Hi RobertG36,

I think you were mistreated by not getting the Cipro with the Flagyl the first time. I have no medical training; I am just a sufferer like you.

There is a myth that GI docs continue to propagate that having more attacks means that someday the Cipro / Flagly will not work for you. The people most in danger of the Cipro / Flagyl not working are the people having their first attack. If the combo worked once it is likely to keep working.

Here is an interesting study:

http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=1570566

Having said that, you might still be infected. You should know your white blood count, your temperature, and you should have a CT scan. I complain about post attack CT scans as a source of unnecessary radiation, but since you are still having problems, you might need one.

One of the biggest complications of diverticulitis in a man is cross connecting the colon to the bladder. The colon gets hot with bacteria and burns a hole in the bladder and the two join. Something like that could be going on. You will get more bladder infections and pain. I complain here that some get surgery too soon, but if you do have a complication like bladder to colon connection, you will suffer until it is fixed with surgery.

Money is a difficult issue for many here. This disease will not let you ignore it until finances get better.

I wonder if there is a home kit to measure WBC?

At the very least, keep track of your temperature everyday and keep a log.

Have your white blood count checked every day or two until you are in the clear.

Shaking fever or chills with increasing pain - get to an ER. Money does not matter to you anymore.

Stress is quoted as the number one trigger for diverticulitis attacks. It sounds like you are being attacked from all directions. I wish I really had answers for you.

I wish you the best,

John

Hi Again RobertG36

There appears to be NO home WBC test. A WBC test is a very cheap blood test. It is not fool proof for early detection of a diverticulitis attack, but if you are in real trouble, your WBC will rise at some point.

Normal temperature and WBC is what gets you released from the hospital. Others chime in if other measurements come into play. A really high WBC will get you surgery without a CT scan at hospital admission. I believe it is the best test to see if you are in grave danger with the lowest cost other than measuring your temperature.

Check this out:

http://www.mdadvice.com/library/test/medtest453.html

John

i was online most of the day looking up diver again yesterday. one website about cipro freaked me out. type in horror stories about cipro and have a look. not trying to alarm you but i was shocked at some of the reactions people are having with cipro. just a thought.

rhonda

Thanx for the info. As of last week, by WBC was slightly elevated, but not that bad. Only one day of the attack (Pre-Flagyl) did I have a fever. My temp has been fine other than that. Last night, I started to get pain again. This morning, I woke up with no pain but the pain started about an hour after waking up. It's a "dull" pain right now.

I seem to not be having the symptoms of a bladder infection right now (painful urination). Last week, Pre-Cipro, urination pain was bad at times.

Maybe I'm just not being patient enough? I still have a little more than a week of Cipro left...

As for the dangers of Cipro, I'm well-versed on them. I'm a rather scientific person and I make sure I know exactly how whatever meds I'm taking work, etc. Cipro's method of action is a bit drastic (messing with DNA coiling, which prevents cell division). What concerns me is that not only does it affect bacteria, those same processes are present in some normal human cells, which can also be affected. And, it's so effective at killing SOME pathogens that it has a habit of allowing others that are not as common to flourish--hence, the antibiotic-induced diarreah, which I DEFINITELY am experiencing. I guess Cipro is just one of those drugs that one has to be careful with and be very aware of what is happening....

Cipro and Flagyl attack two different kinds of bacteria, which is why docs typically prescribe both of them. I've also had them prescribe Avelox and Augmentin.

None of these worked for me. The oral antibiotics would start to calm things down, but then the infection would ramp up again. I had to get IV antibiotics, and I've had IV Cipro, Flagyl, Avelox, and Zosyn. In my case, the oral antibiotics just couldn't kill the infection. The IV ones did, quickly, but then it came back. I watched my temperature like a hawk, and headed for ER any time it spiked over 100.

I had to have surgery, but one thing I did that was kind of unusual was to ask for home IV antibiotics while I was trying to calm the thing down enough to do the surgery. I felt fine, and there didn't seem to be any reason to be in the hospital and put up with all that and spend all that money.

I had them implant what's called a PICC line, and then the home health agency delivered the antibiotic and the pump and supplies. Four times a day, I would hook the big syringe of liquid antibiotic up to a pump, clean off the end of my PICC line, and hook up the antibiotic. It took about 35 minutes. Other than the one in the middle of the night, it wasn't bad.

My colon had attached itself to both the bladder and small intestine, but not yet made a hole when I had the surgery.

I know you don't want to have surgery, but if it's necessary, you don't have a choice. And the surgery is a lot easier, cheaper, and cleaner if done before you have a perforation or fistula.

I hope the antibiotics do work for you, though! And if they recommend IV antibiotics, it is possible to get them as an outpatient or to go to an infusion center. You don't necessarily need to be in the hospital.

Jenny56 - That is great information. I really like your story because you put yourself in control of your situation and did not give in to the standard operating procedure.

