Sex / Pornography Addiction Support Group

I have to go to work here in a few minutes, but if it is okay, I will come back to this. LoriLou....the forgiveness thing...I have an alternative. It may be simply a play on words to help me understand it...but in another place, I explain how it is that I feel. I am not sure feeling it is a thing that I do either. I have head knowledge and heart knowledge, and I am not sure that the issue is completed in me yet. I promise to explain this when I have time to cut and paste some things that I have worked through in my favorite place on this planet....my place in a DS group called Resurrection After Rape. It is where we work on the book together, and it is where I found a softness for that wounded child that I have held apart from me for so many years, blaming her actions for my life.

My therapist is trying desperately to help me learn to nurture myself. Just this week he had me get a Teddy Bear. I never owned one. It is all in his plan to help me learn to love her as I do my own child.

Oh, there is an exercise in RAR -- (the book...we call it that for short). It is a journal assignment to help us find tenderness toward our selves that we hold blame for. It is a "letter to the day before". It is meant to be written to yourself...saying all the things you wish you had known...on the day before your rape. I believe it would work for any trauma in which we end up accepting un-owned blame or guilt. I will share mine here if you'd like me to. It is published in the book and it was the first time in my life I had ever spoken to 'her'.

I will get back to this as soon as I can. Darn work....always gets in the way, lol!

You are very right. A few things that you said are very important to all of us.

First, forgiveness enables reconciliation, and there are situations where reconciliation is not the right thing to do. in the case of a rapist., for example, however, justice wich will make us feel better is not the complete answer because it does not change OUR HEARTS.

There is a theraputic method where victims face OTHER rapists not their own, in order to resolve forgiveness. The healing effect of having a man who is a rapist, sincerely appologize on behalf of your abusers alows that breakthrough that you seek.

I took a 32 week class on sexual and relational brokenness, and during two diffreent nights one of the male leaders read an appology to the wonem in the room. In tears he apploogized on behalf of men for objectification, sexual abuse, lack of spiritual leadership, poor fathering, rape, and a host of other things. I beleive this was a freeing moment for women in the room.

Unfortunately, the woman whos responsibility it was to appologize to the men for their disrespect, lack of compassion, judgement, and harshness, and other things, added excuses like "even though we cant help ourselves" , and "weather it is deserved or not"

I believe that I brought my own anger to that situation, and did not receive the healing that appology was offering to heart because of my own hard heart, but I also believe that if she had been hunble in it, it would have made the healing and forgiveness much easier.

That is the point isnt it. We still have to forgive, and eventually we still have to let God soften our hearts, and the feelings of compassion and forgiveness are not the goal, but a result of God softening our hearts, and the proper appology and contrition from those who wound us weakens breaks the chains of unforgiveness making it much easier to forgive...and the forgiveness does not need to lead to reconciliation, and in some cases should not.

I would love the opoortunity to face the 8th grader that raped me. Ad some day I plan to face the guy who seduced me when I was 18. But that is because in my journey of recovery, I know what they need, how this whole thing works, and have something to offer them if they will take it. I know I may face hardened hearts in that situation, but God has the power to instantly soften that, and how powerful would it be for me, their victim to let then know that I have forgiven them. Who knows, it might be the moment God uses to save them. Becuase I will surely be discussing Jesus in those conversations.

Now what have I not forgiven? My wife. I often feel like she does not care about me. Sometimes because of my insecurities, sometimes because of her brokenness. But she has never appologized. She came close by saying "It is sad that you have never gotten to experience an orgasm orally like I do all the time." but she did not mean it.

Her lack of humility, affects me by making it much harder to forgive her for her wrongs. (And of course my sin makes it much harder for her to be humble in the face of the one who hurt her so badly) But here I am trapped in my addictive anger at her because I am trapped not because she will not appologize, but noone here could ever say that her sincere appology would not make it MUCH easier for me to process that forgiveness.and her lack thereove makes it much harder.

I can hear it now, "What has she done that needs forgiveness?" That is my point exactly. This is not humility, she is not perfect, and to sugfest that by comparison to my sin she is, is not humility. But that is where we are, so be it.

So, Lorilou, consider your response if your mother wrote you a sincere humble letter, specifically asking your forgiveness for her abuse, no excuses, no rationals like, "I was abused myself" none of that 100% humility. No request or expectations of reconciliation, not asking for anythnig. Wouldn't that make it easier for you to heal and feel that forgiveness and compassion?

Would her being encarcerated for your abuse free any compassion for her?

Would her diying, like Bathshebas, son, allow you go get up off the floor begging God to fix this, and wash your face, and get back to your life with none of the baggage.

