Physical & Emotional Abuse Support Group
Abuse is a general term for the treatment of someone that causes some kind of harm (to the abused person, to the abusers themselves, or to someone else) that is unlawful or wrongful. No one deserves abuse, period. Abuse can be emotional, physical, or sexual.
Sorry, but this one makes me laugh! Af if!!!!
'How to tell if he's changing'
Adapted from Women Against Domestic Violence:)
He takes full responsibility for his behaviour.
He acknowledges and accepts responsibility for what he's done, and fully acknowledges that he used abuse to control you and that it was wrong.
He doesn't blame you, other people, his stress, his job, or any other outside circumstances for his behaviours.
He is no longer denies his behaviour, makes light of it, or makes excuses for it.
He acknowledges that he chose to behave this way instead of saying that other people made him do it, or that he can't control himself
He fully understands and acknowledges that what he did was wrong.
He admits lies, he admits what he's done and is not longer making up stories to make himself look better
He no longer tries to hide his behaviour from others and admits he is abusive.
He understands that he must stop abusive behaviours, and that recovery from abusiveness takes a long time and he'll have to work at it for a long, long time.
He understands the effects of his behaviour.
He understands what his behaviour has cost you emotionally.
He understands fully that you and your children have been hurt by what he's done, and the ways in which you've been hurt by him.
He will talk with you in depth (if you want to) about how you feel, your fear, your hurt, your anger, your rights, your lack of trust for him and understands fully that it is his behaviour that has caused it, and he is very sorry.
He is sorry for what he's done, and is working hard to overcome the damage he's done and is actively making up for it by giving you back what is rightfully yours - money, respect, rights, freedoms, choices, etc.
He understands that it will take his you a long time to recover from what he's done to you. he is willing to take that time with you.
He respects you.
He is proving to you that he understands that you're a human being with rights and is no longer trying to take them away from you -no more double standards.
He understands that you're an equal human being, and he's not superior to you.
He's pulling his weight.
He respects your opinions, even the ones he disagrees with.
He accepts your right to be angry with him for what he's done.
He respects your right to independence and your right to freedom.
He changes his behaviour.
He is no longer violent in any way.
He is making a big effort to be non abusive.
He does not pressure you, intimidate or threaten you.
He is no longer blocking communication - he listens and respects what you have to say.
He will discuss with you the controlling behaviours and attitudes he's had.
You can speak and act freely without him retaliating or getting angry.
If he tries to control you, you can point it out to him and he'll stop.
When you express your feelings to him, he listens instead of getting angry and trying to shout you down, threatening you or trying to convince you that something's wrong with you for feeling that way.
He stops interfering in your friendships and family relationships and you are able to re-establish and repair these, and make new friends.
He stops monitoring your movements, demanding to know where you are and who's there.
He stops expecting sex on demand.
He's stopped any problem causing drinking.
He's fair with money, allowing you to have your assets in both your names, and a job if you want.
He takes responsibility for what he does and how it affects you and the children.
He no longer treats you like a servant.
'How to tell if he's changing'
Adapted from Women Against Domestic Violence:)
He takes full responsibility for his behaviour.
He acknowledges and accepts responsibility for what he's done, and fully acknowledges that he used abuse to control you and that it was wrong.
He doesn't blame you, other people, his stress, his job, or any other outside circumstances for his behaviours.
He is no longer denies his behaviour, makes light of it, or makes excuses for it.
He acknowledges that he chose to behave this way instead of saying that other people made him do it, or that he can't control himself
He fully understands and acknowledges that what he did was wrong.
He admits lies, he admits what he's done and is not longer making up stories to make himself look better
He no longer tries to hide his behaviour from others and admits he is abusive.
He understands that he must stop abusive behaviours, and that recovery from abusiveness takes a long time and he'll have to work at it for a long, long time.
He understands the effects of his behaviour.
He understands what his behaviour has cost you emotionally.
He understands fully that you and your children have been hurt by what he's done, and the ways in which you've been hurt by him.
He will talk with you in depth (if you want to) about how you feel, your fear, your hurt, your anger, your rights, your lack of trust for him and understands fully that it is his behaviour that has caused it, and he is very sorry.
He is sorry for what he's done, and is working hard to overcome the damage he's done and is actively making up for it by giving you back what is rightfully yours - money, respect, rights, freedoms, choices, etc.
He understands that it will take his you a long time to recover from what he's done to you. he is willing to take that time with you.
He respects you.
