I am the father of a sociopathic son that is keeping my grand daughter away from me.Posted on 03/28/11, 11:35 am
I have a 36 year old son that is a sociopath, I have tried to deal with him all his life, he is heartless.
He brought my 4 year old grand daughter into my life, along with my grand daughters mother. About 14 months ago, my son, and the mother broke up and went their separate ways.
My son gave me the ultimatium, If I talk to my grand daughters mother, he will NOT talk to me. I can not turn my back on my grand daughters mother, that would be turning my back on my grand daughter, beings I very seldom seen my son, unless he wanted something.
Anyway, if anyone can give me some words of wisdom, or, are going through this themselves, I am despirit. Please help me understand. My heart is breaking.
And how do you accept not seeing your own child?
Any help would be appreicated.
I am not sure how I will get responses, and I am not the best at the computer, but my email address is DenHalie@aol.com if I can not respond on this site, feel free to contact me through my email address.
Thank you in advance for any help to learn to live with this nightmare!
Reply #1 03/28/11 11:45am
Den, you will find good advice here from people who are in very similar circumstances. It is a desperate situation and this group has really helped me come to a peaceful place with our estrangement from our son.
We do not have grandchildren, but I believe in this case you must always trust your gut instincts. Your son is a grown man and has made his choice, but your little grandaughter will need you and you should follow your heart on what is best. These adult 'children' need to grow up! But instead find it easier to just blame, blame, blame their parents for all that is wrong in their lives. I know you get great advice here. Take care, kathy
Reply #2 03/28/11 12:02pm
Hi Kathy, thank you for the kind words, this is an aweful way to grow old.
I am not sleeping at nights, and I have lost my appetite from all the problems and drama he has caused, and he would thrive to find out it is causing me such pain. You would think my son would have a little graditude for fathering him all him life??????? I was the first person in this world to hold him, they took him out and placed him in MY Hands!
Thank you again, and Good luck to you too. DennyMo
Reply #3 03/28/11 12:05pm
Denny; I can read that you are feeling desperate. Sometimes we answer our own questions...and, I am reading that you said 'he is a sociopath and I have been trying to deal with him all his life, he is heartless'.
That may be the answer to your question.
It seems you have two choices, by staying in touch with the mother, you get to see the grand daughters.
Or, you can stay in touch with him and continue the sociopath dance with him...which sounds miserable, and at a high cost to you.
Your interaction with your grand daughters, loving them, is a way of loving him...because he is too difficult to love right now.
Sometimes we just have to evaluate what best contributes to a 'higher ground' in living our lives, and where our best efforts can be used.
By the way, that was a threat he gave you...you don't need to allow him to treat you that way, no one should be treated that way.
Reply #4 03/28/11 12:16pm
Hi Kathy, thank you for you kind and caring words, they are welcomed.
I am feeling miserable, this has been going on for 14 months, I thought by now we could have cleared the air, but he has no feelings for others pain. He actually enjoys seeing others in pain, and has no remorse for causing pain. I do see my grand daughter through her mother, which may I ad, she is a wonderful mother, and has been a wonderful person, she just couldnt take his ways any longer, and moved to her parents basement with my grand daughter. I have a large house, I could have them move in with me, but I think that would just cause more problems, I dont want to see my beautiful grand daughter living in a BASEMENT!
I feel like puking from all of this. I am not the strongest person in the world emotionally. And the stress is really affecting me physically.
I do not want to be caught in my sons sociopathic ways, but how do you walk away from your own son. I know that is what I have to do.
He has never had any interest in any of my family (I have 14 siblings) but now this has happened, he is communicating with them, just to get the word back to me to hurt me. He has never had any interest in my family, but now he is USING them, to irritate me. Sick if you ask me.