All of these things would make it easier for you to forgive her. But none of these things are happening, so I think this could be God teaching you the 70x7 thing, so you can understand how he felt when the blood was coming out of his forehead because he was praying so hard in Gasemine. Forgiveness is tough, in fact it is a life and death battle for your heart. And God wants our hearts, all of it, with abandon. And he will soften them. That is his job not ours. Ours is to be broken and contrite before him. He can not work with our efforts to try to forgive our abusers, our sacrificing ourselves to forgive them by the right motions. All he can work with is our brokenness. When we are truely there, THEN our sacrifices please him. Then we can have compassion, and maybe even the opportunities ot point our predators to the Cross.

I think being willing to forgive, wanting to forgive, asking God to soften our hearts so we can forgive, is right, he is the one who creats a clean heart in us, we don't do that. Psalms 51.

I am overwhelmed with how much I have fallen in love with you people. There is so much sincerity, honesty and compassion here that I can not deny God is in this place. This digital place.

Hi Mockingbird,

I think both of those ideas make a lot of sense. Several years ago I once heard Dr. Laura suggest the stuffed animal thing. I tried it but being the clown that I am it didn't work. Strangely what did work for me was God inspired through my husband after recovery he decided to stop being needless and want-less and set out to fulfill a dream I once had of having a horse again...it actually started out with my son. But anyway we now have two horses, yet there is this third horse that I like to ride when the whole family is riding. His name is Persico. He is a magnificent creature but most everyone at the ranch had given up on him saying he was crazy in the head. Even the owner's wife, an accomplished rider had almost been thrown when he rared up and tried to shake her off after she was trying to force him to back up. Well the owner, knowing I liked spirited horses let me try him. Persico moved like a dream, I was even a bit confused when the wife told me about him trying to throw her after she tried to back him up because I could get him to do the very same thing without a problem. People kept comming up to me telling me about their bad experiences with him but for some reason Persico just didn't act that way with me. Sure he was wound up with energy but that was about the worst of it. About this time the wife told me his story that he had been rescued from a brutal man who beat the crap out of him and neglected him. All of the sudden it made sense. You see I sened there was something about him that I just innatly knew I couldn't push him. I couldn't make demands and treat him like you would most horses who will try to get the upper hoof if you let them. And haveing been through so much therapy by this time I knew Persico, like me had been traumatized. Like me when people got mad or angry he would panick, shut down and his fight or flight instincts would kick in. I also knew that Persico was wicked-smart because when I did teach him something he would do it over and over again even it I didn't ask, especially if he felt he had made a mistake in something else just as if her were saying, "I know I messed up but look I can back up really well now." He wanted to please so bad that the poor creature would end up sabotaging himself sometimes if he got too excited so like me sometimes he just needed a break from all the excitement. The funny thing was we figured out that he wasn't the big chicken everybody thought he was. He was actually quite brave. The normal things that spooked most horses, Persico stood bravely up to. It was the human, abuser that he was afraid of and not much else. Whoever that guy was that abused him, took a fine horse and implanted a bunch of needless issues.

There are times that I get chocked up with emotion when it's just me and Persico. I even do silly things like take him jogging just to hang out with him. Because of our past I feel like I understand him and he understands me. And yes it was through Pesico that I stopped condeming myself for messing up sometimes when I get flustered. In fact, just like when some, know-it-all person tries to "show me how to be more firm" with him, instead of politly keeping my mouth shut and letting them irritate and freak out Persico, now I stand up for him. In this way I too have learned to stand up for myself whenever I get flooded or overloaded with emotions.

But the letter from the day before sounds wounderful. I do entend to try that.
Also, if you don't mind I may sneak observe that other site you were talking about. I may even get the nerve to order the book. Something seems to be holding me back though. Not sure.

Thanks,

Lorilou

Hi Choose,

I did in the past fantasize about my mother's apology. It's especially hard knowing she goes to church every Sunday as a prominent leader and puts on this plastic face of piety. How can she walk into the house of the Lord, without falling to her knees in shame? Its hard for me to have respect for people who follow her while she ripped poor, little, unsuspecting congregations apart with her favorite hobby...gossip. But then I am reminded of "The Screw Tape Letters" C.S. Lewis' fiction novel of a Devil teaching his minion of the subtle ways to turn his victim against the church. Well I know 'ol Screw Tape works hard on me through my mother. And yes, I know I can't let him win. So I do know I need to forgive her 70xs 7 and since she'll probably live to about 90 maybe even more.

I know I also need to repeat the affirmation "Its not about me." I think you too could benefit from that regarding those people in your life who don't ask for real forgiveness. I believe the reason you were not able to offer your pardon to that lady who was supposed to apologize was because she was not truly broken and contrite. Otherwise she would have seen the harmfulness of giving you excuses.

Take care,

Lorilou

There's a book "The Courage To Heal, A Guide To Survivors of Child Sexual Abuse" by Ellen Bass and Laura Davis. It's a workbook.

The book is or was downloadable. Go to this site: Resurrectionafterrape.org there is some free downloadable material that is written by Matt, the author of the book. On DS he is EmpoweredOKC.

