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Discussion:
Dalai Lama Quote on forgiveness
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One of the best ways to begin familiarizing ourselves with the virtue of patience is to reflect systematically on its benefits. It is the source of forgiveness. It has no equal in protecting our concern for others, however they behave towards us. When patience is combined with the ability to discriminate between the action and the one who does it, forgiveness arises naturally. -Dalai Lama
Posted on 07/07/10, 05:41 pm
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Reply #1 - 07/07/10  11:15pm
" Ah, so that's my issue. I haven't learned to discriminate between the action and the one who does it. I still hate them both - deeply and equally! "
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Reply #2 - 07/08/10  12:17am
" I'm working on forgiving myself for settling for less in life than I wanted and for making such poor decisions. Forgiving my ex is still really far down on the list for me. After things like learning to trust again, forgiving myself, learning to put the past behind me and keep it there, making healthy decisions for myself and my children, etc, etc. "
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Reply #3 - 07/08/10  12:50am
" Ah, yes. Hate the sin, not the sinner. VERY hard to do sometimes, especially when it comes to cheating.... cheating is a very deliberate betrayal.

I never thought of patience being a part of forgiveness.... being slow to anger may help to think logically so that a person can CHOOSE not to hate the person. Hard, hard stuff. "
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Reply #4 - 07/08/10  9:34am
" I totally get this concept of differentiating between the person and the action - or as Michelle says - hate the sin and not the sinner. Very big concept in my small town.

...but how?

Aren't your actions a product of who you are? Inside? How you think and reason and logic? Are not the actions that come from THAT directly related to who you are as a person?

I had always thought so.

Sure, I can hate the sin but love the sinner - but where does accountability stand in this? Or even personal responsibility?

Hell, I am just throwing this all out there as I see it.

Like this...I would like to rob a bank on those days when the ol' check book says I can't go shopping - even to the Dollar Mart. But my ethics and WHO I AM stop me from doing that. That's not me - so I go to work and grab some over time so I CAN go to the Dollar Mart. Because that's how I roll.

Am I making sense here?

We can try like hell to separate a person from their actions, but I kind of lean toward a person's actions speaking FOR them.

Like my EX's OW/Now wife/ called Spam by my kids as the imitation meat. HER actions directly reflect who she is, what she was/is capable of, what gives her pride (in destroying my family) and who she is now. Spammy rocks on that. She loves it. It makes her happy.

I can't love that sin or that sinner. Not liking her at all - not for having him now - but for what she is clearly capable of, as a person, as a woman, as a less than human...

Just my two cents...L~

(still not getting my updates, but I'll be sure to check back in and see what you think) "
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Reply #5 - 07/08/10  11:14am
" I tend to agree with you, L. I understand the concept of 'hate the sin, not the sinner'. I just don't believe it's always appropriate, as in the case of cheating. As mentioned before, it is a deliberate, calculated, deceitful act. It requires hours and hours of planning, lying and manipulating.

There has to be something inside of a person to be able to constantly live in that world. It has to be a part of your internal 'makeup'. It has to be a part of who you are as a person.

Cheating isn't a mistake. A cheater knows exactly what they are doing, evey time they do it. In fact, they enjoy it - repeatedly. It's not a one time transgression.

OOps, sorry, I'm starting to ramble, because this is an issue I feel very, very strongly about. Too much is destroyed behind this selfishness. It causes too much pain for too many people and there's no reason for it.

Anyway, I still hate both sin and sinner - equally (specifically in this case). However, I do forgive myself for making bad decisions and not listening too my instincts soon enough. I'll try not to do that again in the future. Hey, you live, you learn!

Peace and Love. "
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Reply #6 - 07/08/10  12:42pm
" Thanks Rositas...I would like to hear from others here.

Seems we put a pretty high premium on forgiveness and what it actually is...and how we feel about it all...

this is a great conversation.

L~ "
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Reply #7 - 07/08/10  2:14pm
" I was curious to see how people would be affected by the quote. For myself, I'm trying to forgive. I know that every situation is not the same. I was hoping that for those who are working on forgiveness it would be helpful. "
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Reply #8 - 07/08/10  2:42pm
" I have always maintained the saying Hate the Sin and not the Sinner as well. Patience in forgiving is very difficult for me. And although I do not hate my H it is very hard for me to forgive his actions (sin) especially if they continue after he apologizes.

I heard on Joyce Meyer the other day when you are having a hard time forgiving one person for their actions against you.....think about how many times Jesus has fogiven us for our repeated actions against Him. "
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Reply #9 - 07/08/10  2:44pm
" I dont believe forgiving the person who has comiited the offenses against me is necessary at all. They are repsonsible. They did it, Its not the sin (for lack of a better word) that caused me issue, it was the erson who took it upon themselves to lie, decieve, manipulate, me. The acts are just that. Acts, harmless really UNTIL perpetrated upon you by another.

I'll never forgive the ones who have caused such chaos in my life. My life no longer revolves around the chaos, and I'm content enough. =) "
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Reply #10 - 07/08/10  3:24pm
" This quote is perfect, but of course that is in theory, not in real. My mother taught me years ago that holding a grudge or hating someone in reality does no harm to the person you are holding the grudge to or hating, it only harms yourself.
For me it is easier and healthier to let go of the hate or grudge and find a way to move on. It has now been 5 weeks since DDay for me and I am in a better place then I was, mostly due to not holding a grudge or hatred and my wife has been wonderful and supportive. Not that I am not still in a tremendous pain and fighting the "movies" in my head. I still have a hard time focusing on anything or concentrating. I have not been able to forgive my wife for her actions, but I am working toward that goal. It will be easier to attain that without the hate.
Forgiveness is more for myself. It will give me peace. That is true no matter if we stay together or not. If we stay together it will be the beginning of a stronger marriage. If we seperate it will be the beginning of me being a stronger, happier and hopefully wiser person.
Thank you for posting this. "

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