He is proving to you that he understands that you're a human being with rights and is no longer trying to take them away from you -no more double standards.
He understands that you're an equal human being, and he's not superior to you.
He's pulling his weight.
He respects your opinions, even the ones he disagrees with.
He accepts your right to be angry with him for what he's done.
He respects your right to independence and your right to freedom.
He changes his behaviour.
He is no longer violent in any way.
He is making a big effort to be non abusive.
He does not pressure you, intimidate or threaten you.
He is no longer blocking communication - he listens and respects what you have to say.
He will discuss with you the controlling behaviours and attitudes he's had.
You can speak and act freely without him retaliating or getting angry.
If he tries to control you, you can point it out to him and he'll stop.
When you express your feelings to him, he listens instead of getting angry and trying to shout you down, threatening you or trying to convince you that something's wrong with you for feeling that way.
He stops interfering in your friendships and family relationships and you are able to re-establish and repair these, and make new friends.
He stops monitoring your movements, demanding to know where you are and who's there.
He stops expecting sex on demand.
He's stopped any problem causing drinking.
He's fair with money, allowing you to have your assets in both your names, and a job if you want.
He takes responsibility for what he does and how it affects you and the children.
He no longer treats you like a servant.
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Hi, I'm new here again. Use to come on here a lot years ago. Wanted to introduce myself and say hello. I plan to be on here much more. I need to reach out more and find some hope again. I"m going to start AA again Thursday. A neighbor is taking me along with. I finally said yes. Gotta do something. I can't fix myself, I need to put myself into the positions where I can get help though...
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Early recovery is very overwhelming. Essentially, we are asked to change everything. What I've learned after a few 24 is that I really only need to change one thing, the way I think because my problems are centered in my mind. I have a perception/perspective defect. Being open-minded is essential to my recovery because the result is that everything does change. If you're new, don't use the...
Ya think?????
lol!!!!!!!!
I think the only solution is to leave because once you have made a monster of someone in your heart and mind I don't think you ever forgive them for being a monster and realistically you always believe that they will never change. I think it's also possible for the abused partner to refuse the change of the other person and having been taught the behaviors of the abuser makes them capable of undermining the efforts of change subconsciously.
Just my thoughts because I could never forgive no matter how hard I tried. I have hate in me forever towards my abusers, it's not in my control to stop hating them even if it lessens slightly with time.
I'm not sure how it will help your 'recovery' to come in here and hang out with mostly a lot of women who are suffering very badly because of abuse and abusive people, like you admit to being?..
Unless you'd like to say sorry on behalf of all our abusers?...
No, didn't think so...
You're so right nobody is perfect, I was a bit more perfect though before I had years of being mangled by my abusive narcissistic ex...
I would seriously advise you not to visit here if you are offended by people expressing many feelings ranging from anger to cynicism, and hope and in order to empower themselves, in order to recover, heal or to express their pain and confusion. You are very highly likely to find a lot more offensive than the above, as we are very free and uncensored here. Some of here will even to vent vehemently against our abusers if we so choose to do so, and sometimes we even feel that we have earned the right to say anything we want because of the damage they have done to us.
If any of this offends you greatly, I would suggest you stay out of here. Most of us here are not in negotiation with our abusers, as they haven't listened, don't care, and continue to reap hurt upon hurt on most of us.
Nobody here insists that abusers changing is impossible..But it definitely is, in my experience, and statistics also show that it is very very unlikely. So good luck with you working on yourself. But I was controlled for long enough, and no self confessed abuser who up until recently still admits to being uncontrollably abusive, is going to now come in here and censor what I can or can't say, or what I now find funny ironic or unfunny, or come looking for me to apologise for my opinions. This is a forum for well earned free speech..and I don't appreciate you attempting to censor how I choose to express my opinions.
I see you say you are very affronted and say 'this post really DID hurt my feelings'...What did you say to your girlfriend when you continued to hurt and abuse her feelings over and over for years?...I would work on that first if I were you, instead of working on the hurt feelings 'YOU' get, from coming into a very inapropriate group for you, where people have already been very hurt, by abusers.
I would also save my energy if I were you, for the hard work you have ahead of you, and for concentrating hard on working the list above.
Though rainyangel because its all about 'control', and not about love, finding someone they 'really love and don't want to lose them' would not be a factor for change. From my experience, none of it is about love. Someone who truly loves someone, cannot hurt them very deliberately over and over, again and again. Ever.
lilthing, I don't think that anyone can hold 'the "abuser" to a stringent code of ethics far beyond and more specific than that which we judge non-abusers', because if we could 'hold' them to anything even vaguely like the above, the abuse would not happen.