I would much rather stay home than stay in the hospital. I never thought I had the power to fight the hospital on this. I would guess the home nurse would need to take your blood everyday to make sure you were getting better and not worse.

I had a terrible headache the whole time in the hospital. They would not give me a Tylenol. They would give me all the morphine I wanted, but it does not touch a headache. I will stay home the next time if I can. If I could have reveived a Tylenol, they would have charge me a 100 bucks per pill.

RobertG36 - Both Cipro and Flagyl can have really bad side effects (see the list of possible side effects for Flagyl below - wow!). Many here have had trouble with Cipro and Flagyl. I even had Gentomicin the first diverticulitis attack - a known nerve toxin. If all of us here had the same attacks and it was 1940, our death certificates would all read - cause of death - peritonitis. Cipro and Flagyl are really powerful drugs that keep us alive even though some of us suffer really bad complications from them. Everyone that takes them feels really aweful. If they fail to work, there are few choices left.

ATB,

John

******************************************
Flagyl side effects - a wonder any of us live through it!

http://www.drugs.com/sfx/flagyl-side-effects.html


Two serious adverse reactions reported in patients treated with intravenous metronidazole have been convulsive seizures and peripheral neuropathy, the latter characterized mainly by numbness or paresthesia of an extremity. Since persistent peripheral neuropathy has been reported in some patients receiving prolonged oral administration of metronidazole, patients should be observed carefully if neurologic symptoms occur and a prompt evaluation made of the benefit/risk ratio of the continuation of therapy.

The following reactions have also been reported during treatment with Metronidazole Injection, USP RTU.

Gastrointestinal: Nausea, vomiting, abdominal discomfort, diarrhea and an unpleasant metallic taste.

Hematopoietic: Reversible neutropenia (leukopenia).

Dermatologic: Erythematous rash and pruritus.

Central Nervous System: Headache, dizziness, syncope, ataxia and confusion.

Local Reactions: Thrombophlebitis after intravenous infusion. This reaction can be minimized or avoided by avoiding prolonged use of indwelling intravenous catheters.

Other: Fever. Instances of a darkened urine have also been reported, and this manifestation has been the subject of a special investigation. Although the pigment which is probably responsible for this phenomenon has not been positively identified, it is almost certainly a metabolite of metronidazole and seems to have no clinical significance.

The following adverse reactions have been reported during treatment with oral metronidazole:

Gastrointestinal: Nausea, sometimes accompanied by headache, anorexia and occasionally vomiting; diarrhea, epigastric distress, abdominal cramping and constipation.

Mouth: A sharp, unpleasant metallic taste is not unusual. Furry tongue, glossitis and stomatitis have occurred; these may be associated with a sudden overgrowth of Candida which may occur during effective therapy.

Hematopoietic: Reversible neutropenia (leukopenia); rarely, reversible thrombocytopenia.

Cardiovascular: Flattening of the T-wave may be seen in electrocardiographic tracings.

Central Nervous System: Convulsive seizures, peripheral neuropathy, dizziness, vertigo, incoordination, ataxia, confusion, irritability, depression, weakness and insomnia.

Hypersensitivity: Urticaria, erythematous rash, flushing, nasal congestion, dryness of the mouth (or vagina or vulva) and fever.

Renal: Dysuria, cystitis, polyuria, incontinence, a sense of pelvic pressure and darkened urine.

Other: Proliferation of Candida in the vagina, dyspareunia, decrease of libido, proctitis and fleeting joint pains sometimes resembling serum sickness. If patients receiving metronidazole drink alcoholic beverages, they may experience abdominal distress, nausea, vomiting, flushing or headache. A modification of the taste of alcoholic beverages has also been reported. Rare cases of pancreatitis, which abated on withdrawal of the drug, have been reported.

Crohn's disease patients are known to have an increased incidence of gastrointestinal and certain extraintestinal cancers. There have been some reports in the medical literature of breast and colon cancer in Crohn's disease patients who have been treated with metronidazole at high doses for extended periods of time. A cause and effect relationship has not been established. Crohn's disease is not an approved indication for Metronidazole Injection, USP RTU.

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By body system


Other side effects
A disulfiram-like reaction has been reported in some patients drinking ethanol while taking metronidazole. Patients have experienced flushing, nausea, headache, and hypotension. Patients should be advised to refrain from all forms of ethanol while taking metronidazole and for at least 72 hours after the last dose.

Metronidazole may produce a disulfiram-like reaction when taken concurrently with ethanol.



Gastrointestinal side effects
Gastrointestinal side effects of metronidazole have been common and have included nausea (up to 12%), anorexia, dry mouth, a strange metallic taste, diarrhea, vomiting, epigastric distress, abdominal cramping, and coating of the tongue. Rarely, metronidazole has been associated with pseudomembranous colitis and pancreatitis.