I will share my letter here. It was one of the first things I wrote that gave me a sense of softness toward her, my 12-year-old self. I try not to think about her in a seperate sense...because she is me. I know that, but there are times when she feels so foreign. I see you all write about your 'addicted self' and it looked odd to me for you to make two separate pieces of the same person. But, I know what it is that you are doing...I understand it probably came from your learing about addiction, where all I have come at this from is the rape and the PTSD.

RAR is like a workbook of sorts. It has specific journaling assignments designed to provoke thought and to move us past the victim-stance to that of a survivor...and from there, on to thriving.

It does deal with our attitude toward God as we struggle to make sense of where He was during the most terrifying times in our lives. Like, when I lay there beneath them, and felt the shear, agonizing pain I was being subjected to, I silently pleaded with God to make it stop - to make it go away. make them go away. When He did not do any of those things, I decided it was because I was guilty, I had caused this -- I deserved this. It was my punishment for every evil deed I had ever done.

There was a moment during the rape...I have drawn pictures in my profile depicting these things (I was told to while I was hospitalized...in fact, my mockingbird avatar I drew just before I went into the hospital....kind of to leave a visual image of 'me')....anyway...the picture is of my hand. I was holding onto the headboard. While I did that, I had an injury that happened to my hand as I played in the yard a day or two before the rape. The wound was fresh and it had hurt me badly when it happened. I looked at that. I focused on it and used it to take my mind away. Then, when I was turned over onto my back...a tiny flicker of dust caught on the breeze and the sunlight...it caught my eye and the first time I remembered it happening that day, I dissociated. I left them, and that room, and the pain - I left it all. That was God. God did not leave me alone. He did not abandon me or allow this to happen to His child without Him suffering too. My friend describes it as God not breaking His own laws of time and space to magically appear and sweep us away to safety. He doesn't break physical laws like time...He just doesn't. So, He was there. I know he cried with me for my pain, and for my fear. I prayed another prayer He did not answer that day. I prayed He would bring me home. I prayed it in different words, but I wanted to die. I looked straight in the eyes of one of my rapists and I said, "If you are going to kill me, can you take me someplace else?" I believed I was to die that day. I was ready, but I didn't want my mother to find me that way. Not naked. Not bloody. Not used up.

I believe in God. I believe He cried for me just like He cried for Christ. I believe. Now, as for forgiveness....it isn't about retribution or justice for me. It is about the depth of what happened to me...the length of time I have lived with this...growing up with it...having to teach myself - to soothe myself...to learn what all of that meant myself. Needless to say, I made some wrong assumptions and have faound my way down wayward paths. I don't believe we forgive one second before God has fully prepared us to do so. Like faith. God gift US with faith, it is NOT a thing we grow and harvest..it is a thing He gifts us with...and we in turn use it to honor him.

I have some very deep thoughts about faith and forgiveness. I can't attest to my rightness about it...just that I think about it. I believe I have accepted what happened. I believe I have come to terms with it - sort of.

Thanks for these thoughts. This helps me work through so much, and these are fresh approaches, and fresh is always welcome.

Hi Mockingbird,

The visual you made about the speck of dust is so beautiful. I am an artist too so my mind just went into automatic seeing the floating speck as it caught a brilliant beam of light. It's amazing how powerful God can be in something so small and quiet.

Hugs,

Lorilou

The speck of dust in the light got me too. A tiny gift from God so small can keep your spirit safe. Amaizing!

I scared him. The rapist - I scared him after that, by simply doing nothing at all but to stare into his eyes as he did what he did to me. He was...they, all except the woman, were violent. He was sadistic and was doing things in an effort, I believe, to test my limits. At some point, after the speck of dust found it's way from the lace of the curtain to the sunlit breeze, my mind broke. I no longer felt the fear. I stared in his eyes - directly, and I laughed. It was kind of a crazy laugh, like I had nothing left to lose. I felt like it was okay to die then. It is the feeling of complete abandon - I literally was ready to die. People wonder how it is a person feels in those final seconds - I believe they don't 'feel'. I believe the other gift I received in those moments was the absolute absence of feelings. Most of the rest of the rape was happening around me...to me, but without my full awareness. I have used dissociation since then. It becomes the way you escape the memories...then, you find the other things that soothe you, and as you grow up and change, you realize all of it is an escape. I don't want to escape this life anymore. I want to learn to face what is left of my life with courage...and decency. I don't want to shame God with my actions. I want my sexual activity to be a thing God ordained as beautiful.

I held all this in as a secret for many years, then...it was too late for my husband to choose. He was married to me, and we had a baby boy. His character as a man would not allow him to leave me. I have since wondered was it love - or pity that held him there. I believe he loves me. I know he wishes I didn't have this to deal with all of this. I just want to bring some peace into our lives before mine is over. I don't think that is too much to ask - do you?