these behavior attributes with proper treatment and medication.

Those who do not seek treatment have been described as stress junkies, and often display some of the following characteristics:

1. An intrinsic insecurity or insufficient level of self-esteem, which is considered to be the root cause of the syndrome. This is believed to be covert and therefore less observable.

2. Time urgency and impatience, which causes irritation and exasperation.

3. Free floating hostility, which can be triggered even over little incidents.

---One thing to note also about Type-A Personality People, is that b/c of their stress levels, workaholism, etc...it puts them at high risk for Heart Disease and Type 2 Diabetes.---

There are quickie personality tests out there to see what personality type you are...many jobs even pre-screen employees with maybe something kinda similar to personality testing, and how well they deal with other people, etc.

More tidbits on Type A Personality:

According to scientific literature, Type A behavior is characterized by an intense and sustained drive to achieve goals and an eagerness to compete. Personalities categorized as Type A tend to have a persistent desire for external recognition and advancement. They are involved in various functions that bring about time restrictions. Such personalities have a tendency to speed up mental and physical tasks with extraordinary mental and physical alertness. These characteristics make for super-achievers and high-powered people.

Type A individuals can get a lot done and have the potential to really move ahead in the world. But there is a high price to pay. Certain components of such a personality can inhibit happiness and even threaten health. For example, the goals that Type A folks set are often poorly defined and therefore hard to achievea perfect recipe for misery.

Type A is also characterized by a general discontentedness and the impulse to be overly critical and demanding, even contemptuous of imperfection, in the self and others. This focus on negative aspects and the accompanying bursts of hostility and impatience result in guilt, remorse and anxiety.

Type A personalities are motivated by external sources (instead of by inner motivation), such as material reward and appreciation from others. Type A folks experience a constant sense of opposition, wariness, and apprehension--they are always ready for battle. And anyone can imagine how this constant (and very exhausting) existence would deplete reserves of contentment and happiness and disrupt personal equilibrium.

Although the literature is somewhat inconsistent because of problems with the conceptualization and definition of Type A behavior pattern, it has been linked to higher risks of cardiovascular diseases. The risks seemed to be reduced with intervention aimed at reducing Type A behavior. Indeed, those with a high Type A score would be happier and healthier if they were to file down the jagged edges of their personality. By learning how to control the negative behavior patterns while preserving their drive, Type A people can be successful without sacrificing their emotional well-being.

Where to take the personality tests? Google it, or try these:
http://discoveryhealth.queendom.com/type_a_personality_access.html

This one is based off of the Myers Briggs Testing, so you get a different picture of your personality...not labeled Type A or Type B...I remember doing this as a seminar thing in one of our Unit Council Meetings...Very interesting as well:
http://www.personalitytype.com/quiz.asp
---OR---
http://www.humanmetrics.com/cgi-win/JTypes2.asp

This link gives a simple explanation btwn the 4 different Personality Types...A-B-C-D.
http://www.hiresuccess.com/pplus-3.htm

Thanks for the sinks. I checked them out and more relate to the Type-D personality than anything else, but of course I can relate to all the others on some level as well; that's just the one that seems Most like me.

Here are some more definitions I found from a friend of mine on another site. So looking at these I got a yes in answer to my question. I'll probable contact the crisis center in my area for help and go from there. There's also a support website I'll check out as well. I'll keep you updated.

Thanks for everything.

http://www.rainn.org/get-information/types-of-sexual-assault
http://www.secasa.com.au/infosheet/infosheet_0004.pdf
http://www.mvwcs.com/definingrape.html

From the legal perspective definitions change because of different laws and forms of laws or even changing laws in different jurisdictions. But consent is the key issue and perhaps this section taken from the US National Centre for Victims of Crime Website might help? -

"Basically, almost any sexual behavior a person has not consented to that causes that person to feel uncomfortable, frightened or intimidated is included in the sexual assault category.

The law generally assumes that a person does not consent to sexual conduct if he or she is forced, threatened or is unconscious, drugged, a minor, developmentally disabled, chronically mentally ill, or believe they are undergoing a medical procedure. Some examples of sexual assault include:

* Someone putting their finger, tongue, mouth, penis or an object in or on your vagina, penis or anus when you don't want them to;
* Someone touching, fondling, kissing or making any unwanted contact with your body;
* Someone forcing you to perform oral sex or forcing you to receive oral sex;
* Someone forcing you to masturbate, forcing you to masturbate them, or fondling and touching you;
* Someone forcing you to look at sexually explicit material or forcing you to pose for sexually explicit pictures; and
* A doctor, nurse, or other health care professional giving you an unnecessary internal examination or touching your sexual organs in an unprofessional, unwarranted and inappropriate manner."

People talk about "covert" sexual abuse as well, which is sometimes not physical but verbal - along the lines of making inappropriate sexual comments to a child, or harrassing someone. Harrassment and stalking and things like that aren't legally considered assault (because they're talking about physical assault in those circumstances). But they are very much considered abuse and can be just as distressing and violating for people. They would fall more into the category of sexual abuse and sometimes have different criminal sanctions attached to them too, depending on where you are. But from YOUR point of view, rather than society's - they can be just as important and you deserve just as much support dealing with them too.

Pjann...that's a great definition...very inclusive!! I'll check out those links too.

Hope things go well with you.

I'll have to check out the Type-D Personality, I just briefly looked at it...