Thanks Kathy, my most humble thank you, DennyMo
Reply #5 03/28/11 12:46pm
Unfortunately you go through all sorts of emotions when our kids do the wrong thing. The shock phase is when you just can't believe what they have done or how they have acted and sometimes I find myself right back in this bewilderment again..... My daughter cut us out of her life abruptly....there was no fight, no words, just quit answering her phone, emails, etc....after a couple mos of not hearing from her, my sister (her aunt) and me, her mom went and knocked on her door to see if she was missing essentially. She called the police on us and had then "inform" us that she wants NO CONTACT with us and if we try to contact her again, she will take out a restraining order. Not only did we lose her that night, but also our two adorable grandbabies, which were a huge part of our lives and we were very close to. Her father and I have been married almost 30 years, she is our oldest and she was adored also....she started to act bizarre a few mos prior to this, but we chalked it up to her having small children, being stressed, etc....
Since our hands are tied, and we have absolutely NO CONTROL over her or her actions......we are forced to find a way to LET HER GO.....and the grandbabies too. Now that I am getting stronger and that comes with time I think, I realize I do have a life even if she doesn't want to be in it.........and yes it is a deep SORROW especially losing the grandbabies...
This is my new "mantra" if you will.......I didn't teach her to behave this way. I have no control, she doesn't want to be part of our lives and we don't know why. It is not the way I want things, but it is what it is....and I am doing the only thing I can do which is move on and let go.......
But, it is a process.....slow and painful.... Hang in there, it gets better and there is light at the end of the tunnel....
One last word of "advice" if I were to give any would be, just for you to always "do the right thing" and then your conscience will be clear. I don't think I would do this warped dance with him. I would not be unkind to the grandchilds mother, just because he wants you to. You have to do the right thing--if anybody else doesn't like it, oh well..... but that's just me, my opinion and my 2 cents.... hope this is helpful to you...and welcome to the group.
Reply #6 03/28/11 12:49pm
So sorry you have a reason to be on this site, but very glad you have found us. Most are in the same boat as you are, and we find our direction in this sea of estrangement from the strength of our members.
You will learn to live with not seeing your son because - you have to. I wish there was a better answer, but most of us are also dealing with no contact, some for 10 years! Mine is much newer, only about 7 months, but the handwriting is on the wall.
If your goal is to see your granddaughter, you stated it will be through her mother. Sounds like her mother is a great gal and can use all the help she can get. Your son has been threatening and as you said, he was never stable anyway; hence the divorce from his wife. If you feel comfortable offering your granddaughter and her mother a place to live, that is a lovely gesture. Your son is probably unavailable and is also causing problems with your family. It's pretty obvious that he is not operating from a place of mental health.
(sorry to all members who have read this before) Run, don't walk, to your library or bookstore and get the book "The Sociopath Next Door." You can also order from amazon.com if you do things over the Internet. It explains the working of the mind of a sociopath and how we are not at fault. They have no conscience and think all the rest of us - with a conscience - are laughable human beings. This book may help your DIL cope with the failure of this relationship. Sociopaths don't change, sad to say, so you must determine how to deal with that fact.
Good luck, Denny, keep reading this website for knowledge and strength.
Peace and hugs.
Reply #7 03/28/11 1:29pm
Den, our estrangement has been over 16 months now. Our son who had his father be his best man at his wedding, was the perfect child, we never even had a cross word from this child, so sweet and kind and thoughtful. He was the one we believed we could always count on no matter what. Ha! when he met one time with his dad this past year, he was mean, cruel, called him every name, then left saying 'Im done with you dude!" My husband took it, he is not the kind of man who would normally take that abuse, but he did. His heart is broken and so was mine. But we have decided as navigating said, to no longer participate in this 'dance'. We all have much to thankful for, we have to step out of this estrangement long enough to find you still have great worth to many! Do you have other children? Take care, Kathy
Reply #8 03/28/11 2:03pm
Kathy, I so identify with what you said about your son... we thought we could count on our daughter. It wasn't even on my radar that she could do such a thing. Had never heard of estrangement so when she didn't return calls and emails, we thought there must be something wrong, didn't even occur to us that she was ignoring us on purpose!! Never heard of adult kids doing such a thing before that so we were totally blindsided. I felt like I was in Nazi Germany or something when my daughter called the police on me---knowing full well we were there for HER sake.....like she wanted to hurt me, sorta thow me to the wolves--didn't care what would happen to me, hubby, my sister...the whole family really.