Unfortunately, abusers 'make a monster of themselves', in our hearts and minds, WE don't make 'a monster of someone' in our hearts and minds. I think most of us would agree that we would all want it to change by the minute, and many of us have been willing to forgive and forget awful hurts, if only they would stop, and be sorry, and truly change.
You write that its 'possible for the abused partner to refuse the change of the other person and having been taught the behaviors of the abuser makes them capable of undermining the efforts of change subconsciously', that would require an abusive partner to be sorry, and to be clearly and thoroughly trying very hard to change, I haven't actually heard of that scenario here so far?
You only believe they will never change, and HAVE to leave, because over time, it becomes very clear, that they won't.
Control would be the only issue to change, and that is something abusers refuse to acknowledge.
Its stilly to suggest to victims to monitor abuser progress.
The only way I would ever believe he is changing if he has commited himself to years of therapy by a shrink approved by me and periodic reports from the shrink on the progress.
If this Domesctic Violence group advocates anything but serious therapy thats just silly and also dangerous.
I also agree kath08 that it would take years of very extensive and specific therapy if my ex was to get to the root of his need to abuse..to even begin to change..and even then I'd have my doubts about any success due to all the statistics I've read.
The biggest problem would be acknowledging that there is a problem, before any work at all could be done..and all I have heard and personally experienced is that no acknowledgement is at all likely. Or if it is, the behaviour usually still continues, So whats the point?
If anyone here is living with someone who has been abusive, and who is now genuinely doing extensive work on themselves, with serious therapy, and who is showing consistant evidence of reparation..I'd love to hear of it?..
This sure has elicited varied and interesting responses. (In my opinion, that's a GOOD thing.)
I agree with Kathy that for significant change to occur, it would require highly qualified and serious therapy.
But the most well qualified therapy can't help if the client isn't interested in help.
And I think one of our biggest obstacles, is that we've found that most abusers aren't particularly interested in changing, even when they say they are. If they go, even if they KEEP going, they have to WANT to change.
And yes, I'm with Vonnie. The numbers don't come down in favor of abusers making a genuine turn around. This is not to say that genuine turn arounds NEVER happen, but from what I've seen, deeply ingrained dysfunction is just that ----- deep, ingrained and resistant to therapy.
As for the nature of the original post:
I took it as sublimely ridiculous ---- meaning ----- were it possible on this earth for a persistent abuser to go from consistent cruelty to behaving as a virtually perfect companion, well ----- I'd sign up. Of course, reading it, any survivor has to chuckle because of how improbable. . . . come on . . . . most of us agree, IMPOSSIBLE, this scenario would be in real life. It's taking a situation (that an abuser will make some kind of turn around, ANY kind of turn around), to the extreme. Academically, that's called a literary device. It doesn't mean that it can or would happen ---- just that it gives us a lighter moment to imagine, for even a second, that it was remotely possible ----- because in real life, short of being hit by lightening or touched by an angel ---- it probably won't.
So, I'm with virtually every poster on this thread. Can someone change? It might. But change is hard. The more deeply ingrained the dysfunction, the harder it is. Sure, change is possible. Probable? Unlikely. This much change? Theater of the absurd. Therapy? Sure ---- if they're sincere and have the bucks to afford it ----- let 'um go and keep checking with the therapist and also checking your own life to see how you're being treated, six months after it starts, a year in, two years. That's how you know they've changed.
Vonnie ---- I enjoyed the irony. Thanks.
I do really have a problem with this statement as well...
"He's stopped any problem causing drinking. "
Some people view an alcoholism as a character defect when in reality..they are human beings with a serious disease that MAGNIFIES character defects...Not all alcoholics are abusive, but when alcohol is added abuse can happen..Abuse in itself, is a character defect...that needs a lot of therapy to rebound from..
I don't want to put you down at all...Your sentiments about you having a true desire to change, and no intentions to offend, are very worthy..
I also don't like to get personal...But you are a self confessed 'abuser', and coming in here, and saying all is now well and great, after admitting years of having being abusive in a relationship, when things quite obviously just don't ever change that easily, is either being in denial, or not being truthful??....
I am more interested in the facts after you have come in here to comment... I do sincerely hope that you ARE one of the ones who can change...But like kath08 says, and llleneW and mingsplay and others...It would take many years of therapy..
Having no denial would be the first most important step..and then a lot of work...I wish you well on your journey...