Although metronidazole has been used to treat pseudomembranous colitis, it has rarely also been implicated as a causative agent. These rare cases have been successfully treated with vancomycin.



Nervous system side effects
Central nervous system effects of metronidazole have included encephalopathy resulting in dizziness, confusion, disorientation, agitation, and hallucinations. Peripheral neuropathy, seizures, ataxia, reversible abnormalities in the cerebellar dentate nuclei, and aseptic meningitis have also been reported.

A rare but serious adverse effect of metronidazole is peripheral neuropathy which is thought to be related to dose and duration of therapy. Most cases occur after doses of 1000 to 2400 mg per day for at least 30 days, or a total dose of 50 grams. Neuropathy is generally located in the lower extremities and presents with numbness, tingling, and paresthesias. Patients should be advised to discontinue metronidazole if they experience these effects. Neuropathy may be persistent despite discontinuation of metronidazole. Seizures associated with metronidazole are rare, but do occur.

Several cases of MRI abnormalities of the dentate nuclei associated with symptoms of ataxia and dysarthria have been reported. The symptoms and dentate nuclei lesions resolved several weeks after discontinuation of metronidazole. These symptoms and metronidazole-induced lesions in the brain stem and cerebellar nuclei have also been described in rat studies.



Hematologic side effects
Hematologic adverse effects of metronidazole have rarely been reported and include reversible leukopenia and thrombocytopenia.



Hypersensitivity side effects
Hypersensitivity reactions to metronidazole have occurred as urticaria, rash, and pruritus. A serum sickness-like reaction has been reported. Fixed drug eruptions have been reported and cross-sensitivity to other nitroimidazole derivatives has been demonstrated.

Metronidazole has rarely been associated with a serum sickness-like reaction which presents as arthralgias, malaise, fever, chills, pruritus, and rash.



Genitourinary side effects
Genitourinary side effects have included vaginal candidiasis, vaginal itching, and dark urine

I got headaches in the hospital too. Dilaudid and morphine both triggered migraines. The first time I begged for some Tylenol with caffeine, but by the time they got a doctor to order it, the headache was way beyond that.

I eventually got a shot of Imitrex, which works on migraines.

The next time I was in, I made sure Imitrex was on the list of approved meds. I got the migraine again, but was so addled I asked for coffee, which they gave me. I promptly threw it up (and this was a couple days after surgery). I finally came to my senses and asked for the Imitrex and it worked like a charm.

4strikes, you can fight the hospital on anything. As my father liked to say, "It's a hospital, not a jail." You have the right to refuse any treatment or test. After I got better on antibiotics, I asked them to stop coming in for 4 am blood draws and 6 am blood pressure checks. The nurses obliged for the last couple nights I was there, since I was obviously not in crisis. The nurses are your friends and can help you work the system.

Welcome RobertG. The cipro/flagyl also did not work for me...for 4 months. The surgeon finally put me in hospital for IV Zosyn and total bowel rest (IV nutrition through a PICC line) for 7 days. Six weeks later I had the surgery. It's been a year, and I think I'm cured. Your bladder infection is a bad sign. As others said, this disease can form "fistulas"...the colon and bladder attach and form a passage such that your colon contents enter your bladder and cause infection. The ONLY cure for this is surgery. Sorry for your financial condition, but I don't think you have a choice at this point. It will keep progressing until you have a bowel abscess or rupture, then it's life threatening and emergency surgery with possible colostomy. Don't delay on this. See a surgeon ASAP.

Hello,

This is as horrible as it can be! I am living the nightmare. I am 29 years old in 2 days and suddenly last weekend i felt a pain after eating Chinese food and going to bed, i work at night so when i woke up t head to work, the pain was horrible and it kept going on. sunday morning i went to the emergency, doctor gave me flagyl and kefexin and said that its supposedly diverticu...
so i was dying and went to bed, and of course cancelled my flight to spain the next day for my only one week summer holiday.
te monday the pain was horrible on my lower left and cramps were happening but not high fever, my level of infection called CDG was 14, not too high.

so monday morning i went to the clinic here, thanks god for paying taxes in Finland, we got good healthcare even if its slow but free at least. so i went monday and met a doctor and she said that it could be diverticulosis and i have to wait for the flagyl and antibiotics to take effect. now its tuesday afternoon, pain s less but i still feel it a bit down below. been reading a lot and i am so stressed from this, it is purely my mistake, fuckin mcdonalds and unhealthy food. I ve been trying to stay on soups and liquids the last 2 days.

anybody can advice something else, they said now they will do an endoscopy but there is a queue that will take a month or 2 . i think ill have to wait. if the pain comes back worse by next week, ill go to emergency room. working at night doesnt help much my case i guess.

So if anybody got any advise please do share, i shiver a bit and got a headache this morning but mostly am scared to even touch food. ( little bit of a drama queen)

wish you all well and living better, waiting any replies.