I feel so sorry for your hubby too.......can't imagine taking that kind of thing from this kid you have poured heart in soul into........ I have leared so much from being here, I know now I would never ever take any berating from her, but my daughter was a coward, and had the police do it, she lied to them and said we were "harrassing her" by being there and calling (ONCE A WEEK IS ALL WE DID)....
I loved what NAVIGATING said also, not going to do this "dance" with her.....I'm movin on......still working thru the grief and stress of it all..........really helps to keep telling my story over and over and getting it all it....thanks for reading it again and again......venting is my therapy and the only way I can cope with any of it. Thanks for letting me ramble.. hugs to you all...we don't deserve to be treated this way.....
Reply #9 03/28/11 2:07pm
Hi DennyMo, I don't have grandchildren (that I no of) so I'm not sure I can give you any advise. It must be heartbreaking for Grandparents whose EC's hold the grandkids as some kind of ransom to control their parents. I would explain to your son that he is only neglecting his child from your love and affection. Let him know you will miss seeing your GD and leave the ball in his court. I wouldn't give him the power to tell you who you can talk to your not. Good luck.
Reply #10 03/28/11 4:15pm
Hi DennyMo, Welcome to the group! We are all really sorry you are in this no win situation with your son. We all understand what that does to our hearts, bodies and spirits. Having dealt with your ES all these years you have probably already concluded that there isn't anything you can do to fix him. Even so, REMIND yourself of that often!!! Getting through estrangement is all about accepting the truth, as ugly as it gets, it is still the truth.
It doesn't really surprise me that ES has tried to "end around" you with your family that he previously ignored.
We see that alot here, Abusers first agenda is to isolate their victims from any support system they have.
This is what your son is attempting, and it is all about control and abuse. Some of your family may fall for
his lies and crocodile tears. You should probably be prepared for that, just another part of the "Dance".
Unfortunately these sociopaths can be very charming and are usually very smart, as in devious. I know from experience, we have a total sociopath for a DIL, and she alone has destroyed our family, both sons are estranged from us and each other because of her, and I know beyond a shadow of any doubt that she did everything on purpose, she too likes to hurt others, revels in their pain and confusion. Sick SIck Sick!
I suggest you stay as far away from him as you can, any reaction you show him will be twisted into something he will use to his advantage to strike out at you again and again. So Sorry, just being honest and speaking from personal experience.
If you have a good relationship with your ex-DIL, you have every right to support her in anyway you want to and are able. That is your decision to make, and ES can't take that from you. I think offering your home to her and your granddaughter is a very caring and responsible thing to do. I also think you know what ED will do next, and you will need to prepare ahead of time for his full fury. And I would also cautiion you that DIL may not be prepared to put herself in ES path again, so don't take it personal if she declines should you offer her a home.
It is wonderful that she will work with you and allow you to see granddaughter. That is a huge plus in your favor, one many of us here would love to have in our lives. I have not seen my 18 month old grandson in over a year now. I don't even feel like grandmother, as I was only allowed to see him and hold a few times after he was born. It is the one "unforgivable" cruelty for me. Other DIL will have to live with decision, and without any trust or bonds with me from now on. I value myself too much to allow her to use me or grandson like a crazy yoyo. Sometimes all we can do is walk away with as much dignity and grace as we can muster.
I see everyone has chimed in, and you have gotten lots of great advice and support. We are all about taking care of each, and we are glad you are here with us now. No one should have to go through this alone.
Sorry so long again, got on a roll.....Hugs to everyone D.
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